You are not logged in.

#1 2013-12-10 22:04:17

SteveDeFacto
Member
Registered: 2013-08-16
Posts: 158

Emacs as an operating system?

Currently using Awesome WM and it works pretty well for what I need. However, I have read several posts where people say, "Emacs is the best operating system!" Now having very little knowledge about Emacs it is difficult to tell if they are speaking literally or figuratively. So my question is can Emacs serve as a window manager/operation system or is it merely a highly configurable text editor that runs within a window?

Offline

#2 2013-12-10 22:07:07

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

It is a joke.  The full joke is that emacs is a fine operating system in need of a good editor.    It is (a lot) more than merely a highly configurable text editor that runs within a window.  It is not a window manager or operating system.

Google "editor wars"


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#4 2013-12-10 22:25:52

Xyne
Administrator/PM
Registered: 2008-08-03
Posts: 6,963
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

ewaller wrote:

It is a joke.  The full joke is that emacs is a fine operating system in need of a good editor.    It is (a lot) more than merely a highly configurable text editor that runs within a window.  It is not a window manager or operating system.

Google "editor wars"

hmm

That was a golden opportunity to make the joke in a completely natural way.  Sometimes you're too helpful. I wonder if you can even understand the willpower it took to resist the temptation to ninja-edit your post.


My Arch Linux StuffForum EtiquetteCommunity Ethos - Arch is not for everyone

Offline

#5 2013-12-11 13:54:23

SteveDeFacto
Member
Registered: 2013-08-16
Posts: 158

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Xyne wrote:
ewaller wrote:

It is a joke.  The full joke is that emacs is a fine operating system in need of a good editor.    It is (a lot) more than merely a highly configurable text editor that runs within a window.  It is not a window manager or operating system.

Google "editor wars"

hmm

That was a golden opportunity to make the joke in a completely natural way.  Sometimes you're too helpful. I wonder if you can even understand the willpower it took to resist the temptation to ninja-edit your post.

In this situation I can see the humor in misinformation but knowing me I would have spent weeks trying to learn/configure emacs to be my new operation system only to find out it was a joke. I appreciate ewaller's helpfulness and you not ninja editing his post. lol

Offline

#6 2013-12-11 17:43:13

Xyne
Administrator/PM
Registered: 2008-08-03
Posts: 6,963
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

I wouldn't have let the misunderstanding persist. Besides, the full joke itself is fairly obvious given that anyone who knows anything about Emacs knows that it is (allegedly) a text editor. I just think it would have been hilarious to actually use that line.

Incidentally, the finger dexterity required to use Emacs as a full OS would be better spent touring the world as a piano virtuoso.


My Arch Linux StuffForum EtiquetteCommunity Ethos - Arch is not for everyone

Offline

#7 2013-12-11 18:19:36

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Xyne wrote:

... the full joke itself is fairly obvious given that anyone who knows anything about Emacs knows that it is (allegedly) a text editor.

Hey!


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#8 2013-12-11 18:31:50

drcouzelis
Member
From: Connecticut, USA
Registered: 2009-11-09
Posts: 4,092
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Since this has been [SOLVED] (EMACS is a text editor), I'm curious, what's the most impressive thing you know of that a person can do in EMACS that one wouldn't expect from a text editor?

I know almost nothing about EMACS, but I know you can play Tetris in it... smile

Last edited by drcouzelis (2013-12-11 18:32:31)

Offline

#9 2013-12-11 18:35:49

jasonwryan
Anarchist
From: .nz
Registered: 2009-05-09
Posts: 30,424
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

I know that you can use it as a web browser and jabber/identica/twitter client which means that it has more functionality than a chromebook. So technically, it is an OS... smile


Arch + dwm   •   Mercurial repos  •   Surfraw

Registered Linux User #482438

Offline

#10 2013-12-11 18:42:06

drcouzelis
Member
From: Connecticut, USA
Registered: 2009-11-09
Posts: 4,092
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

jasonwryan wrote:

it has more functionality than a chromebook.

EMACSBOOK: "All the power of 1976 in the palm of your hand!"

Offline

#11 2013-12-11 18:54:26

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Everything Jason said + Integrated email.  Integrated GPG and key management. MPD client. RPN calculator. Fully integrated with version management systems (git, hg). Python editor with dynamic introspection through an active Python session.  Fully integrated with gdb.  Fully integrated with GNU autotools build system, Built in games.  Hex editor.  Extendible through the built in Lisp, or using libraries, extensible using Python scripts (and others, I imagine)


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#12 2013-12-11 19:06:49

Jellicent
Member
From: Berlin
Registered: 2013-09-13
Posts: 189

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

drcouzelis wrote:

Since this has been [SOLVED] (EMACS is a text editor), I'm curious, what's the most impressive thing you know of that a person can do in EMACS that one wouldn't expect from a text editor?

I know almost nothing about EMACS, but I know you can play Tetris in it... smile

My boyfriend tends to try out emacs from time to time (we're both vim-ers) and he went through the most ridiculious list of things you can actually do with emacs.
Make coffee.
Like.. seriously. XD

And he just added that it has a built-in psychological therapist. Hokay, reminds me of the paper-clip in MS Word... Not creepy at all.

Last edited by Jellicent (2013-12-11 19:08:16)

Offline

#13 2013-12-11 20:57:21

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Oh, I forgot my favorite:  Being able to use a file system on a remote box as though it were local using a fully integrated ssh link.  I can just open and edit a file on my home box by providing a path to the file on that machine (including the full domain of that machine)


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#14 2013-12-11 22:33:23

jakobcreutzfeldt
Member
Registered: 2011-05-12
Posts: 1,041

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Two words: Org Mode

My latest example: I've implemented an ad hoc database of literature that I'm reading, in which I can type notes as I read. Each entry contains clickable/openable links to the PDF file and to its entry in a BibTeX file as well as the full bibliographical data, allowing me to, say, pull up all of my notes on all articles written by some author that contain a given word in the title and have been assigned some tags of my choosing. Each entry is added by entering a simple key combo and then searching for the reference in my BibTeX file (which can be done by author, title, etc, so it's easy). All of this in a basic text file that can be kept under version control.

Other nice things: email/news readers, IRC, TRAMP (as described by ewaller above), built in ANSI terminal emulator, a shell implemented entirely in emacs-lisp (you can do all sorts of crazy things with that), interactive database front-ends, BBDB (address book). And Org Mode to glue them all together.

Offline

#15 2013-12-11 22:43:30

2ManyDogs
Forum Moderator
Registered: 2012-01-15
Posts: 4,645

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

At the risk of fanning the flames of the editor wars, I see people going on and on about all the things emacs can do and I think "I hope these aren't the same people who are always ranting about how this or that Linux feature violates KISS or 'do one thing well'." Then I forget about it and happily go back to editing my code in vim, browsing the web with dwb, and reading my mail in claws.

Maybe time to ask what color is the bikeshed?  I think the OP's question has been answered.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2013-12-11 22:45:34)


How to post. A sincere effort to use modest and proper language and grammar is a sign of respect toward the community.

Offline

#16 2013-12-11 22:54:02

jakobcreutzfeldt
Member
Registered: 2011-05-12
Posts: 1,041

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Eh, the Unix principle is overrated. I've ranted against it here before I think (briefly, in that rants are generally frowned upon in these parts).

Anyway, I guess I would say Emacs does do one thing and it does it well: it's a text-buffer widget for a Lisp interpreter. I would liken it more to a terminal emulator than to an operating system in that it's simply an interface for interacting with text-centric programs, the primary one being a text editor.

Offline

#17 2013-12-11 22:54:29

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

Well said smile


Edit:  This was originally aimed at 2ManyDogs.  It applies to both of you.

Last edited by ewaller (2013-12-12 05:14:31)


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#18 2013-12-12 03:49:42

drcouzelis
Member
From: Connecticut, USA
Registered: 2009-11-09
Posts: 4,092
Website

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

jakobcreutzfeldt wrote:

I would liken it more to a terminal emulator than to an operating system in that it's simply an interface for interacting with text-centric programs, the primary one being a text editor.

What with having a built in terminal emulator, it's possible to run EMACS in EMACS! big_smile

Offline

#19 2013-12-12 05:19:53

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

drcouzelis wrote:

What with having a built in terminal emulator, it's possible to run EMACS in EMACS! big_smile

The emacs shell  wrote:

$ emacs -nw
emacs: Terminal type "dumb" is not powerful enough to run Emacs.
It lacks the ability to position the cursor.
If that is not the actual type of terminal you have,
use the Bourne shell command `TERM=... export TERM' (C-shell:
`setenv TERM ...') to specify the correct type.  It may be necessary
to do `unset TERMINFO' (C-shell: `unsetenv TERMINFO') as well.
$

But, you can run emacs without the -nw from the shell, but it spawns a new emacs window. smile

Last edited by ewaller (2013-12-12 05:21:39)


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#20 2013-12-12 06:26:21

alezost
Member
Registered: 2013-10-17
Posts: 61

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

ewaller wrote:
drcouzelis wrote:

What with having a built in terminal emulator, it's possible to run EMACS in EMACS! big_smile

The emacs shell  wrote:

$ emacs -nw
emacs: Terminal type "dumb" is not powerful enough to run Emacs.
It lacks the ability to position the cursor.
If that is not the actual type of terminal you have,
use the Bourne shell command `TERM=... export TERM' (C-shell:
`setenv TERM ...') to specify the correct type.  It may be necessary
to do `unset TERMINFO' (C-shell: `unsetenv TERMINFO') as well.
$

But, you can run emacs without the -nw from the shell, but it spawns a new emacs window. smile

"shell" is not the only terminal you have.  There are also "eshell" and "term" ("ansi-term").  All three have their advantages and disadvantages.

And you can run emacs or vim inside emacs using "M-x term".

As for me, i use emacs:

  • for reading mail and news (with Gnus),

  • for chat (there are several IRC clients for emacs),

  • for listening to music including online radio (with EMMS as a frontend and mplayer as a backend; you can also watch videos like that),

  • for configuring programming WM i use (StumpWM) on the fly (with SLIME),

  • for working with files (using dired and Surnise Commander),

  • as a super-inteface for git (Magit),

  • for Org mode,

  • even for reading web-pages when i'm only interested in content and not fancy appearance (with w3m; there is also eww),

  • for having fun by using elisp for extending emacs for my needs,

  • and for working with text in any kind.

And i think i didn't mention many things i use and a lot of things i don't use.

Last edited by alezost (2013-12-12 10:03:27)

Offline

#21 2013-12-12 22:37:51

SteveDeFacto
Member
Registered: 2013-08-16
Posts: 158

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

One of the main things I wondered about Emacs is if it could be used as a Microsoft Word/Libre Writer replacement? Or can it at least render images and various sized fonts? This might just be the one feature that would get me to convert vim.

Offline

#22 2013-12-12 22:45:40

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,739

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

SteveDeFacto wrote:

One of the main things I wondered about Emacs is if it could be used as a Microsoft Word/Libre Writer replacement? Or can it at least render images and various sized fonts? This might just be the one feature that would get me to convert vim.

No, and yes.  It is well integrated with LaTex which suits my needs far better than does any WYSIWYG word processor; I would not call it a replacement; it certainly will not open their files.


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

Offline

#23 2015-12-28 11:46:34

Stefan Husmann
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2007-08-07
Posts: 1,391

Re: Emacs as an operating system?

SteveDeFacto wrote:

One of the main things I wondered about Emacs is if it could be used as a Microsoft Word/Libre Writer replacement?

It may be on the way, at least org-mode can export to odt.

SteveDeFacto wrote:

Or can it at least render images and various sized fonts? This might just be the one feature that would get me to convert vim.

yes

Offline

Board footer

Powered by FluxBB