Novell + Microsoft ?

sula · 2006-11-03 11:52:36

http://www.novell.com/linux/microsoft/
http://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnove … fault.mspx

It is like wow(or more like wtf... )

iphitus · 2006-11-03 13:53:41

It's... interesting. I'm trying to see what either are getting from this, so far it seems like:
For microsoft:
- Virtualisation. I think Microsoft are going to try and use this as a way to either get their product to ship sooner, or as a stop gap to allow them to offer some sort of virtualisation until their products are ready, as according to a reg article, Microsoft's tools werent due till later next year.
- Money. Royalty payments from novell. http://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnove … b/faq.mspx

Now that makes it seem slightly less innocent. I wonder whether microsoft were going to pursue them over some patent and this came as the result of negotiation?

From: http://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnove … b/faq.mspx and seemingly copy pasted: http://www.novell.com/linux/microsoft/faq.html

Under the patent agreement, both companies will make up-front payments in exchange for a release from any potential liability for use of each others patented intellectual property, with a net balancing payment from Microsoft to Novell reflecting the larger applicable volume of Microsoft's product shipments. Novell will also make running royalty payments based on a percentage of its revenues from open source products.

As for novell...
- Greater product exposure.
- Free of patent risks? No more than if they legally paid royalties for them -- oh wait, thats what it says they are doing. The terms of patent coverage are pretty vague too. It seems to be only customers of novell that get it,

What'll be interesting is the document format capability promised. I hope to see Office adopting or providing ODF support out of the box, rather than OOo shipping with Open-xml default instead.

But this all seems somewhat lofty, it ought to be interesting to see what comes out of it.

James

soloport · 2006-11-03 13:55:27

More like wtf according to Groklaw.

Lone_Wolf · 2006-11-03 20:49:16

Well, that makes 1 thing clear : If i ever want to test another distro, it will NOT be Suse anymore (although i came from suse to arch).

Here's an interesting reaction from the Free Software Foundation Moglen: Microsoft-Novell raises GPL questions

While i'm not very fond of the FSF in the GPL v3 issues, in this case i think they will have my vote.

depaloan · 2006-11-03 22:34:22

Bruce Perens on MS-Novell collaboration here

cactus · 2006-11-03 23:09:47

Interesting. When I first heard about it, I thought it was going to be something about Mono and Xen (maybe getting Xen to run windows).

After looking at the press release from Novell, and reading some of the "big smart" people who know the GPL inside and out..this decision seems more confusing and nonsensical. It looks like Novell shot themselves in the foot big time. I don't see how they can 'license' samba anyway. Very odd.

I wonder what the ex-Ximian guys that novell bought up think of this. (Nat Friedman and Miguel de Izca)

All I can say is.. thank god I don't use suse.
I will never recommend Suse/Novell to anyone for anything either (not that I ever really did).

EDIT:
miguel's take on it: http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2006/Nov-02.html

He links to a 'joint letter to the open source community'.
Looks like he is talking mostly about mono.. not sure how much he is just 'towing the company line'.

cactus · 2006-11-03 23:22:39

Interesting take from a corporate competitor to Novell...
Redhat.
http://www.redhat.com/truthhappens/

lumiwa · 2006-11-07 15:40:12

IMO bad time for Linux world coming...
I was long time SuSE user...when Novell bought them everything going down...more and more problem. What will be after M$ came in the Linux world? What would be with opensource?

kth5 · 2006-11-07 15:49:36

lumiwa wrote:

IMO bad time for Linux world coming...
I was long time SuSE user...when Novell bought them everything going down...more and more problem. What will be after M$ came in the Linux world? What would be with opensource?

Err... someone trying to be ironic here? Come one, you can't be serious.

Romashka · 2006-11-07 15:53:38

RedHat offers Linux patent protection

lumiwa · 2006-11-07 17:26:47

Romashka wrote:

RedHat offers Linux patent protection

http://port25.technet.com/archive/2006/ … -news.aspx

Romashka · 2006-11-07 21:29:54

lumiwa wrote:

http://port25.technet.com/archive/2006/ … -news.aspx

Under the patent agreement, customers will receive coverage for Mono, Samba, and OpenOffice as well as .NET and Windows Server.-All of these technologies will be improved upon during the 5 years of the agreement and there are some limits on the coverage that would be provided for future technologies added to these offerings.

Miguel de Icaza's web log's post

Q: Which Patents Does Mono Infringe?
I do not know of any patents which Mono infringes.
. . .
Q: Is it now possible to integrate code that uses Microsoft patents today?
Although it is possible, we will not integrate such code, as Mono is a community project.

I'm sure Microsoft have no real possibilities to sue Samba and OOo developers as well.

And I'm almost sure that European Union will force Microsoft to release specs of its server protocols and documents eventually.

lumiwa · 2006-11-07 22:51:14

"And I'm almost sure that European Union will force Microsoft to release specs of its server protocols and documents eventually."

I hope!!

Romashka · 2006-11-07 23:12:24

lumiwa wrote:

"And I'm almost sure that European Union will force Microsoft to release specs of its server protocols and documents eventually."
I hope!!

I think Microsoft will do that eventually. IIRC they paid almost 1 billion (!!!) in total already for their non-willingness to do what EU wants. And EU Comission showed no mercy to M$, and didn't eat what M$ tried to show as "compliance to EUC's demands".

The situation with software patents in EU is more complex. There were two or more tries to pass bad laws regarding this, but all failed. The lobbying there is so strong, that IIRC there was even some illegal workarounds and other dirty stuff tried to pass them.
I hope those discussions will stop completely and there will be no yet another "allow software patents" try.

lumiwa · 2006-11-08 00:53:25

http://www.novell.com/linux/microsoft/f … ource.html

Who nows...I wish that you are right.

Romashka · 2006-11-08 16:04:42

Perens: 'Novell is the new SCO'

lumiwa · 2006-11-08 18:03:04

Romashka wrote:

Perens: 'Novell is the new SCO'

The war begin?

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/11/06 … _analysis/

lumiwa · 2006-11-08 21:26:21

one more:

http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS7235986827.html

Aganoth · 2006-11-09 02:03:23

This is just me, but being an american && a Bush supporter, I hear alot about these isreali Exetremists and terrorists and what not. And I can't help but be oddly reminded of that here.

They say that Terrorism is so effective because its a double edged sword. On one hand, if we protect our king and have fear, the terrorists have won. On the other, if we ignore them like 5 year olds, eventually, more die. It's sick, kinda like saying, 'The perfect war' or 'David's Gameplan.'

Having said that, I can't help thinking, 'Is Microsoft doing this to scare the shit out of us, to get us to jump ship and speed to SuSe? I read somewhere someone put it perfectly: 'Microsoft has perched themselves like a submarine with only its parascope visible.' Meaning, they could wait years, until this has all dies down, the panic and concern is all gone, and then bam. An assault that could end it all except for the few rogues left? I mean, think about the tactics here: If you destroy the one super credibility linux has to the 'outside (I use that term very loosly),' like somehow making linux as a server completely out-of-the-question (I can't think of a way yet, any possible reason, but I wouldn't bank my intelligence on the 200+ minds at Microsoft brewing over this), then linux could truly die. I'd like to believe the community would stand behind it, but we know some would run. I'm sure some have run already. That's an unknown fate linux shouldn't be in.

Its true to believe just always prevails in the end, right?

Gullible Jones · 2006-11-11 23:00:30

Aganoth wrote:

This is just me, but being an american && a Bush supporter, I hear alot about these isreali Exetremists and terrorists and what not. And I can't help but be oddly reminded of that here.
They say that Terrorism is so effective because its a double edged sword. On one hand, if we protect our king and have fear, the terrorists have won. On the other, if we ignore them like 5 year olds, eventually, more die. It's sick, kinda like saying, 'The perfect war' or 'David's Gameplan.'

There are more than those two very general possibilities, some of which are losing propositions and some of which aren't - same for the situation with MS. At any rate, the analogy doesn't hold very far, since MS works very differently from Al Quaeda and has different goals in mind.

Having said that, I can't help thinking, 'Is Microsoft doing this to scare the shit out of us, to get us to jump ship and speed to SuSe? I read somewhere someone put it perfectly: 'Microsoft has perched themselves like a submarine with only its parascope visible.' Meaning, they could wait years, until this has all dies down, the panic and concern is all gone, and then bam. An assault that could end it all except for the few rogues left? I mean, think about the tactics here: If you destroy the one super credibility linux has to the 'outside (I use that term very loosly),' like somehow making linux as a server completely out-of-the-question (I can't think of a way yet, any possible reason, but I wouldn't bank my intelligence on the 200+ minds at Microsoft brewing over this), then linux could truly die. I'd like to believe the community would stand behind it, but we know some would run. I'm sure some have run already. That's an unknown fate linux shouldn't be in.

I think what they might be doing is trying the old "if you can't beat them, buy them out" strategy. Perhaps they see Novell as one of their biggest commercial competitors in the Linux community, and think they could nullify them by signing deals and eventually forming an alliance or buying them wholesale - Novell is big, but Microsoft could probably engulf them with little trouble.

Its true to believe just always prevails in the end, right?

Better to keep on one's toes, I think. That doesn't justify panic, but there is a point where hope becomes denial - when people feel that the right side will triumph no matter what they do, they can get complacent.

Romashka · 2006-11-13 12:40:37

Samba Team Asks Novell to Reconsider

fk · 2006-11-13 14:19:59

http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/

Read and think about ...

lumiwa · 2006-11-15 12:08:55

It is not about Novell but it is about M$. Bravo Kroes!

http://technology.guardian.co.uk/news/s … 86,00.html

Romashka · 2006-11-18 22:19:53

Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer Thursday declared his belief that the Linux operating system infringes on Microsoft's intellectual property.

http://www.linuxworld.com.au/index.php/ … p;2;fpid;1

Ballmer is crazy!

baze · 2006-11-18 22:50:55

Romashka wrote:

Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer Thursday declared his belief that the Linux operating system infringes on Microsoft's intellectual property.
http://www.linuxworld.com.au/index.php/ … p;2;fpid;1
Ballmer is crazy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvsboPUjrGc really?

Arch Linux

#1 2006-11-03 11:52:36

Novell + Microsoft ?

#2 2006-11-03 13:53:41

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#3 2006-11-03 13:55:27

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#4 2006-11-03 20:49:16

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#5 2006-11-03 22:34:22

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#6 2006-11-03 23:09:47

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#7 2006-11-03 23:22:39

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#8 2006-11-07 15:40:12

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#9 2006-11-07 15:49:36

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#10 2006-11-07 15:53:38

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#11 2006-11-07 17:26:47

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#12 2006-11-07 21:29:54

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#13 2006-11-07 22:51:14

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#14 2006-11-07 23:12:24

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#15 2006-11-08 00:53:25

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#16 2006-11-08 16:04:42

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#17 2006-11-08 18:03:04

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#18 2006-11-08 21:26:21

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#19 2006-11-09 02:03:23

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#20 2006-11-11 23:00:30

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#21 2006-11-13 12:40:37

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#22 2006-11-13 14:19:59

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#23 2006-11-15 12:08:55

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#24 2006-11-18 22:19:53

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

#25 2006-11-18 22:50:55

Re: Novell + Microsoft ?

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