Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

mgunt5 · 2024-07-30 12:38:39

I have been seeing and hearing content all over the web about how Arch can be “unstable” when you install some updates, and that the Arch Linux community is allegedly unhelpful and tends to blame the end user for system breakage. One of my biggest fears with using Arch Linux is installing an update that breaks my system. I heard that “manual intervention” can always fix these problems, but there is not a lot of information about the notion of "updates causing system breakage" besides the FUD (fear, uncertainty, and doubt) text content and viral memes about how "Arch is so unstable when you update BTW".

Couldn't I install Arch Linux with a BTRFS file system (file system which supports system snapshots), and use a tool such as Timeshift to regularly create and manage system snapshots, so that in the event an update breaks my system, I can load up a live ISO image of Arch, and restore to a known good system snapshot, in order to fix a broken system due to an update? Some people argued that manual intervention is still needed in some cases where a package is fundamentally changed (i.e., akin to the implementation of systemd to the Arch Stable repository) because system snapshots might not resolve the underlying problem causing the breakage.

I am not sure if this issue of "updates possibly breaking my system" is misinformation from people who hate the Arch community, or if there is some truth to it.

gromit · 2024-07-30 12:44:41

Well when you start out it's more likely that you break something that you don't immediately know how to fix, so yes often it's the users fault.. If however you break something you can always post on IRC or the BBS to maybe get a second pairs of eyes to your issue ..

Some times of course the Arch Package Maintainers also mess up, but often times it cannot be blames on us In any case it does not hurt to have some way of rolling back your system via snapper or timeshift!

Last edited by gromit (2024-07-30 12:45:42)

Trilby · 2024-07-30 12:54:11

mgunt5 wrote:

there is not a lot of information about the notion of "updates causing system breakage" besides the FUD...

Okay - so doesn't that answer your own question?

Every system can have issues, but in nearly 15 years of using arch linux on several machines, including servers, I've had far far fewer problems with updates than I have with literally every single other distro or OS I've ever used.

The difference is the arch community expects users to participate in finding solutions. Every so often someone comes to these forums with a problem that we would be happy to help with, but they refuse to provide any diagnostic information that is requested of them, and instead they spend all their effort having a tantrum demanding someone just magically fix their system when they've not even described the symptoms. Often this turns to them insulting the community and getting their thread closed. They then run to redit, or tiktok, or wherever people go now to talk trash about the arch community.

Here's a better metric: look at the activity on the arch forums, mailing lists, and wiki; then compare this to the activity on other distros' support channels. We are not all here because arch breaks all the time (only our bug tracker does).

Nikolai5 · 2024-07-30 14:05:06

Just popping in to say Timeshift works on Ext4 using rsync, btrfs isn't mandatory.

I my experience I've found Arch to be no more unstable than any other distribution I've used in the past, that includes LTS style 'stable' distros. I've not had an unstable experience with any system to the point where I've flipped the table and retreated to Windows. I've had some annoyances, but that's it.

Currently dealing with a possible kernel regression or xwayland issue, so I'm running a kernel two minor versions out of date, and it's causing performance issues, annoying but has nothing to do with Arch as every distro uses both the kernel as you can imagine and xwayland.

People here are very helpful if you're willing to help yourself and followed the wiki when installing your system. The bad impression will have come from people who installed Arch from some random guide or script and now their system doesn't work, because they didn't spend a little bit of time reading the wiki, basically if you've installed via some crazy script, or are not even running Arch (see arch based distros) then you won't get help here. Otherwise you likely will, but understand that not everyone will know the answer to your question so you might get a lot of post reads but if nobody replies straight away, its because they don't know, I've seen people complain about that as well. I like to help out on the forum but my brain no big, so not always have answer.

So in short, yes you can get issues, but no more than any other distro. I think a lot of people are put off with your very same concerns, just be prepared to take a bit of time to read some wiki articles and take your time.
I use Arch on my main desktop, that I use for everything including my full time job and so far it has not failed me.

cryptearth · 2024-07-30 14:10:33

mgunt5 wrote:

when you install some updates

as Arch is a constant rolling update a lot can change from yesterday to tomorrow - whenever you install new software: do a full system update first - whenever you want to update some software: don't do partial updates - do full system updates

Nikolai5 · 2024-07-30 14:17:42

Forgot to mention if you wanna be safe, yeah never do partial updates as cryptearth said, only -Syu, stick with pacman and not an AUR helper like yay.

Some people get issues because they ignore the warnings and advice on this page: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Pacman
After they've replaced half of their system libraries with AUR equivalents using yay.

Also read this page: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/System_maintenance It's not very long.

ewaller · 2024-07-30 16:53:11

I might also add that updating often keeps update headaches to a minimum. I can count on one hand the number of breakages I have had in 15 years of using Arch Linux. Those occasions invariably had announcements about how to resolve this.

Arch Linux

#1 2024-07-30 12:38:39

Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#2 2024-07-30 12:44:41

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#3 2024-07-30 12:54:11

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#4 2024-07-30 14:05:06

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#5 2024-07-30 14:10:33

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#6 2024-07-30 14:17:42

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

#7 2024-07-30 16:53:11

Re: Concerned about updates breaking my Arch Linux installation.

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