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#1 2014-03-28 20:53:58

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

[Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

I recently bought a new USB disk with a huge capacity, so the USB 2.0 turns into a very slow way to put all my files in the disk. So I decided to buy a Transcend PNU3 (an express card with two USB 3.0 ports) but now that arrived to my house (I bought it in HK) I see the thing is the same.

I copy an 8 GB movie to the hard drive by USB 2 an I get around 50 MB/s. I copy another movie of the same size via USB 3.0 Transcend PNU3 port and I get the same 50MB/s. The external drive is formatted in ext4. I tried with one in btrfs and it's the same. I think Arch is not detecting correctly is a USB 3.0.

Is this right? I saw other users get at lest 90-100 MB/s using this product. I don't feel satisfied at all.

Thanks

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-04-17 15:59:31)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
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#2 2014-03-29 00:02:39

rutgerr
Member
From: São Paulo, SP - Brasil
Registered: 2011-06-06
Posts: 72

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

if the motherboard chipset does not support the 3.0 pci card also will not

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#3 2014-03-29 00:10:02

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Check to see if the xhci-hcd module is loaded and in use for that pci card.  If it is, then it is at least detecting the card as USB 3.0.

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#4 2014-03-29 00:20:45

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

rutgerr wrote:

if the motherboard chipset does not support the 3.0 pci card also will not

Are you sure about that?

WonderWoofy wrote:

Check to see if the xhci-hcd module is loaded and in use for that pci card.  If it is, then it is at least detecting the card as USB 3.0.

How can I do this? Am I right running this: 'lsmod | grep hci' ? It returns me this:

xhci_hcd              144489  0
ahci                   23144  3
libahci                21698  1 ahci
libata                172136  2 ahci,libahci
ehci_pci                3928  0
ehci_hcd               64363  1 ehci_pci
usbcore               180304  6 uvcvideo,usb_storage,ehci_hcd,ehci_pci,usbhid,xhci_hcd

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-03-29 00:21:07)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
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#5 2014-03-29 00:29:12

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,501

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

rutgerr wrote:

if the motherboard chipset does not support the 3.0 pci card also will not

If that were true, there would be no point to such cards. But the point is exactly that, to bring USB 3.0 to a machine that otherwise does not have it. I'm using one, and the disk I use it with does get 105 MB/s, if I connect the disk to an onboard USB 2.0 port I get 30 MB/s tops. Mine is a desktop PCIe card though, not ExpressCard, but that doesn't make a difference.

@sanhuesoft: This comment talks about playing around with the supplied power cable. Though I can't quite figure out what exactly he did there smile, maybe you'll have better luck deciphering it.

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#6 2014-03-29 02:25:14

rutgerr
Member
From: São Paulo, SP - Brasil
Registered: 2011-06-06
Posts: 72

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Maybe i'm wrong so, sorry. I will buy a thing such that and plug in my old rig to test.

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#7 2014-03-29 02:39:55

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Gusar wrote:
rutgerr wrote:

if the motherboard chipset does not support the 3.0 pci card also will not

If that were true, there would be no point to such cards. But the point is exactly that, to bring USB 3.0 to a machine that otherwise does not have it. I'm using one, and the disk I use it with does get 105 MB/s, if I connect the disk to an onboard USB 2.0 port I get 30 MB/s tops. Mine is a desktop PCIe card though, not ExpressCard, but that doesn't make a difference.

@sanhuesoft: This comment talks about playing around with the supplied power cable. Though I can't quite figure out what exactly he did there :), maybe you'll have better luck deciphering it.

I completely agree with you. I checked the link you told me, but i doesn't look like a solution (it seems more kinda manual to use it).

I don't want to install Win7 to test it, I'm very occupied in other things to lose time on doing that.


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
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#8 2014-03-29 03:01:04

pigiron
Member
From: USA
Registered: 2009-07-14
Posts: 139

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Well, this is interesting. After reading of your trouble, I thought I'd poke around on my system to see how my USB 3.0 ports are configured. I decided to focus on the Edimax EW-7822UAC wireless dongle that I need to compile the kernel module for... but it claims that it's USB 3.0.

$ lsusb -v -s 2:3
Bus 002 Device 003: ID 7392:a822 Edimax Technology Co., Ltd
Device Descriptor:
  bLength                18
  bDescriptorType         1
  bcdUSB               2.00
<snip>

Hmmm... that's saying USB 2.0 but the port it's plugged into on the rear panel is blue, and the motherboard manual says it's one of only two USB 3.0 ports on the entire system. So let's examine the controllers:

$ lsusb -t
/:  Bus 07.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
    |__ Port 2: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Hub, Driver=hub/4p, 12M
        |__ Port 3: Dev 3, If 0, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 1.5M
        |__ Port 3: Dev 3, If 1, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 1.5M
        |__ Port 4: Dev 4, If 0, Class=(Defined at Interface level), Driver=synaptics_usb, 1.5M
        |__ Port 4: Dev 4, If 1, Class=(Defined at Interface level), Driver=synaptics_usb, 1.5M
/:  Bus 06.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 05.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 5000M
/:  Bus 04.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 03.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 02.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 480M
    |__ Port 1: Dev 3, If 0, Class=Vendor Specific Class, Driver=rtl8812au, 480M
/:  Bus 01.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=ehci-pci/8p, 480M

That's the wireless dongle (using the rtl8812au module) on the second line from the bottom. So even though it's using the xhci kernel module (USB 3.0) it's running at 480M (USB 2.0). So let's pull out the wireless dongle and reboot (not sure if the reboot is required, but let's be safe):

$ lsusb -t
/:  Bus 07.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
    |__ Port 2: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Hub, Driver=hub/4p, 12M
        |__ Port 3: Dev 3, If 0, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 1.5M
        |__ Port 3: Dev 3, If 1, Class=Human Interface Device, Driver=usbhid, 1.5M
        |__ Port 4: Dev 4, If 0, Class=(Defined at Interface level), Driver=synaptics_usb, 1.5M
        |__ Port 4: Dev 4, If 1, Class=(Defined at Interface level), Driver=synaptics_usb, 1.5M
/:  Bus 06.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 05.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 04.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=uhci_hcd/2p, 12M
/:  Bus 03.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=ehci-pci/8p, 480M
/:  Bus 02.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 5000M
/:  Bus 01.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 480M

So now Bus 02 is running at 5G (USB 3.0). Also notice that Bus 05 strangely went from USB 3.0 to USB 1.1.

So obviously, plugging in the wireless dongle drops the port from USB 3.0 to USB 2.0. Why? I'm not sure, but it looks like when kernel pulls the device descriptors from the dongle it's actually presenting itself as a USB 2.0 device and not USB 3.0 like the manufacturer's web site claims. Perhaps if you poke around you may find the same thing happening to you.

Like I said, interesting problem.

Last edited by pigiron (2014-03-29 03:19:58)

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#9 2014-03-29 03:15:07

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

I checked with the command, and it looks just right:

$ lsusb -t
/:  Bus 04.Port 1: Dev 1, Class=root_hub, Driver=xhci_hcd/2p, 5000M
    |__ Port 1: Dev 2, If 0, Class=Mass Storage, Driver=usb-storage, 5000M
    |__ Port 2: Dev 3, If 0, Class=Mass Storage, Driver=usb-storage, 5000M

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-03-29 03:29:29)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
Audio: Bose Companion 20, Shure SRH440, Shure SE215, Sennheiser HD202

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#10 2014-03-29 03:28:04

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

I tried something:

dd if=/dev/zero of=/media/Canvio/zero-1.bin bs=4K count=100 
dd if=/dev/zero of=/media/Canvio/zero-2.bin bs=8K count=50

And the speeds were 60 MB/s and 130MB/s respectively. But the mean of the transfer speeds is around 60MB/s. I'm not sure if this means something.

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-03-29 03:29:50)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
Audio: Bose Companion 20, Shure SRH440, Shure SE215, Sennheiser HD202

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#11 2014-03-29 03:32:38

Buddlespit
Member
From: Chesapeake, Va.
Registered: 2014-02-07
Posts: 380

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

does your enclosure support usb 3.0?

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#12 2014-03-29 03:40:40

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Buddlespit wrote:

does your enclosure support usb 3.0?

I'm using two external USB 3.0 drives (a Toshiba Canvio USB3.0 and a Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB USB 3.0).

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-03-29 03:40:53)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
Audio: Bose Companion 20, Shure SRH440, Shure SE215, Sennheiser HD202

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#13 2014-04-04 01:56:10

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Anyone?


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
Audio: Bose Companion 20, Shure SRH440, Shure SE215, Sennheiser HD202

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#14 2014-04-04 15:25:43

R00KIE
Forum Moderator
From: Between a computer and a chair
Registered: 2008-09-14
Posts: 3,628

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Try the test with larger block sizes, small block sizes are inefficient and will result in slow speeds.


R00KIE
Tm90aGluZyB0byBzZWUgaGVyZSwgbW92ZSBhbG9uZy4K

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#15 2014-04-04 16:02:10

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

R00KIE wrote:

Try the test with larger block sizes, small block sizes are inefficient and will result in slow speeds.

Is there any option I need to add to the mkfs.ext4 to use larger blocks? For example 8K instead of 4K. According to the man pages, -b valid options are 1024, 2048, 4096.


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
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#16 2014-04-04 16:51:16

R00KIE
Forum Moderator
From: Between a computer and a chair
Registered: 2008-09-14
Posts: 3,628

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

I meant the block size you use in dd. Try 1M, 10M or 100M.


R00KIE
Tm90aGluZyB0byBzZWUgaGVyZSwgbW92ZSBhbG9uZy4K

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#17 2014-04-07 23:44:46

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

R00KIE wrote:

I meant the block size you use in dd. Try 1M, 10M or 100M.

Doing some serious tests:

Over Transcend USB 3.0 Express Card
BS=4K count=250000 81,1MB/s
BS=1M count=1000 82MB/s
BS=10M count=100 80,9MB/s
BS=100M count=10 81MB/s

Over an USB 2.0 port
BS=4K count=250000 25,7MB/s
BS=1M count=1000 26,3MB/s
BS=10M count=100 26,3MB/s
BS=100M count=10 26,4MB/s

Is it too slow for being an USB 3.0 interface? As I can see it's not 10x faster than USB 2.0. Even if I compare it to my slow 2.0 ports. Is there any problem here?

Last edited by sanhuesoft (2014-04-07 23:51:59)


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy S3, Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 T211 7"
Audio: Bose Companion 20, Shure SRH440, Shure SE215, Sennheiser HD202

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#18 2014-04-08 07:33:54

sebcactus
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2005-01-27
Posts: 277

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

Seems reasonable according to:
http://www.everythingusb.com/speed.html

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#19 2014-04-17 15:59:16

sanhuesoft
Member
Registered: 2013-11-30
Posts: 37

Re: [Solved] About using USB 3.0 for an external drive

OK, thanks.


Laptop: Lenovo G460, Core i3 M370, 8GB Ram, Seagate Momentus 500GB, Arch Linux
Storage: Seagate Expansion Drive 4TB, Toshiba Canvio 500GB, Cirago 500GB
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