Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

daf666 · 2008-09-02 17:55:37

Misfit138 wrote:

See here and here.

Thank god for that.. I was expecting to see an ArchBuntu prompt on the next magor release

cactus · 2008-09-02 20:37:41

Mr Green wrote:

Well just fitted a fan to my case side that has lights in it, a choice I made thinking a bad one!

What color are the lights?

Mikko777 · 2008-09-02 20:58:02

Anarchy (from Greek: αναρχία anarchía, "without ruler") may refer to any of the following:

* "Absence of government; a state of lawlessness due to the absence or inefficiency of the supreme power; political disorder."[1]
* "A theoretical social state in which there is no governing person or body of persons, but each individual has absolute liberty (without the implication of disorder)."[2]
* "Absence or non-recognition of authority and order in any given sphere."[3]

It should be noted that "ruler," if used in the context of the third bullet point, has no explicit connection to the term "rules." In an anarchy, as defined by the last bullet point, it is possible to have rules (laws); however, these must be agreed upon by the participants in the system, and not imposed from above by a ruler (leader, authority). Some languages, such as Norwegian[4] have two separate words for the two meanings (regel/regler meaning rules, regulations, customs, laws; and hersker meaning "the one who rules/lords", from the verb å herske).

* Without government or law

A state, free from coercive authority of any kind, is the goal of proponents of the political philosophy of anarchism (anarchists). Anarchy is distinct from omniarchy, a chaotic situation in which all rule over all, in the sense that anyone can commit aggression against any other person.[5]

B-Con · 2008-09-02 23:11:56

toofishes wrote:

People might as well start threads titled "The sky is falling!". You guys read into one tiny decision way too much. Equating "base packages are preselected" with "losing ability to choose" is absolutely ridiculous.

It's your own darned fault. As has been mentioned in other threads, Arch runs too smoothly. We users have nothing to sit and spend hours fixing and tweaking, so we idle time away over-analyzing every decision made by Arch devs and forming conspiracy theories.

Phrodo_00 · 2008-09-02 23:32:13

Damn, let's fork!...

:B

kensai · 2008-09-02 23:42:02

Mikko777 wrote:

Anarchy (from Greek: αναρχία anarchía, "without ruler") may refer to any of the following:

Our Anarhy is difined by us, that is how much we rule over every other, and that is why we are in command, hence why we want users to not have control. Also, we force them to install base because of this.

@B-con, yeah, I agree with you. Please people, leave the conspiracy theories for others. Like for example, the people that think USA filmed people on the moon.

Last edited by kensai (2008-09-02 23:44:18)

ljshap · 2008-09-03 00:53:35

neotuli wrote:

Oh shit! You got me!
This change was made explicitly to reduce your ability to choose. duh.
You see, as our userbase becomes increasingly stupid, we need to decrease their choosing ability and start doing the thinking for them. It's a rather elegant solution to a stupid problem.

Whoo ya callling stoopit?

Im only using Arch coz app-ill gives ya two manny chozes!

sand_man · 2008-09-03 02:00:15

B-Con wrote:

toofishes wrote:
People might as well start threads titled "The sky is falling!". You guys read into one tiny decision way too much. Equating "base packages are preselected" with "losing ability to choose" is absolutely ridiculous.
It's your own darned fault. As has been mentioned in other threads, Arch runs too smoothly. We users have nothing to sit and spend hours fixing and tweaking, so we idle time away over-analyzing every decision made by Arch devs and forming conspiracy theories.

That's why IRC was invented!
Idling is my favourite pastime.

Lord Illidan · 2008-09-03 05:53:18

kensai wrote:

Mikko777 wrote:
Anarchy (from Greek: αναρχία anarchía, "without ruler") may refer to any of the following:
Our Anarhy is difined by us, that is how much we rule over every other, and that is why we are in command, hence why we want users to not have control. Also, we force them to install base because of this.
@B-con, yeah, I agree with you. Please people, leave the conspiracy theories for others. Like for example, the people that think USA filmed people on the moon.

But...they did...:P

Cosay · 2008-09-03 13:58:45

When I installed 2008-06 for the first time, this was the first thing I noticed. While I didn't like it, I also didn't want to complain to an open source developer who is trying his best to do what he thinks is right for Arch.

For the record, however, I do hope the previous installer functionality returns.

Mr.Elendig · 2008-09-03 13:58:56

neotuli wrote:

Oh shit! You got me!
This change was made explicitly to reduce your ability to choose. duh.
You see, as our userbase becomes increasingly stupid, we need to decrease their choosing ability and start doing the thinking for them. It's a rather elegant solution to a stupid problem.

Sad as it is, that seems to be true if the userbase that uses #archlinux @ freenode is any indication >_>

daf666 · 2008-09-03 15:16:37

@kensai: but its un-archie

@neotuli: all your base are belong to us

@all: where is your god now?!

archdave · 2008-09-11 07:49:35

sheesh:
pacman -R packagename
pacman -S packagename

problems solved

Last edited by archdave (2008-09-11 07:49:49)

Cosay · 2008-09-11 12:18:07

Not solved. That mentality is why I have issues with Mac OS X and Windows.

jb · 2008-09-11 12:58:37

You're right:

pacman -Rnc packagename
pacman -S packagename

now the problem's been solved.

neotuli · 2008-09-11 16:27:50

Cosay wrote:

Not solved. That mentality is why I have issues with Mac OS X and Windows.

And that mentality is why I have issues with this forum. For fuck's sake. Every time someone makes a change of any kind nowadays, rather than wondering if there were technical merits or constraints, everyone jumps to conclusions about how xyz is taking their freedom away and infringing on their pseudo rights as citizens of the internet.

I don't get it, guys.

Dusty · 2008-09-11 16:45:01

neotuli wrote:

I don't get it, guys.

Its quite simple, Simo: You put all this work into Arch, right? And you don't get any payback for that, see? So that means you owe the world for the work you put in. Therefore it is your debt to pay off by doing more work to please people. Do you understand? What you really should do is maintain at least three different installers, one that does what you want, one that does it the way other people want it, and one that does it the way I think it should be done.

Of course, the last one is of the utmost importance, otherwise I might run out of the colour green, and without green I cannot function.

Dusty

btartsa · 2008-09-11 17:22:43

I really wish the forum mods could put the iron fist on and close so many of these damn threads. But I suppose the logic is that *something good" will arise from them? Personally I would rather see "stupid" questions pop up, get solved and disappear than pointless conversations drag on and on.

@neotuli: agreed 100%
@dusty:agreed 100%
@everyone else: Thanks Archers!

And with that I will take my leave from this thread.

X/ax · 2008-09-11 18:41:32

I actually think we should be more anarchists like above description, just make sure the community runs.
This question was not asked because it came well to the community, but because one people wanted to know something (and complain about it)

I vote -1, since that was not at all with the intention to enhance the community in any way! ^^

@Dusty: That's how the world runs. Give people a finger, and they take an arm...

Misfit138 · 2008-09-11 19:44:10

btartsa wrote:

I really wish the forum mods could put the iron fist on and close so many of these damn threads. .

Yeah, and when the acrid, riotous mob is out for blood due to 'censorship', I'll be pointing at you.

Looking over this thread, it seems that the community is largely self-moderating. The overwhelming majority of members understand the Arch Way and have tried to express (in different ways) the illegitimacy of the concept of our freedom of choice being taken away.

kensai · 2008-09-11 19:49:03

Misfit138 wrote:

Yeah, and when the acrid, riotous mob is out for blood due to 'censorship', I'll be pointing at you.

Looking over this thread, it seems that the community is largely self-moderating. The overwhelming majority of members understand the Arch Way and have tried to express (in different ways) the illegitimacy of the concept of our freedom of choice being taken away.

Did you just changed your avatar again? Man, what's up with personality, how I'm I supposed to make an image of your internet persona?

X/ax · 2008-09-11 20:00:38

Misfit138 wrote:

btartsa wrote:
I really wish the forum mods could put the iron fist on and close so many of these damn threads. .
Yeah, and when the acrid, riotous mob is out for blood due to 'censorship', I'll be pointing at you.

Looking over this thread, it seems that the community is largely self-moderating. The overwhelming majority of members understand the Arch Way and have tried to express (in different ways) the illegitimacy of the concept of our freedom of choice being taken away.

I think it's more than normal that the community corrects itself. It's healthy, and produces the most positive results.
If you compare this community to most of the communities out there, you'll soon see that we're actually quite mature on many situations. There's always some exceptions (including myself at the right time)

However, on the other side, if we were to always agree and let things go saying: "Ah, don't worry, it'll be fine", we'll end up using an os we don't like anymore.
Opinions should be expressed...

btartsa · 2008-09-11 20:18:58

OK I'll bite. Perhaps I was not clear when I stated ""I wish the forum mods COULD..." but of course we all know they can't for the above stated reasons. The next line was in context with that as well, but was left out of the quotes. I guess this is the grey area between moderation and censorship. Ugly! Now lets argue about Gentoo being faster than Arch again....blahhhh! Bring on the acrid riotous mob!

X/ax · 2008-09-11 20:26:45

Gentoo isn't faster than arch... -.-" (No real argument though )

PS: It's another thread. This thread is about the ability to chose...

Last edited by X/ax (2008-09-11 20:28:06)

Allan · 2008-09-12 00:27:57

kensai wrote:

Misfit138 wrote:
Yeah, and when the acrid, riotous mob is out for blood due to 'censorship', I'll be pointing at you.

Looking over this thread, it seems that the community is largely self-moderating. The overwhelming majority of members understand the Arch Way and have tried to express (in different ways) the illegitimacy of the concept of our freedom of choice being taken away.
Did you just changed your avatar again? Man, what's up with personality, how I'm I supposed to make an image of your internet persona?

I've already told him to stop that!

Arch Linux

#26 2008-09-02 17:55:37

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#27 2008-09-02 20:37:41

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#28 2008-09-02 20:58:02

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#29 2008-09-02 23:11:56

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#30 2008-09-02 23:32:13

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#31 2008-09-02 23:42:02

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#32 2008-09-03 00:53:35

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#33 2008-09-03 02:00:15

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#34 2008-09-03 05:53:18

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#35 2008-09-03 13:58:45

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#36 2008-09-03 13:58:56

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#37 2008-09-03 15:16:37

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#38 2008-09-11 07:49:35

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#39 2008-09-11 12:18:07

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#40 2008-09-11 12:58:37

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#41 2008-09-11 16:27:50

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#42 2008-09-11 16:45:01

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#43 2008-09-11 17:22:43

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#44 2008-09-11 18:41:32

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#45 2008-09-11 19:44:10

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#46 2008-09-11 19:49:03

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#47 2008-09-11 20:00:38

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#48 2008-09-11 20:18:58

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#49 2008-09-11 20:26:45

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

#50 2008-09-12 00:27:57

Re: Are we losing are ability to choose with Arch?

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