Archlinux and you

Mr.Elendig · 2008-05-09 14:56:48

Lately there has been a "disturbing" trend. You all know what I'm talking about.
Some of the reason is that the user base has increased a lot during the past year or two. Another reason is where those users are coming from. Arch wasn't created for the masses. It was created for a relatively small group of people who shared a common mindset. It was created to fill a niche, not to be a "jack of all trades".
And most important: It was created for users that care about it. Who are willing to make it work.

So, I went ahead and wrote down some of my thoughts about the relationship between arch and it's users:

Note from the author:
This is not your typical wiki page. It's not a guide, it's something that are supposed to make you think. I could write 500 lines on this, but I'm going to keep it short. After all, it won't help if you fall asleep halfway trough.
Archlinux and you
Using arch is the same as having a relationship with a human being.
This may be the most important thing to remember. Always keep it in the back of your mind.
Like any relationship, it will demand something of you, but it will also give you a lot in return.
Before you install arch, you should ask yourself:
Do I really want to commit myself?
Am I willing to sacrifice time and energy on the relationship?
Do I got what it takes to make the relationship work?
As with "real life" relationships, there are good times and bad times. There is also things that you love about your partner, and things you hate. It's perfectly ok to criticize your partner. If you feel he/she/it should change some behavior, then tell the partner. Keeping it inn will only make it worse in the long run. But, and this is really important, this works both ways. You also have to be willing to adapt. A one sided relationship will never work. Work it out together. Listen to you partner, and never force you issue.
Another important thing to keep in mind: If the relationship is doomed, don't hold on to it with all your might. It will only cause pain and grief for you both. Sometimes "moving on" is the only real choice. Don't be bitter about it. Remember both the good and the bad times, and use the experience in your next relationship.
Help your partner
Hold on to this one with your life. Always help your partner when needed. You did, after all, commit yourself in the first place. It's what relationships are all about, working together. Your partner is probably sacrificing a lot for your sake, you should do the same.
If you realize that you can't, then maybe it's best to break the relationship, before it turns bad. But think twice before you do so. Maybe the sacrifice isn't as big as you first thought. Maybe there is another approach you can take to make it work.

End note:
Archlinux was/is created, maintained and developed, by free will, by sacrificing time, energy and money. Before you start demanding something from it, you should ask yourself: What have I done for arch? Do I really have the right to this from it?
Remember, all good relationships goes both ways.

Source:
http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Archlinux_and_you

aRcHaTe · 2008-05-09 15:15:50

man...this sounds sick to me....relationships..wtf are u taking about??!!? XD

Mikko777 · 2008-05-09 15:18:38

You really need to start drinking more alcohol, honey!

Anyways, what you said is correct its just too simple, the real problem is/was that the balance between demanding/contributing/receiving. ^^

finferflu · 2008-05-09 15:20:42

Hmm, very interesting. I never thought about a "relationship" with a distro. However, I believe this is true for anything with which you need to spend extensive time: your own interaction is half of that relationship.

Curiously, it reminded me of tamagotchi

Theoden · 2008-05-09 15:27:08

M
A
N t
h
T r a
h e n
i d
s r u
i s
i e u
s w a
l
!!

WTF????

--Theoden

Last edited by Theoden (2008-05-09 15:28:47)

Mr.Elendig · 2008-05-09 15:31:36

From the replies so far, I conclude that 3/4 of the arch users fail at logic and abstract thinking.

Edit: Or that they can't handle anything but spoon feeding

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2008-05-09 15:32:23)

Theoden · 2008-05-09 15:34:11

Mr.Elendig wrote:

From the replies so far, I conclude that 3/4 of the arch users fail at logic and abstract thinking.
Edit: Or that they can't handle anything but spoon feeding

Or perhaps - the very same replies indicate that you failed in using such a strange and very strained analogy.

--Theoden

Last edited by Theoden (2008-05-09 15:34:43)

adlucem · 2008-05-09 15:38:52

A more appropriate phrasing would be "Archlinux and I, Mr.Elendig"

Last edited by adlucem (2008-05-09 15:41:37)

Mr.Elendig · 2008-05-09 15:47:02

Theoden wrote:

Or perhaps - the very same replies indicate that you failed in using such a strange and very strained analogy.
--Theoden

Supricingly, I'm not the first one to use this analogy about software projects. And if you sit down and think on it for more than 10 seconds, it do make sence to use it. The important thing is to not try to directly compare the two, but to look at the similarities.

When you are using a piece of software, you should adapt to the way it works, but you should also submit ideas or changes, that makes it easier and better to work with.

Edit: If you go to the extreme end either way, you won't be happy. If you only try to adapt to the software, you will end up hating it quirks and strange ways, if you only go and rant about how it fails and how it should work, nothing will really change, and you won't get any work done.

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2008-05-09 15:51:58)

dolby · 2008-05-09 15:54:43

I knew i should have bought a FU drive when i had the chance

Theoden · 2008-05-09 15:55:41

Mr.Elendig wrote:

Theoden wrote:
Or perhaps - the very same replies indicate that you failed in using such a strange and very strained analogy.
--Theoden
Supricingly, I'm not the first one to use this analogy about software projects. And if you sit down and think on it for more than 10 seconds, it do make sence to use it. The important thing is to not try to directly compare the two, but to look at the similarities.
When you are using a piece of software, you should adapt to the way it works, but you should also submit ideas or changes, that makes it easier and better to work with.

First - whether you are the first or the fortieth person to use this silly analogy, it is still strange and it is still strained at best.

Second - I did think about it for more than 10 seconds, and assuming that I didn't prior to my response is both elitist and wrong.

Third - Your last paragraph is the only thing you've said on this topic that actually is appropriate and makes sense. Frankly, I got the point - I just thought (and still do) that you destroyed it in the silliness of your analogy - as evidenced by the responses that you've had so far.

Sometimes, it makes more sense to just briefly, and cogently, and succinctly state a point and leave it at that. To bury it beyond hope in a syrupy and silly analogy is counter-productive.

--Theoden

Allan · 2008-05-09 15:56:15

For some reason that reminded me of this quote:
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'

Now for a constructive comment! I see where you were trying to go with your analogy. It does still seem a bit strange to me though. I'm am having trouble putting my finger on the exact reason why... The indirect comparison of a Linux distribution to a human is maybe just too weird for my liking.

rson451 · 2008-05-09 15:56:28

You guys beat him up over this but he makes a good point. Arch gives you back what you put into it. If you aren't willing to put some work in, arch most likely is going to give you what you expect.

Sigi · 2008-05-09 16:12:15

Allan wrote:

For some reason that reminded me of this quote:
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
Now for a constructive comment! I see where you were trying to go with your analogy. It does still seem a bit strange to me though. I'm am having trouble putting my finger on the exact reason why... The indirect comparison of a Linux distribution to a human is maybe just too weird for my liking.

While I agree to your opinion about the comparison of a Linux distro to a human being, the analogy is still quite accurate. Arch - you get what you make out of it.

Misbah · 2008-05-09 16:34:10

deleted

Last edited by Misbah (2012-02-14 04:22:19)

Mr.Elendig · 2008-05-09 16:43:28

Misbah, alot of people take their relationship with their car far more serious than the one with their gf >_>

Also, it's not just the code. It's the developers, tu's, community.

Arch isn't just a piece of software, it's also the community of people using and mantaining that software. And that's why the relationship analogy works.
One of my points is that you shoudn't treat it as just a piece of code, because it's mutch more than that.

The community are one of the main reasons I use arch. And that's what we have to protect and care for, not just the code itself.

E.g. without the community the wiki would probably not exist.

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2008-05-09 16:44:44)

finferflu · 2008-05-09 16:46:51

Everything has got a soul... Now we only gotta find out where.

EDIT: just read the above comment, and I totally agree. A distro is more than lines of code, it follows a philosophy, and I could compare it more to a religion than anything else. By religion I mean that it transcends its pragmatic use, and one can even find traces of rituals. Even helping out in a forum can be understood as a sort of ritual. Without idealism, pragmatism gets nowhere, I believe.

Now, if you excuse me, I'm going back to my quest for Arch's soul.

Mr.Elendig · 2008-05-09 16:48:56

finferflu wrote:

Everything has got a soul... Now we only gotta find out where.

it's in the shell, obviously, everyone knows that.

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2008-05-09 16:49:11)

bslagowski · 2008-05-09 16:58:21

Mr.Elendig wrote:

it's in the shell, obviously, everyone knows that.

It must be a pretty beat down soul then because my shell does exactly what I tell it to, no questions asked!! I broke that baby's spirit mighty fast.

Last edited by bslagowski (2008-05-09 16:58:44)

finferflu · 2008-05-09 17:00:47

Mr.Elendig wrote:

finferflu wrote:
Everything has got a soul... Now we only gotta find out where.
it's in the shell, obviously, everyone knows that.

> soul
zsh: command not found: soul

You sure?

kensai · 2008-05-09 17:06:02

Am I weird as well? Cause I can make perfect sense of what he wrote. Remember, one reads and think about what you are reading, unfortunately most people just read.

Cerebral · 2008-05-09 17:22:30

*shrug* What he wrote made perfect sense to me.

sweiss · 2008-05-09 17:36:09

I pretty much understand what you mean. Though I still find the analogy a bit funny.
Every project has its ups and downs.

schivmeister · 2008-05-09 17:45:48

Consider Free Software. Consider the GPL. When you think about those, Mr.Elendig is just trying to remind you of a few obvious points in a manner which does not violate the KISS principle, yet abstains from trigerring a comparison between prose and poetry. Why such an approach? Well, because it simply makes you think. Why think? Well, you shouldn't take anything for granted. If you think "thinking over computers" is a waste of time, you're probably taking your computer for granted. It's not a good thing, it's psychologically and ethically unhealthy.

Wait..WTF, right? Not really, you may just be in need of simplified equations:

Using arch is the same as having a relationship with a human being.
You may find it disturbing, but many other (material) things in this world have also been compared this way. It's not to say that "look, here's something you should really really spend all of your time with," but rather "hey, appreciate it, like it, love it, love yourself."

When you spend a good amount of time carving on wood, painting on canvas - or let's get closer to our field - building a customised computer, you sort of build a "relationship" alongside too. You will treasure that computer, because you got it built for your purposes, your way. Relationship in this context is in some way similar to a natural (human) relationship, hence the term being used ever since Archimedes hugged a Pi (yes, this one's a joke but you get the point). As a musician, I have a relationship with my guitars, my musical instruments, in the same way.

Actually it's not something new. Look at all the Mac "lovers", the serious ones at least. They will claim it too, that they "love" their Macs. I've got a friend who really takes the time to clean her Macbook daily, and I can tell that she shares a certain bond with that piece of plastic and electronic circuitry. Free software has the same essence. When you're given full rights to own something, like a DIY'ed computer or some other object, you will naturally "feel" the relation you have with it.

finferflu · 2008-05-09 17:49:14

schivmeister, you should give us another history lesson, maybe....

Arch Linux

#1 2008-05-09 14:56:48

Archlinux and you

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Re: Archlinux and you

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