Low Quality Packages?

SpookyET · 2008-06-10 06:21:24

I've noticed that some packages are missing dependencies or information about optional dependencies in the install file.

Some packages are done however the packager sees fit as opposed to how the developer wanted it to be packaged. As said above, I'm talking about dependencies, configure flags, etc.

This is why I suppose that some people say that we have low quality packages, especially in AUR. Though, some are in extra.

bangkok_manouel · 2008-06-10 06:42:26

most efficient way: http://bugs.archlinux.org/

SpookyET · 2008-06-10 06:50:27

bangkok_manouel wrote:

most efficient way: http://bugs.archlinux.org/

Not really. It's a trend, not one package.

Purch · 2008-06-10 07:07:56

How can a packager improve their package, if they dont know what it is missing or what could be done to improve it? Tell them and they learn.

bangkok_manouel · 2008-06-10 07:10:05

So let's make a wiki article of deficient packages that will be associated to a bug report. Both of us know this thread alone will not improve anything.

Allan · 2008-06-10 07:10:55

Any package with missing dependencies is bug worthy, or if its in the AUR add a comment. If you don't report it, how is the maintainer supposed to know they missed it?

shining · 2008-06-10 08:47:55

SpookyET wrote:

bangkok_manouel wrote:
most efficient way: http://bugs.archlinux.org/
Not really. It's a trend, not one package.

This kind of post makes me sick for the whole day.

neotuli · 2008-06-10 08:52:46

SpookyET wrote:

bangkok_manouel wrote:
most efficient way: http://bugs.archlinux.org/
Not really. It's a trend, not one package.

All I read was "It's really broke, and I'll gladly bitch, kick, and scream so long as it isn't me who needs to actually fix it one package at a time".

Actually, let me just be blunt. Do something or quit yer bitching.

Stefan Husmann · 2008-06-10 09:45:52

SpookyET wrote:

bangkok_manouel wrote:
most efficient way: http://bugs.archlinux.org/
Not really. It's a trend, not one package.

At least you should give us a list of packages you have in mind, and the reason why you think they are of low quality. Just complaining does not help.

Stoffi · 2008-06-10 12:36:53

I remember having encounterd this with at least one package, but I can't remembber which.
maybe sombody not being me can create a wiki page for this, and then somebody like me can
add a defect package to a list there when we encounter it

shining · 2008-06-10 12:45:47

I don't know if a wiki page for this is a good idea. It seems to me that a specific dependency problem in a package should be assigned to its packager, and then it's up to him to acknowledge the issue and fix it.
The best way for official packages is to report a bug which will eventually be assigned to the packager, and for AUR/unsupported, AUR comments.
What might be more useful on a wiki page is some general guidelines or tips or explanations about configure flags, dependencies and optional dependencies.
This is all IMO, and I could be wrong.

Allan · 2008-06-10 12:59:15

I agree. A wiki page would be less helpful than a forum post to report a missing dependency. Developers may scan the forums regularly and still miss specific posts, but I doubt they go through the new wiki pages. Submit bug report or AUR comments for missing deps.

wonder · 2008-06-10 13:12:17

in fact submiting on bug tracker doesn't solve anything. i posted a few months ago about a missing dependency in meld but seams that another package need a recommend. but nobody fix it.

http://bugs.archlinux.org/task/9410

devs aren't that active like in the past.

Last edited by wonder (2008-06-10 13:13:39)

shining · 2008-06-10 13:14:09

Allan wrote:

I agree. A wiki page would be less helpful than a forum post to report a missing dependency. Developers may scan the forums regularly and still miss specific posts, but I doubt they go through the new wiki pages. Submit bug report or AUR comments for missing deps.

Yeah, but even in the case of a wiki page that was well known by everyone, my reasoning was that each of this problem is specific, and should be resolved individually by the according packager. And that is what happens with bug report, the tasks are assigned to the relevant people.

Gullible Jones · 2008-06-10 13:18:47

wonder wrote:

in fact submiting on bug tracker doesn't solve anything. i posted a few months ago about a missing dependency in meld but seams that another package need a recommend. but nobody fix it.
http://bugs.archlinux.org/task/9410
devs aren't that active like in the past.

Thank the AUR cleanup. It seems to be eating a lot of time and effort.

shining · 2008-06-10 13:29:02

wonder wrote:

in fact submiting on bug tracker doesn't solve anything. i posted a few months ago about a missing dependency in meld but seams that another package need a recommend. but nobody fix it.
http://bugs.archlinux.org/task/9410
devs aren't that active like in the past.

1) Just because one bug is not resolved yet, that means submitting on the bug tracker is useless? Please cut the crap.
2) I find the comments on that bug rather confusing, so blame the users
3) I regularly see some users saying : I would like to contribute but I don't have the time.
Do you seriously think devs don't have a job and a life?
They have all an awful amount of tasks to do, and do their best in their very limited time.

Any user is welcome to gain experience and knowledge, and eventually apply as a TU or even a dev to help.

Allan · 2008-06-10 13:35:26

Gullible Jones wrote:

Thank the AUR cleanup. It seems to be eating a lot of time and effort.

What? You mean this: http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/AUR_CleanUp_Day ? That took up a bit of my time (I still haven't got it finished...), but I suspect it took up very little of anybody else's. In fact, apart from Snowman, I don't think another dev even touched that list.

wonder · 2008-06-10 14:14:04

shining wrote:

1) Just because one bug is not resolved yet, that means submitting on the bug tracker is useless? Please cut the crap.
2) I find the comments on that bug rather confusing, so blame the users
3) I regularly see some users saying : I would like to contribute but I don't have the time.
Do you seriously think devs don't have a job and a life?
They have all an awful amount of tasks to do, and do their best in their very limited time.
Any user is welcome to gain experience and knowledge, and eventually apply as a TU or even a dev to help.

1) i complain because that bug is a minor one and can be fix in 5 minutes. if where a difficult and complex bug then is worth taking that time.
2) you don't understand it because that bug was open, closed and then reopen because he didn't fix the problem. and messages comes in that period.
3) if i didn't want to contribute then i never open that bug in the first place because i fix it for me. but i care that others should have the best quality of that package.

I don't want to bitch about that anymore. i apologise because i raise that subject. it seems that users aren't allowed to complain about anything linked with devs.

Last edited by wonder (2008-06-10 14:20:22)

finferflu · 2008-06-10 15:01:11

This discussion is already on risky ground, so I hope you would not like to drag it to some even more dodgy status.
All I can see here is a discussion that goes along the lines of "Yes, it is!", "No, it is not!".
Please try to be constructive: there are many ways to say the same thing.

Redroar · 2008-06-10 15:18:46

Well, the maintainer's email is in the package info....so couldn't you just cut straight to the source and email a plain and simple "Package x in missing dependency y, please fix"

I imagine that would fix it pretty quickly, and if you gave a list of missing deps it would take very little effort from the dev/TU to modify the pkgbuild. I mean, I assume that's the reason their emails are in the packages in the first place....I just think that a bug report is too broad, and too likely to get overlooked compared to other things on that list.

Mr.Elendig · 2008-06-10 15:26:09

Redroar wrote:

Well, the maintainer's email is in the package info....so couldn't you just cut straight to the source and email a plain and simple "Package x in missing dependency y, please fix"
I imagine that would fix it pretty quickly, and if you gave a list of missing deps it would take very little effort from the dev/TU to modify the pkgbuild. I mean, I assume that's the reason their emails are in the packages in the first place....I just think that a bug report is too broad, and too likely to get overlooked compared to other things on that list.

A bug report does the same. The maintainer is notified by email when a new bug are opened, and when there are new comments on it. Nothing stops you from sending an email directly to the maintainer, but if it concerns a bug, it should be put on the flyspray too.

shining · 2008-06-10 15:28:20

Redroar wrote:

Well, the maintainer's email is in the package info....so couldn't you just cut straight to the source and email a plain and simple "Package x in missing dependency y, please fix"
I imagine that would fix it pretty quickly, and if you gave a list of missing deps it would take very little effort from the dev/TU to modify the pkgbuild. I mean, I assume that's the reason their emails are in the packages in the first place....I just think that a bug report is too broad, and too likely to get overlooked compared to other things on that list.

I still see several advantages using the bug tracker. The problems can be discussed when they are not obvious, everyone can see the problem was reported, the task can be assigned to multiple maintainers (for example, in the case that the normal maintainer is temporarily available, for example in holidays or whatever), etc..

Misfit138 · 2008-06-10 15:30:32

wonder wrote:

I don't want to bitch about that anymore. i apologise because i raise that subject. it seems that users aren't allowed to complain about anything linked with devs.

I don't think you need to apologize, and I think I understand your point.
It is human nature to focus on what needs to be fixed, and the bug tracker is there for that very purpose. Communicating what is wrong and leaving it to other people to fix can be frustrating if they have other priorities, etc., so I see where you are coming from.
Personally, I am most certainly not qualified to serve as a dev, though I would also most certainly reach out for the opportunity if I were.
I guess we are all trying to do our part, since Arch is an independently developed community distro.

Redroar · 2008-06-10 16:36:20

That makes sense. I agree, bug tracker makes sense...I was unaware that the maintainer was automatically notified if a bug falls under their jurisdiction.

wonder · 2008-06-10 16:51:40

Misfit138 i was ironical.
i think i'm not understanding how devs are working.
a developer fix and maintain only their packages or developers can fix bugs from all packages?

Arch Linux

#1 2008-06-10 06:21:24

Low Quality Packages?

#2 2008-06-10 06:42:26

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#3 2008-06-10 06:50:27

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#4 2008-06-10 07:07:56

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#5 2008-06-10 07:10:05

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#6 2008-06-10 07:10:55

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#7 2008-06-10 08:47:55

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#8 2008-06-10 08:52:46

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#9 2008-06-10 09:45:52

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#10 2008-06-10 12:36:53

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#11 2008-06-10 12:45:47

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#12 2008-06-10 12:59:15

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#13 2008-06-10 13:12:17

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#14 2008-06-10 13:14:09

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#15 2008-06-10 13:18:47

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#16 2008-06-10 13:29:02

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#17 2008-06-10 13:35:26

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#18 2008-06-10 14:14:04

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#19 2008-06-10 15:01:11

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#20 2008-06-10 15:18:46

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#21 2008-06-10 15:26:09

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#22 2008-06-10 15:28:20

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#23 2008-06-10 15:30:32

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#24 2008-06-10 16:36:20

Re: Low Quality Packages?

#25 2008-06-10 16:51:40

Re: Low Quality Packages?

Board footer