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#1 2005-05-20 11:12:34

dtw
Forum Fellow
From: UK
Registered: 2004-08-03
Posts: 4,439
Website

How to spot a newbie post!

First, we were all newbies once, second some of us still do these things, third if you take this thread too seriously I'll have rasat ban you  tongue

· Uses a single word, usually "help" as a thread title
· Describes self as a newbie or worse as a n00b, possibly in an attempt to excuse self from not having read any of the documents and certainly in an attempt to avoid getting a hard time from respondents by admitting their faults but actually having the opposite effect by demonstarting qualities that expereinced users find contemptable
· Combination of 1 and 2 - n00b needs help! (pass the shotgun)
· Given 2. poster still exhibits a sense of pride in being the bane of other linux users lives
· Will begin post by saying how great the distro they are using is even tho it's clear in most cases that they aren't really in a position to have any opinion
· hearteningly, much of the time the actual problem they are posting about isn't spectacularly easy to fix
· in the face of all the evidence proclaims to have read the manual and when confronted with the section of the manual that they have read that solves their problem never posts again
· when bollocked for asking questions in a stupid fashion is reluctant to post again and feels as if they have been treated unfairly


on #IRC it's a differnet world - meet the scary newbie

· will lose patience if the person helping them spends anymore than about ten seconds talking to anyone else about a side issue
· asks rhetorical questions that appear to be addressed to no-one in particular and serve absolutely no purpose - e.g. "why can't i get mpd to work?"
· is hesitant to follow the advice of people they are asking for help - because it seems like it is not what they want to do, failing to see the difference between what they need to do and what they want to do - i.e. general confusion of goal and process
· becomes hostile if they can't see the relevance of what is being suggested
· having been told to try things fails to acknowledge if they did try it and/or how it turned out when they did
· leaves the board without saying if they solved the problem or not


Conclusion

It's not the problems you have or your lack of understanding that makes you a newbie, it's how you act towards/within the community and the actions you take to address those problems

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#2 2005-05-20 13:05:54

Kern
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2005-02-09
Posts: 464

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

Nice one Dibble smile

Also in good humour :

Newb (IRC) assumes that because names exist in the right hand pane that ppl there are experienced in all matters Arch, and are actually sitting watching text roll by eager to help at a moments notice. therefore  point 7

7. Newb threatens to ditch Arch and move on to <other distro> as : no one wants to help here : <other distro>  chans / forums are friendlier : ppl just ignore Newbs/Me  here .

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#3 2005-05-20 14:58:08

phrakture
Arch Overlord
From: behind you
Registered: 2003-10-29
Posts: 7,879
Website

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

I personally think the biggest glaring error that newbies make is asking for help on some obscure issue, when there's a better way to do it.  For instance:

"Hey, does anyone have a list of mirrors so I can download packages to use with pacman?" <-- didn't get past "pacman -A" in the manual

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#4 2005-05-20 16:45:28

i3839
Member
Registered: 2004-02-04
Posts: 1,185

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

The annoying newbies aren't that much a problem, it's easy to ignore them. The hard ones are those that actually behave nice and all, but are too unhelpful in solving their problem, driving the one wanting to help them crazy. Two hours later they finally do the thing you've said as first and that solves the problem...

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#5 2005-05-20 20:19:57

soloport
Member
Registered: 2005-03-01
Posts: 442

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

Nice one, dibble!

There should be two words for the "new guy".  The differences are there.  A true n00b:
1) Opens up the dialogue with an open-ended statement or question, as if to say, "Go ahead, ask me some questions, like [spoken with a gentle sigh in the voice] 'Oh... Your having a bad, bad day?  Here... Let me make it all go away for you.  Where does it hurt?'"
2) Is like a con artist -- they get other people to do their digging and drudge-work
3) They just won't do any work unless it requires the least possible amount of effort -- if there's even one ounce of digging to do, they won't
4) They use excuses to put off or for refusing to do the work -- including and especially the excuse "I'm a poor, helpless little n00b...  Pitty me, will ya? Friend?"
5) They are life-time-n00bs.  You'll find their posts on other forums with the same damn questions, often posted within the same ten minutes!  Yes, they are mutithreading resource wasters!

A true newbie:
1) Bothers to be as speciffic about what happened, what's installed, model numbers, serial numbers, MAC addresses (ok, I'm exagerating, here), custom settings, log entries, etc., etc. before asking for help
2) You can tell they've given the problem their all and have trully run into a brick wall and are practically hoping others have, as well, so they can at least restore some semblance of sanity by assuring themselves "Well, geez, it was hardware, after all -- I'm NOT losing my mind."
3) They try everything suggested. And when things work, they come back with the usual small, but always meningfull reward: They let you know it worked.  (Sometimes with thanks.)
4) They appologize when they've wasted your time -- because they went off on a stupid tangent instead of relaxing and thinking things through, one last time.  They never, ever blow up because you didn't bother to drop everything to come to their rescue.
5) They are very observant.  They know exactly where the best threads are and who is the expert on which subjects.  They never shotgun requests for help -- wasting entire continents worth of time.

Me thinks everyone is perpetually new to the ever-changing tech landscape.  But some of us give 110% and some give 10%.

I say:  Help keep Arch n00b-free.  Make people WORK for their information!

[Edit] Oh.  Was I ranting a bit?  Oh.  I *was* ranting, wasn't I.  A bit... [puts the microphone down]

[Edit] Hey, on the other hand, n00b questions can be convenient.  Lets other people ask the real dumb questions I wish I had the guts to ask.  (I'm quite fire-phobic )  :oops:

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#6 2005-05-20 21:14:30

i3839
Member
Registered: 2004-02-04
Posts: 1,185

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

soloport wrote:

when things work, they come back with the usual small, but always meningfull reward: They let you know it worked.  (Sometimes with thanks.)

Without this I wouldn't be here at all, it is the only thing which keeps me helping people.

Hard to understand that people don't even bother telling that their problem is fixed, while you're spending free time helping them. It's also annoying for the rare that searched the forum and then don't know if the provided fix helps or not.

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#7 2005-05-20 23:25:48

Kern
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2005-02-09
Posts: 464

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

Hard to understand that people don't even bother telling that their problem is fixed

had a request for a distro copy in a local LUG.
asked a close friend if he had the Legacy release of this distro and he had.
asked if he would post it to said Lug resident.
He drove it there, posted thro letterbox. 30 mile drive - ish.

no reply. no thanks. no post in forum. nothing. can only assume the requester died or the PC blew up.

we keep helping.

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#8 2005-05-21 03:08:27

dtw
Forum Fellow
From: UK
Registered: 2004-08-03
Posts: 4,439
Website

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

THAT SUCKS!

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#9 2005-05-21 03:17:37

johnisevil
Member
From: Hamilton, ON Canada
Registered: 2003-08-07
Posts: 221
Website

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

Also, a newbie post could look like this: "HI PLZ HELP!!! HOW DO I COMPIEL A CUSTOM KERNEL LOLROFLASL???"

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#10 2005-06-03 00:17:18

deficite
Member
From: Augusta, GA
Registered: 2005-06-02
Posts: 693

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

It's always great when newbies come in and tell the developers what they did wrong in designing the distro ten minutes before making the post "My comp won't stat up! It says somethin liek VFS: couldn't boot root (roflolmao* that rimes, hehe); i think Your distro needs to be more newbie friendly because for people liek me who dont read teh manual""

I'm just waiting for some newbie to come in asking why he can't find RPM anywhere  lol

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#11 2005-06-03 00:29:44

kcy29581
Member
From: CA
Registered: 2004-12-23
Posts: 231

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

umm...mr deficite.. I have my fedora core 4 beta version "DO_NOT_TOUCH_EVER!" cd's from bearshare but I can't seem to get the rpm's to work. where are they on Archie?

oh and I'm a newbie and Micro$hit suxxors lottsa!!! (newbie attemp to gain "respect".. maybe they think they're talking to 50 cent?)


There is no spoon in Arch...

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#12 2005-06-03 01:01:05

deficite
Member
From: Augusta, GA
Registered: 2005-06-02
Posts: 693

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

lol

*Gives a smack to kcy29581's face and wonders when the next version of Linspire comes out

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#13 2005-06-03 01:07:03

kcy29581
Member
From: CA
Registered: 2004-12-23
Posts: 231

Re: How to spot a newbie post!

deficite wrote:

lol

*Gives a smack to kcy29581's face and wonders when the next version of Linspire comes out

yep, if I really spoke like that, I'd definately need linspire and shut up...


There is no spoon in Arch...

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