[Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

amish · 2014-05-31 10:24:01

[this thread was split from original thread - https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=100457]

Ok so I have this same laptop (HP Probook 4510s) and have same problem.

I just recently shifted from Fedora 16 to Arch linux (since about a month or so)

In Arch Linux this laptop has already over-heated 3-4 times and SWITCHED OFF directly (hardware tempearture safety gets triggered)

But when I was on Fedora it never got over-heated and never SWITCHED OFF. (Did not happen in earlier versions of Fedora either)

CPU is on ondemand. (default ARCH setting) and acpi_cpufreq module is active. (again by default)

What I have noticed is that in Fedora 16 fan can be heard easily and would automatically go to higher RPM on higher use.

But in Arch I keep noticing that fan is hardily audible (it seems slower than in Fedora) and it goes to high speed very rarely. (only when I am compiling some program) and then it goes almost silent very immediately. (In Fedora it would slow down slowly slowly - less speed, lesser speed in steps)

So its like as if in Arch fan just runs in two speed - low and high and never runs at in between speed.

Mostly crashes happen when I run games like Supertux2. (its supposed to be lightweight 2D game)

I tried fancontrol but lmsensors (sensors-detect) is not detecing fan at all. (did not detect in fedora either).

So fancontrol does not work.

Do I have to do special setting in lmsensors or my laptop does not support fan sensors?

How do I make sure that fan runs at speed equivalent to that in Fedora 16.

I have tried lots of things from Arch wiki but most articles seem irrelavant (as ondemand is what most of them recommend)

Please suggest.

Thank you

Last edited by amish (2014-06-14 16:11:52)

amish · 2014-05-31 10:31:02

@plam - were you able to find solution for running fancontrol?

fsckd · 2014-05-31 12:18:55

Hi amish, I'm going to split your posts into a separate thread. While it is the same issue, the software is different (e.g. systemd).

Previous thread: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=100457.

amish · 2014-06-02 12:24:23

Now it switched off when I was running windows in Oracle virtualbox (esp. when windows update was running)

This is becoming serious issue for me. I can not run CPU intensive tasks, otherwise I have to keep remaining alert not to overheat laptop.

There is something which is different in Fedora and in Arch. In Fedora when I would run CPU intensive tasks, fan would automatically switch to higher speed there by making sure CPU wont overheat.

Same is not happening in Arch linux Fan runs but at low speeds

Last edited by amish (2014-06-02 12:25:13)

aaditya · 2014-06-05 08:57:18

You can try https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/thermald/ and see if it makes any difference..

Plus hardware solutions like cleaning out the fans, removing dust, propping up the laptop on a higher surface to ensure better airflow, etc..

Edit-
Could be your GPU also.
If your running the free drivers, maybe you need to enable dpm?
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Ati#Powersaving

Last edited by aaditya (2014-06-05 09:00:06)

amish · 2014-06-07 06:43:36

Thanks for reply but I dont have any graphic card. Just Intel i915 based card. I think we already have Intel (officially supported) drivers. So drivers should not be issue.

Second as I already said, the issue is not there in Fedora. So dust, higher surface is not related to the issue. (Plus I regularly blow air on fan every 15-20days)

Last edited by amish (2014-06-07 06:45:37)

aaditya · 2014-06-07 07:10:18

Perhaps an acpi issue then?
https://www.linux.com/learn/docs/ldp/409-acpi-howto

Does using the acpi_osi=Linux kernel parameter while booting make any difference?

Another thing I can think of is Bios upgrade.

P.S.
I had also tried fancontrol some time ago, but it didnt work out for me.
Then I heard about thermald, and installed it; seemed to make a difference.

Edit-
There are some power savings options for Intel graphics as well:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/In … ng_Options

Last edited by aaditya (2014-06-07 07:38:17)

amish · 2014-06-08 04:25:31

Umm according to debian wiki https://wiki.debian.org/thermald , it supports only sandybridge and latest Intel CPU.

So mine is core series and not supported.

I doubt it needs BIOS upgrade because it works fine in Fedora.

About Intel power saving options, I have already put them. But not effect.

brainwave · 2014-06-08 05:15:08

amish wrote:

Thanks for reply but I dont have any graphic card. Just Intel i915 based card. I think we already have Intel (officially supported) drivers. So drivers should not be issue.

Even integrated GPU can cause overheating. However...

The issue here is that your laptop fan should run and speed up when running arch, no matter what the cause of the heat. Are you saying that the fan is not running fast enough? I got confused because you mentioned overheating, but are complaining that the fan isn't running at in between speeds. Think about it - if the temperature reaches high, fan should run at high and this means laptop shouldn't overheat. Then you would be complaining about high operating temperatures and lack of multiple speeds.

Or your fan runs at low speeds and isn't able to run at lower speeds. Then you would have thermal shutdown and complain about it.

Which is it?

amish · 2014-06-08 05:25:14

Umm, I thought I explained the issue well in previous posts

Quick points:

1) No issues in Fedora, issue is only in Arch Linux
2) In Arch Linux, system completely switches off when running basic games like Supertux2 (after 5-7 minutes of playing) and once switched off when using Virtualbox (When windows update was running) i.e. higher load makes it go to critical temperature and system powers off instantly.
3) When system is idle (that is I am not doing anything), in Fedora I can still hear fan from about one foot distance but NOT in Arch. (I have to go closer to system then I can hear the fan)
4) Fan does not seem to be stepping on increasing/decreasing load. If I compile some big program (like squid), initially it is at "inaudible" speed and then it suddenly goes to high speed. And goes straight to "inaudible" speed no sooner compilation is over. Which means, it either runs at low speed or high speed. In Fedora I can clearly notice different speed. i.e. it goes high then bit slow and then slower and slower. Like that.

Now may be you can re-read my first post.

Thanks

Last edited by amish (2014-06-08 05:30:20)

prash · 2014-06-09 00:34:47

@amish, I have the same problems as you. My laptop model is very similar to yours; it's a HP ProBook 4410s. Unlike you, I run off a 128G SSD, so I don't have the option of trying out so many distros and OSes. Here's what I know:

Automatic fan speed control used to work properly some 2-3 months ago. I did not run CPU intensive tasks for a few months, and so I did not notice that the fan speed would not change after boot-up.
"$ sensors" used to report both, CPU temperatures and acpi temperatures. Now, it shows just CPU temperatures.
Under /sys/class/hwmon, I used to have hwmon0 and hwmon1, for CPU temps and acpi temps, respectively

Now, when I do sensors-detect, it finds the Intel digital thermal sensor properly. But after that, one of the odd things that I notice is:

Trying family `SMSC'...                                     Yes
Found unknown chip with ID 0x4501

I guess this is why "$ sensors" does not show my ACPI temperatures. However, "$ acpi -t" shows me:

Thermal 0: ok, 45.0 degrees C
Thermal 1: ok, 22.9 degrees C
Thermal 2: ok, 36.0 degrees C
Thermal 3: ok, 34.0 degrees C
Thermal 4: ok, 41.0 degrees C
Thermal 5: ok, 16.0 degrees C

The sensors work. On warm days these sensors show higher temperatures than on cold days.

I use a kludge to manually control the fan. This is what I get on my laptop:

# cd /sys/devices/virtual/thermal
# for i in cooling_device<0-15>; do; echo -n $i/cur_state \ ; cat $i/cur_state; done
cooling_device0/cur_state  0
cooling_device1/cur_state  0
cooling_device10/cur_state  0
cooling_device11/cur_state  0
cooling_device12/cur_state  0
cooling_device13/cur_state  0
cooling_device14/cur_state  1
cooling_device15/cur_state  0
cooling_device2/cur_state  0
cooling_device3/cur_state  0
cooling_device4/cur_state  0
cooling_device5/cur_state  0
cooling_device6/cur_state  0
cooling_device7/cur_state  0
cooling_device8/cur_state  0
cooling_device9/cur_state  0

I then manually change the bytes... until the temperature (as reported by "$ sensors") is acceptable. The command is something like:

# echo -n 1 > cooling_device12/cur_state

I set each cooling_device/cur_state to "1" manually. I start with cooling_device14 and progress towards 0, in intervals of about a minute. Right now, my devices 12, 13, and 14 are set to 1. This, at an ambient temp of 20°C, keeps my CPU at about 30°C.

Perhaps I should write some code to automate this hack, but right now, this manual control "works" for me, and does not take up too much attention. I hope someone more knowledgeable of sensor drivers fixes it before I get down to hacking up some code.

Last edited by prash (2014-06-09 00:37:57)

brainwave · 2014-06-09 04:51:03

So it is the sensor driver that causes fan not to run? amish could you try and confirm? If your issue is same as prash?

amish · 2014-06-09 16:15:35

Thanks prash

I will try them and observe for 1-2 days and report back.

amish · 2014-06-10 07:44:11

Ok so little bit of update. But not 100% verified. (Just 2hrs of testing done)

After recent kernel update to 3.14.6-1-ARCH

It seems that FAN is now running better. It also changes speed gradually instead of jumps from high to low OR low to high.

Also as per update by prash, new kernel has set these as '1' automatically (i.e. I have not done anything its by default)

cooling_device12/cur_state
cooling_device13/cur_state
cooling_device14/cur_state
cooling_device15/cur_state

I think earlier only one cooling_device was set to 1 automatically. (I forgot which number it was)

I can also hear FAN running from some distance. (like I used to hear when using Fedora)

Let me check for 2-3 more days and come back.

Thanks again to all those who helped.

prash · 2014-06-10 08:27:59

amish wrote:

After recent kernel update to 3.14.6-1-ARCH
It seems that FAN is now running better. It also changes speed gradually instead of jumps from high to low OR low to high.

You are right. The latest kernel update fixed it. You can test it by opening two terminal windows and running "yes" in them. This will load both cores of your processor, and the temperature will rise. When I did that, the fan sped up, and when I killed the two "yes" processes, the fan slowed down again.

amish · 2014-06-14 16:11:28

Ok just as final confirmation. Since kernel 3.14.6-1-ARCH, this issue seems to have gone.

Suggestions given above by prash for cooling_device*/cur_state, seem to have automatically handled by kernel now.

i.e. as load increases it seems kernel automatically changes cur_state to 1 for some cooling_device

In my case cooling device 15, 14, 13 always seem to be 1.

When fan runs faster, I also see cooling device 12 is set to 1.
When fan slows down, it is set back to 0.

PS: I have not done thorough tests, these are preliminary observations. But atleast my heating issue and fan issue seems to have gone.

Thanks everyone esp. prash.

tapiov · 2014-06-15 10:38:40

Ok, good to hear you fixed it with 3.14 kernel. I am on Ubuntu 14.04, kernel now 3.13.0-30-generic. Can't wait to get 3.14.6-1 here.

I ran into this problem on my HP 4510s as well, tried everything and researched widely. Finally came to conclusion that none of the other fixes work and I wrote an ugly bash script to adjust this (based on similar IBM ThinkPad fancontrol script). I later on turned my script to equally ugly c++ daemon. It works great, logs to syslog and I trust it to control the fan properly.

My bash script is at http://askubuntu.com/questions/428760/f … 850#455850

If anybody needs the c++ source code (only tested on one hp 4510s), let me know by email.

--

Ok, installed 3.15.0-031500rc8-generic and now the fan is being controlled by kernel. This is less aggressive than my daemon was but anyway, maybe be sufficient. I'll keep testing this.

Last edited by tapiov (2014-06-15 16:22:01)

Arch Linux

#1 2014-05-31 10:24:01

[Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#2 2014-05-31 10:31:02

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#3 2014-05-31 12:18:55

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#4 2014-06-02 12:24:23

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#5 2014-06-05 08:57:18

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#6 2014-06-07 06:43:36

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#7 2014-06-07 07:10:18

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#8 2014-06-08 04:25:31

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#9 2014-06-08 05:15:08

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#10 2014-06-08 05:25:14

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#11 2014-06-09 00:34:47

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#12 2014-06-09 04:51:03

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#13 2014-06-09 16:15:35

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#14 2014-06-10 07:44:11

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#15 2014-06-10 08:27:59

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#16 2014-06-14 16:11:28

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

#17 2014-06-15 10:38:40

Re: [Solved] HP ProBook 4510s overheating

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