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#1 2012-10-23 11:59:04

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

I need a governor that would run on battery, but would be less strict with awarding high frequencies than 'powersave' (which doesn't allow at all) but at the same time more strict than ondemand. This is for when I watch HQ movies on the go. SMPlayer tends to lag if the frequency is at the lowest setting and video is very high res.

What could I use?


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#2 2012-10-23 12:05:04

nierro
Member
From: Milan, Italy
Registered: 2011-09-02
Posts: 807

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

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#3 2012-10-23 12:05:39

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

userspace governor and manually pick the lowest frequency that still allows fluid video playback. I'm interested to know whether you'll actually get any powersaving from that.

@niero: Using the conservative governor is bad advice. It was made for buggy old AMD processors, and shouldn't be used except on those exact processors, because on other processors it'll always perform worse than ondemand.

Last edited by Gusar (2012-10-23 12:10:26)

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#4 2012-10-23 12:18:08

brain0
Developer
From: Aachen - Germany
Registered: 2005-01-03
Posts: 1,382

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Read this and be happy: http://mjg59.livejournal.com/88608.html

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#5 2012-10-23 12:39:17

nierro
Member
From: Milan, Italy
Registered: 2011-09-02
Posts: 807

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Well you can edit it as you wish.
So i don't see any problem. Just pick it, and change default values to fit your needs.

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#6 2012-10-23 12:56:20

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

nierro wrote:

Well you can edit it as you wish.
So i don't see any problem. Just pick it, and change default values to fit your needs.

You'll still be worse off than with ondemand. Follow the link brain0 provided, read the article and the comments. Ondemand is tweakable too, btw. But I don't think you (or I, for that matter) are smarter than those who set the defaults.

Last edited by Gusar (2012-10-23 12:57:59)

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#7 2012-10-23 12:58:13

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

nierro wrote:

Well you can edit it as you wish.
So i don't see any problem. Just pick it, and change default values to fit your needs.

I have no /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpufreq/conservative/
I only have /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpufreq/ondemand/

brain0 wrote:

Counterintuitively, that means switching to the highest voltage and frequency, executing the code and then dropping back into the idle state. By going faster, we save power[3].

Except it has no application when I want to watch a movie. Movie will not finish sooner if the CPU clock is higher.

Last edited by Lockheed (2012-10-23 13:01:55)


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#8 2012-10-23 13:01:43

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

I have no /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpufreq/conservative/

Load the appropriate module. Or, much better, read that link and stay with ondemand. Or possibly try my suggestion with the userspace governor. Though I doubt it'll have the desired effect.

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#9 2012-10-23 13:03:08

TigTex
Member
From: Portugal
Registered: 2008-06-19
Posts: 301

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Probably all you need is to use the conservative cpu governor. It will try to keep de cpu frequency as low as possible resulting in better powersavings compared with "ondemand" but much less performance loss when compared with "powersave".
Remember that using anything diferent than "performance" has an impact on system performance, but at the same time, never use the "performance" governor on a laptop, it will cause extra heat that might cause some damage.


.::. TigTex @ Portugal .::.

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#10 2012-10-23 13:08:51

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

[boycotting manual input of most basic 'code' functions until forum admins who are currently being unreasonable add a button for it which they can easily do]
$ sudo modprobe cpufreq_userspace
[sudo] password for juha:
FATAL: Module cpufreq_userspace not found.
[/boycotting manual input of most basic 'code' functions until forum admins who are currently being unreasonable add a button for it which they can easily do]

The same goes for conservative.


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#11 2012-10-23 13:38:39

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

TigTex wrote:

Probably all you need is to use the conservative cpu governor. It will try to keep de cpu frequency as low as possible resulting in better powersavings compared with "ondemand" but much less performance loss when compared with "powersave".

No it won't. Read that link.

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#12 2012-10-23 13:44:22

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Gusar wrote:
TigTex wrote:

Probably all you need is to use the conservative cpu governor. It will try to keep de cpu frequency as low as possible resulting in better powersavings compared with "ondemand" but much less performance loss when compared with "powersave".

No it won't. Read that link.

That link ignores situations in which a CPU-intensive process will run equal length of time regardless of CPU clock. Limiting the clock in such situation is fully justified and author of that post missed that completely.

Last edited by Lockheed (2012-10-23 13:46:06)


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#13 2012-10-23 13:52:32

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

That link ignores situations in which a CPU-intensive process will run equal length of time regardless of CPU clock.

There's pretty much just one such case - playing a game with vsync off. Everything else will give plenty of opportunity for the CPU to idle.

Last edited by Gusar (2012-10-23 13:54:39)

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#14 2012-10-23 13:55:03

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Gusar wrote:
Lockheed wrote:

That link ignores situations in which a CPU-intensive process will run equal length of time regardless of CPU clock.

There's pretty much just one such case - a game running with vsync off. And possibly video encoding. That's it.

Oh boy, Could you be more wrong?
Just form the top of my head:
- watching a movie
- running any program which only 'thinks' it needs all the CPU juice it can get while idling, while but it doesn't (and there is plenty)


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#15 2012-10-23 13:59:38

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

- watching a movie

Wrong. A movie has a fixed number of frames per second to decode. Between decoding each frame (and possibly even between each stage of the decoding process within the frame) the CPU can idle.

Lockheed wrote:

- running any program which only 'thinks' it needs all the CPU juice it can get while idling, while but it doesn't (and there is plenty)

I very, very much doubt in the "there is plenty" statement. Provide a few examples.

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#16 2012-10-23 14:05:03

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Gusar wrote:

Wrong. A movie has a fixed number of frames per second to decode. Between decoding each frame (and possibly even between each stage of the decoding process within the frame) the CPU can idle.

Wrong. A HQ movie will run my cpu at 2.1Ghz even if 1.6Ghz is sufficient for fluent playback.

Gusar wrote:

I very, very much doubt in the "there is plenty" statement. Provide a few examples.

Lol. I don't care if you doubt it. It's just the case on my system. Running programs inside Virtual machines and running some Wine programs open the list.


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#17 2012-10-23 14:33:46

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

Wrong. A HQ movie will run my cpu at 2.1Ghz even if 1.6Ghz is sufficient for fluent playback.

How exactly did you determine that? I hope you're aware that freq changes happen in millisecond intervals. So, for example, looking at a desktop widget (like conky) won't do.

Lockheed wrote:

Lol. I don't care if you doubt it. It's just the case on my system. Running programs inside Virtual machines and running some Wine programs open the list.

Why lol, instead of providing actual examples that would give merit to your statement?

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#18 2012-10-23 14:43:09

Lockheed
Member
Registered: 2010-03-16
Posts: 1,429

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Gusar wrote:

How exactly did you determine that? I hope you're aware that freq changes happen in millisecond intervals. So, for example, looking at a desktop widget (like conky) won't do.

I just told you how. I run cpu at 1.6Ghz and movie plays fine, but if I run ondemand, the movie keeps cpu at 2.1ghz throughout playback. I have CPU load over time, so I know it runs at 100%.

Gusar wrote:

Why lol, instead of providing actual examples that would give merit to your statement?

I did both - even better.


Laptop: ThinkPad W500, C2D P9500, 8GB, Radeon RV635 (HD3650), Arch | Server/fw: Zotac AQ01, A4-5000 Kabini, 4GB, Arch/pfSense VM

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#19 2012-10-23 15:16:02

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

I just told you how. I run cpu at 1.6Ghz and movie plays fine, but if I run ondemand, the movie keeps cpu at 2.1ghz throughout playback. I have CPU load over time, so I know it runs at 100%.

What exactly does "I have CPU load over time" mean? You're being vague again. The only app I know that shows how long each state was used is powertop, did you check that? I just did, playing a h264 video (not HD though, but SD) on my Core i3, it shows highest freq at around 50%

Lockheed wrote:

I did both - even better.

"Running some programs" is not *actual examples*. Actual examples would be replacing "some" with a list of those programs.

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#20 2012-10-23 16:42:43

jasonwryan
Forum & Wiki Admin
From: .nz
Registered: 2009-05-09
Posts: 18,551
Website

Re: Mixed ondemand-powersave governor

Lockheed wrote:

boycotting manual input of most basic 'code' functions until forum admins who are currently being unreasonable add a button for it which they can easily do

mod response wrote:

boycotting Lockheed for not respecting staff -- or the other members of the community with repeated help vampirism


Closing


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