Time to get rid of XMMS?

Romashka · 2006-11-09 00:12:44

If not all knows already, Gento removes XMMS.

XMMS is very old and uses GTK1.
First, XMMS devs decided to create XMMS2, but they wanted to make client/server architecture, so development became slow.
Then, BMP was born. XMMS fork built on GTK2 was cool.
Then, BMP devs decided to make BMPx (much like XMMS2) and abandoned BMP.
Finally Audacious was forked from BMP.
Today XMMS looks too oldish, IMHO.
Sadly, KDE packages require XMMS and thus GTK1.

Isn't it time to get rid of XMMS and move it to AUR?

EDIT: fixed URL.

shamrok · 2006-11-09 08:48:22

I totally agree with you.
I've checked xmms package and:
required by: kdebluetooth kdeutils
Kdeutils - karamba as I remember
Kdebluetooth - no idea

dtw · 2006-11-09 10:29:27

Well, I'd like to see the kde deps changed as xmms is the only thing that keeps gtk1 on my system. Dumping xmms completely is as daft as dumping any old forked application, like say blackbox.

Romashka · 2006-11-09 11:11:47

the various Audacious developers have been working with the Gentoo community to ease the transition

Gentoo team is going to port all requested XMMS plugins to Audacious.

byte · 2006-11-09 11:22:41

*watches a little bug slowly passing by*
Move! ;-)

brain0 · 2006-11-09 16:16:05

Romashka wrote:

Isn't it time to get rid of XMMS and move it to AUR?

NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! I LOVE YOU XMMS, I WILL NEVER LEAVE YOU!

phrakture · 2006-11-09 16:26:13

dtw wrote:

Well, I'd like to see the kde deps changed as xmms is the only thing that keeps gtk1 on my system. Dumping xmms completely is as daft as dumping any old forked application, like say blackbox.

Or hackedbox? http://archlinux.org/packages/790/

Dieter@be · 2006-11-09 18:05:37

well i don't care. if devs wanna keep putting their time (i have no idea on how much time this takes) to keep this old program alive and if people really insist on staying using it, that's fine with me, as long as this doesn't pull the attention away from the other work that needs be done.

I don't use xmms (there are far better tools out there, like amarok for example), so i certainlny won't suffer from it,
however i was more then just surprised to see xmms being installed on my freshly installed (arch + xorg +xfce4) system :shock:

cheer · 2006-11-09 21:33:13

I totally agree with Romashka

dtw · 2006-11-09 21:33:42

Yeah, it's a dep of many major pkgs...did you read this thread or have I misunderstood you?

phrak: quite

brain0 · 2006-11-09 23:51:13

I agree that things like KDE shouldn't depend on xmms.

BUT: I tried audacious as a replacement for xmms and it has the same problems that bmp had: It is slooooow. I just tried adding my complete $HOME/music folders into the audacious playlist and it used 100% CPU for about 15 minutes (at least it stayed reponsive most of the time, you can't say that about bmp). And when finally something showed in my playlist, it hadn't even read the ID3 tags and song lengths yet. XMMS does all that in the background and I can already play songs during that time.
I can see no advantage at all in audacious (compared to xmms), but lots of problems that I don't have with xmms. And the audacious default skin is as ugly as the bmp default skin, while the xmms skin is intuitive, nice and usable.

So tell me, seriously, what is so great about audacious or any other player that would make me stop using xmms?

iphitus · 2006-11-10 01:06:14

brain0: you could just copy the XMMS skin across, they all use the same format. As for it not showing the ID3, have a look in the preferences, there's an option to have it show on load, rather than display. Doesnt seem like you gave it much of a fair go if you didnt find that.

however....

If the above KDE bug were to be fixed, there's no reason whatsoever to remove it from the repositories.

To remove it would be limiting the choice of many, and cutting out many users such as brain0, which ain't really fair.

On a side note, I wouldnt remove XMMS as long as it's working, because of the history it has. It's been a member of the linux desktop since I started, and was my GUI music player of choice, before there was a much of a choice. It was THE music player and existed long before rhythmbox, mpd, amarok, and practically every other player out there. I still use it occasionally for mp3 streams -- I don't like how the other players do it, and they don't seem to do it as well.

It's got history, and it works. Which is why it has plenty of users. It fulfills their needs, and that's all software should be required to do -- do what the user needs to do, well.

So as long as it fulfills users needs, and it works, it's staying. To remove it, is to show complete disrespect to some people's choice.

James

delphinen · 2006-11-10 01:32:44

XMMS comes with almost all distros, and its perfect for my musical needs; global hotkeys would be great, but its not THAT important. Just my opinion.

Romashka · 2006-11-10 10:29:40

Iphitus, I don't mind leaving XMMS in official repos (while there is demand for it), but removing it as a dependency for KDE is the good thing IMHO.
I'd like to see KDE free not only of gtk1 but gtk2 dependency too.

brain0 · 2006-11-10 13:35:21

iphitus wrote:

brain0: you could just copy the XMMS skin across, they all use the same format. As for it not showing the ID3, have a look in the preferences, there's an option to have it show on load, rather than display. Doesnt seem like you gave it much of a fair go if you didnt find that.

You didn't read what I said. It took audacious about 15 minutes to only add all files WITHOUT reading id3 and length. Imagine how long it will take when I enable the id3 loading on add. Every other player just has regressions in terms of speed and responsiveness compared to XMMS.

Romashka · 2006-11-10 14:08:15

brain0 wrote:

It took audacious about 15 minutes to only add all files WITHOUT reading id3 and length. Imagine how long it will take when I enable the id3 loading on add.

Hmm... it's interesting if Audacious devs knows about this. It's strange that they (and BMP devs) didn't fix this yet.
I've never tried to load all my music library (>30GB) in Audacious. It will be interesting to compare it with gmpc.

brain0 wrote:

Every other player just has regressions in terms of speed and responsiveness compared to XMMS.

Even mpd clients? gmpc, glurp, sonata etc.

mpie · 2006-11-10 15:35:05

boombox loads 20gs in 45s....

iphitus · 2006-11-11 00:06:45

brain0 wrote:

iphitus wrote:
brain0: you could just copy the XMMS skin across, they all use the same format. As for it not showing the ID3, have a look in the preferences, there's an option to have it show on load, rather than display. Doesnt seem like you gave it much of a fair go if you didnt find that.
You didn't read what I said. It took audacious about 15 minutes to only add all files WITHOUT reading id3 and length. Imagine how long it will take when I enable the id3 loading on add. Every other player just has regressions in terms of speed and responsiveness compared to XMMS.

It may have been a specific bug or regression -- I never had such issues when I used bmp and loaded my whole music library into it (just shy of a gig at that time).

Romashka: the mpd based ones would be quicker, but that's an entirely different way of managing your music -- if brain0 likes XMMS, its probably not the method he wants to use to organise his music.

James

slackhack · 2006-11-25 17:23:28

audacious is really slow. if you hit the EQ "on" button, it takes 5 or 6 *seconds* to actually take effect (either off or on). it's also slow to load files, as brain0 said, and if you add a .pls url into the "add internet location," it just goes blank and doesn't load anything. bmp had the same problem.

for "quick and easy" listening, nothing still beats xmms, imo. the "forks" didn't fork something , because they all suck compared to xmms. the gtk2 really slows them down, and then you might as well just use some huge bloaty thing like amarok. that's okay for local music libraries, but it's not exactly what i want to launch just to listen to a pls or some wav on the internet (esp. in xfce4, when no kde libs are loaded :shock: ).

Kermit · 2006-11-25 23:09:22

I hope so XMMS will stay at repo ... It's first program which played music at my first Linux It's just the best program on the world (yeah I'm fanatic ).

I don't use KDE but I think that keeping GTK1 as a dependency for KDE isn't good idea and GTK2 as a dependency should be remove too. KDE uses QT so it doesn't need GTK1 or GTK2. If somebody will need GTK then he will install it.

Kermit.

[vEX] · 2006-11-26 15:17:10

I just installed and tried Audacious and adding all my music to it and having it read tag info on load really is slow, it took ~10 minutes for it to add ~1100 songs (mostly FLAC and OGG, though not sure if that makes a difference). Otherwise it seems nice, I think I'll keep it and play with it for a while and see if I'll replace XMMS myself.

I agree with Kermit on the dependency issue.

Mefju · 2006-11-26 21:46:29

[vEX] wrote:

I just installed and tried Audacious and adding all my music too it and having it read tag info on load really is slow, it took ~10 minutes for it to add ~1100 songs .

Thats why I'm using rhythmbox, it loads songs very fast.

dmax · 2006-12-05 09:06:46

xmms rocks

audacious sucks

I like xmms a lil better probably in time audacious will be better who knows.

Riklaunim · 2006-12-05 20:14:26

KDE, Gnome, XFCE have their own players, I use Kaffeine for everything and kmplayer/32mplayer for 32 bit stuff (on a amd64 gentoo) so there are alternatives

dmax · 2006-12-06 06:24:04

why does XMMS suck? cause it doesn't use GTK2?

been #1 player for a very long time.

Arch Linux

#1 2006-11-09 00:12:44

Time to get rid of XMMS?

#2 2006-11-09 08:48:22

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#3 2006-11-09 10:29:27

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#4 2006-11-09 11:11:47

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#5 2006-11-09 11:22:41

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#6 2006-11-09 16:16:05

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#7 2006-11-09 16:26:13

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#8 2006-11-09 18:05:37

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#9 2006-11-09 21:33:13

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#10 2006-11-09 21:33:42

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#11 2006-11-09 23:51:13

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#12 2006-11-10 01:06:14

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#13 2006-11-10 01:32:44

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#14 2006-11-10 10:29:40

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#15 2006-11-10 13:35:21

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#16 2006-11-10 14:08:15

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#17 2006-11-10 15:35:05

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#18 2006-11-11 00:06:45

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#19 2006-11-25 17:23:28

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#20 2006-11-25 23:09:22

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#21 2006-11-26 15:17:10

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#22 2006-11-26 21:46:29

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#23 2006-12-05 09:06:46

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#24 2006-12-05 20:14:26

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

#25 2006-12-06 06:24:04

Re: Time to get rid of XMMS?

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