updatedb can not find group 'locate'

psyspy80 · 2008-03-15 11:11:36

Hi,

I just merged all my .pacnew files after i updated the initial arch installation and I get this when I run updatedb:

updatedb: can not find group 'locate'

what exactly do i have to do?

shining · 2008-03-15 11:14:56

Did you really *merge* the files instead of overwriting them?
Overwriting the group file is not really a great idea.

psyspy80 · 2008-03-15 11:17:57

yes, I actually overwrote the group file since it was a brand new installation and i haven't edited the group file yet. was that a mistake? what should i do now?

psyspy80 · 2008-03-15 12:10:38

ok, i resolved the issue myself. here is what i did:

i reinstalled mlocate (what you would NOT have to do if you had the same problem) and this caused the addition of this line to /etc/group:

locate:x:21:

if you have the same problem, simply add this line to your /etc/group and it works.

Now i need some related advice. as i stated above i have overwritten /etc/group with /etc/group.pacnew after a brand-new arch installation and this has caused the problem. by overwriting the old file, are there any other groups i would have deleted and should not have done so? (if it helps: my old /etc/group was from the 2007.08-2 cd, the new one is from an update 2 days ago)

further, i wonder if what happened to me was not a bug? i mean, if i have a clean installation (for the record, i also installed wireless-tools, madwifi and yaourt but that makes no difference, i presume?) which adds the locate group to /etc/group to make everything work (and without my consent), why is this group not present in the /etc/group.pacnew file? The locate database is part of the base system so why is this group not included anyway in the newest 'group' file?

Thanks to everyone who has read and dealt with my issue.

really great to be part of this community

CU

psyspy80

Allan · 2008-03-15 12:28:42

When you installed mlocate in your initial install it added the locate group. Then you updated filesystem which gave you a new /etc/group(.pacnew) which you just moved over. The filesystem package does not know whether you have mlocate installed or not... So this is not a bug in pacman, rather that you should have been more careful in merging the pacnew file.

psyspy80 · 2008-03-15 14:23:12

Hi Allan,

nice to have you here and thx for joining this discussion.

So this is not a bug in pacman

I did not mean to suggest that there was a bug in pacman but the update to 'groups' seemed flawed to me. Here are some reasons why i think so:

The new fstab introduced mounting cds and dvds in /media/ instead of /mnt/. Hence the update fstab.pacnew; in this fstab.pacnew, there are the mountpoints for the cd and dvd drives but not for the harddisk. this seems logical because i edited the fstab during the installation process to my own needs.

The group file, however, is not edited during the installation process. hence, it will be the same file in any new installation. i concluded that the new group file removed the locate group because it was not needed any more. this was the same for the loop interface in rc.conf:

the interface lo used to be in rc.conf but after the update it is not in there because it is not needed anymore. do you see the analogy? how do i know that something is not there because it has been removed intentionally or that something is not there because i have to add it myself? so far i thought like this: if i changed it myself, i have to add it because it was my alteration. this does not work in our case.

further, it seems inconsistent that other groups are included:
How do you explain that the 'games' group is in there by default but not the 'locate' group?

Is that because all my examples are part of the filesystem package? I am really confused.

This tread is not meant to be a complaint but part of my learning and understanding process so please, anyone who answers this, do not tell me again to be more careful but explain to me why my argumentation is wrong.

Last edited by psyspy80 (2008-03-15 14:28:26)

Allan · 2008-03-15 14:49:01

Hmmm, maybe the locate group should be included by default. mlocate is part of the base package set which everyone is expect to have installed so... I'd say this is worthy of a feature request to the bug tracker if you want. As an aside, in reality, "you" did edit /etc/groups when you installed mlocate (as part of the base install) but it was done in the background.

While trying not to say "be more careful", I will explain a bit about how Arch works. Arch is "simple" in terms of configuration is all done by editing files rather than guis and it expects you to do most of the configuration yourself. So this is a different definition of "simple" than used by some other distributions. When important configuration files get installed as .pacnew files, it is expected that the users look at them and make any necessary changes. This really comes around because of the rolling release system in Arch. With a stable package set, you only need to configure your system at intstall/major update. With Arch it happens more regularly. This does make Arch a bit of a learning curve for new users but really help you get to know what you are doing on your system.

If you are unsure about an addition/removal in a configuration file, you have the choice of experimenting or asking on the forums/mailing list/IRC. Really major changes are list of the main Arch pages so you are usually fine experimenting. You can always backup the files before you make the changes just in case...

shining · 2008-03-15 15:00:48

psyspy80 wrote:

the interface lo used to be in rc.conf but after the update it is not in there because it is not needed anymore. do you see the analogy? how do i know that something is not there because it has been removed intentionally or that something is not there because i have to add it myself? so far i thought like this: if i changed it myself, i have to add it because it was my alteration. this does not work in our case.
further, it seems inconsistent that other groups are included:
How do you explain that the 'games' group is in there by default but not the 'locate' group?
Is that because all my examples are part of the filesystem package? I am really confused.
This tread is not meant to be a complaint but part of my learning and understanding process so please, anyone who answers this, do not tell me again to be more careful but explain to me why my argumentation is wrong.

I see what you mean, and you are right : some config files are harder to deal with because they are not only edited by the user, they also need to be edited during the installation of some programs. This is the case with /etc/group, but also /etc/ld.so.conf , /etc/shells . Maybe files like hosts and resolv.conf can be automatically configured by some apps too.
But well, there is no real solution to this problem, you need to know your system.

Now, about your particular locate group problem. I am not sure it should be added to the default group file, because this group is rather specific, and is only used by the locate package.
Well, there are actually two providers of locate : mlocate in core and rlocate in community, but that is still only 2, and they can deal with the locate group themselves if they need it.
Also mlocate is only in core, not in base, so it is not necessarily installed.
On the other hand, the games group is much more general, and could be used by a variety of packages. So it makes more sense to have it by default in my opinion.

Well, anyway, that was just a guess. Maybe there is no explanation why this is the case, and locate could be a default group. Or maybe there is another explanation I am missing. So probably you could file a feature request to find out

Last edited by shining (2008-03-15 15:01:59)

Allan · 2008-03-15 15:09:34

shining wrote:

Also mlocate is only in core, not in base, so it is not necessarily installed.

Oops... I just realized that not everything in core/base category is part of the "base" package group.

Last edited by Allan (2008-03-15 15:09:50)

psyspy80 · 2008-03-15 15:17:07

thanks for all the patience !

As an aside, in reality, "you" did edit /etc/groups when you installed mlocate (as part of the base install) but it was done in the background.

i really should have thought about that.

mlocate is only in core, not in base, so it is not necessarily installed.

now we are getting somewhere. however, why do i have it installed if i did only a base installation? is that because i agreed to pacman when it asked me during the update if i want mlocate to replace slocate?

but even if so, does not also slocate (which IS part of base???) rely on the locate group?

just to be sure, do you think i have deleted some other groups as well?

right now i have:

root
bin
daemon
sys
adm
tty
disk
lp
mem
kmem
wheel
ftp
mail
uucp
log
locate
smmsp
games
network
video
audio
optical
floppy
storage
power
nobody
users

thanks for helping!

dyscoria · 2008-03-15 15:29:31

Those are the groups that I have and excluding others I have due to installation (eg. hal and dbus groups) or for my user (group with my username as its name).

shining · 2008-03-15 15:45:25

Allan wrote:

shining wrote:
Also mlocate is only in core, not in base, so it is not necessarily installed.
Oops... I just realized that not everything in core/base category is part of the "base" package group.

I only checked using pacman, so I could only see the group, not the category. I now see where the confusion came from. It's weird indeed.

Arch Linux

#1 2008-03-15 11:11:36

updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#2 2008-03-15 11:14:56

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#3 2008-03-15 11:17:57

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#4 2008-03-15 12:10:38

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#5 2008-03-15 12:28:42

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#6 2008-03-15 14:23:12

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#7 2008-03-15 14:49:01

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#8 2008-03-15 15:00:48

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#9 2008-03-15 15:09:34

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#10 2008-03-15 15:17:07

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#11 2008-03-15 15:29:31

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

#12 2008-03-15 15:45:25

Re: updatedb can not find group 'locate'

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