Checking out some WMs, need advice

Ranguvar · 2008-10-15 02:27:30

I'm switching back from KDE 4 because of some instabilities, and because of curiosity for other DE/WMs. Openbox, Fluxbox, Enlightenment, IceWM, etc. - they all interest me.

I have a fast PC (Q6600, 4GB RAM, NVIDIA 9600GT) so I can afford to splurge wherever on visual effects.

What I'd really like to know is, do any of those I listed above (or an entirely different one) have features that enable one to work with their computer faster? Any odds and ends of ideas that you find work well? I must confess, I do like the integration and smooth feel to KDE, GNOME, etc., so I need a bit of persuasion to truly consider any of these others. Any users of those WMs out there, as long as the reason is not (mostly) speed, why do you use that WM over a full DE? What benefits are there?

Thanks!

MarCustomized · 2008-10-15 02:30:09

Use Openbox. It has built-in, easily programmable keybindings. Nuff said.

Ghost1227 · 2008-10-15 02:33:03

Openbox FTW!!! Just check out the screenshots in the screenshot forum!

koch · 2008-10-15 02:35:37

http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=56396

think there was more but can't find it at the moment.

wirenik · 2008-10-15 06:29:26

I use Openbox: really flexible and easy to configure and personalize.

Gigamo · 2008-10-15 08:57:01

If you want to try a tiling WM, Awesome is worth a try ;P

ashyanbhog · 2008-10-15 09:22:12

On the other hand, if you want a WM that behaves like MS gui but is fast, try LXDE

Rasi · 2008-10-15 11:35:25

We should have something like the monthly screenshot thread...

The daily "Tell me what WM to chose" thread.

Ranguvar · 2008-10-15 14:59:16

Rasi, I don't want to be told what WM to use. I just don't have the time to try the 13 billion out there So, I'd like to hear others' opinions.

What are the differences between Openbox and Fluxbox? Fact differences, please. I heard Fluxbox is not standards-compliant... what impact does this have on daily use? Examples? And what _specific_ advantages do they hold over KDE/GNOME, besides efficiency? Can you get things done faster? How?

As for tiling WMs, what are the advantages of that in your opinion?

Lastly, I like a very clean look across all windows. KDE and GNOME have tools to theme GTK+, Qt, and wxWindows applications similarly... are 3rd-party tools available to do the same with these other WMs?

And lastly, I like the effects of Compiz Fusion very much. Can it be run as a stand-alone WM? If so, does it lack in overall functionality compared to WMs intended to be used alone?

Thanks very much!

XFire · 2008-10-15 15:19:17

I believe there is the capability of using Fusion as a stand alone WM, its in the wiki.

Personally, I have tried PekWM and fluxbox, but the best one in my opinion is openbox. With the OBMenu and the OBConfig program it makes configuring openbox easy, the configuration file is written in XML I believe and its very easy to understand. As Openbox is quite simplistic when creating themes, the fact that there is no rounded edges to date, it makes the whole interface easy to use and keeps it streamlined. As openbox has very little dependencies, compared to fusion and Gnome and KDE, its very light and you have a wide variety of other programs to use in conjunction with OB. For GTK themes and Icons, LXAppearance is the best GUI for the job.

To some up, I think Openbox is the best, as it is easy to configure, looks good, light on resources and dependencies and allows freedom of choice when using other programs.

mentallaxative · 2008-10-15 16:32:51

Rasi wrote:

We should have something like the monthly screenshot thread...

The daily "Tell me what WM to chose" thread.

That gave me an idea I'd like to implement: a window manager questionnaire, made up of a body of questions measuring various aspects of window managers a person considers important, such as ease of use, simplicity, customization, ease of customization, memory use, support & documentation, use of helper applications (eg. panels & docks), dependencies, tiling/non-tiling, aesthetics...

"Rate on a scale of 1-7, 1 being least important and 7 most important"

And each window manager could have an associated profile of where they fall on those factors. The answers to those questions would be compared to these profiles to generate a recommended list of WMs, so that people can have another way of picking what is right for them.

Sorry, I am procrastinating while I should be writing my psychology essay.

jealma · 2008-10-15 16:53:26

Why do you people find OpenBox so easy to configure? The XML files work crappy in my opinion. I currently use KDE4, before that Openbox and Fluxbox and before that KDE3. The reason why I remain with KDE4 is because of Konqueror as filemanager with integration of FTP, SFTP, etc. Openbox is very good, but it should have the kind of configuration that Fluxbox has, much easier imho.

thayer · 2008-10-15 17:22:25

jealma wrote:

Why do you people find OpenBox so easy to configure? The XML files work crappy in my opinion. I currently use KDE4, before that Openbox and Fluxbox and before that KDE3. The reason why I remain with KDE4 is because of Konqueror as filemanager with integration of FTP, SFTP, etc. Openbox is very good, but it should have the kind of configuration that Fluxbox has, much easier imho.

I assume you are aware of Obconf and Obmenu, GUI-based configuration tools for the rc.xml and menu.xml respectively. GUI applications notwithstanding, XML is a standardized language much like HTML. It is incredibly easy to understand and modify. I have no experience with fluxbox, but if it uses its own scripting language I would loathe having to learn it just to tweak my window manager.

Last edited by thayer (2008-10-15 17:23:27)

jealma · 2008-10-15 17:48:17

I don't like the graphical tools, because they f*ck up my nicely indented files. Fluxbox' config files are much more streamlined; no xml but just a single line for a single thing.
For example a menu item: [tag] (label or filename) {command or filename} <icon filename>
In OpenBox you need at least 5 lines to even get one menu item, and editing the config is becoming copy/paste work.
I like OpenBox a lot, but I would have liked it even more if it's configuration file syntax was somewhat more KISS, like that of fluxbox.

Blice · 2008-10-15 18:31:44

ashyanbhog wrote:

On the other hand, if you want a WM that behaves like MS gui but is fast, try LXDE

...What?

For one LXDE is a Desktop Environment, not a WM. Secondly, LXDE uses Openbox for a WM.

My advice is to try out both Openbox and PekWM :]

mrunion · 2008-10-15 18:32:28

I tried Open box for a couple of week a while back. I moved from Gnome to OB to see what it was like. OB wasn't bad, but yeah, the XML config stuff sucks IMHO. More "JSONish", one-liner-isms are my preference as well. XML is very verboase/bloated to do just simple things. Again, all this is my opinion, so take it for what you paid for it.

burnside · 2008-10-15 19:06:27

I'd recommend Fluxbox over Openbox simply because Flux doesn't use xml for it's config files (which I find irritating). Flux isn't fully standards compliant, but it's close enough. The only compliance issue I've encountered is windows not iconifying properly when using something like fbpanel or xfce4-panel. Flux's own titlebar is very good however and I doubt you'd find a need for a replacement. But hell, both Flux and Open are tiny downloads. Try 'em both and see what you think.

rson451 · 2008-10-15 19:09:25

I admit I've not read this entire thread, but my advice is this: it takes 2 seconds (+ download time) to install a new wm. Just install them and see what you think.

Mazon · 2008-10-15 19:45:16

Atm i use Compiz-fusion as a standalone wm

SomeGuyDude · 2008-10-15 19:54:56

If you want help converting, try out LXDE. I started there and now I'm just using OpenBox by itself. There's something immensely satisfying about the minimalist thing. I'm still doing all the same things I always did, I don't have fewer applications running, but my RAM usage dropped from upwards of 35% to 14% (out of 2GiB, so you can do the math).

The right-click menu is spiffy, pypanel is the best panel I've ever used (former Avant Window Addict), I don't miss the Compiz effects in the slightest. In a way it feels like I went from an automatic to manual transmission, in the same way the switch from Ubuntu to Arch did. Even changing the appearance involves editing text files.

Last edited by SomeGuyDude (2008-10-15 19:59:29)

Ranguvar · 2008-10-15 21:05:08

Alright, I'm going to try Openbox, PekWM, Compiz Fusion stand-alone, and others if those still don't suit me....

One last thing. One of the big things that bugged me about Firefox in KDE was how its "Open With" function worked. In Konqueror, I got my Kicker menu right there to quickly choose an app. Can I intergrate Firefox with whatever menu I end up using? Thanks!

molom · 2008-10-16 06:10:06

I can't understand why there are so many Openbox users in these forums, why not Fluxbox, isn't it pretty much the same. I'm going to use Openbox as my main WM since everyone else uses it (Since there would be more support here).

creslin · 2008-10-16 06:20:41

molom wrote:

why not Fluxbox, isn't it pretty much the same.

That's kind of its problem. It's a lot like openbox, except less polished and with slower development. A lot of fluxbox users probably did what I did and migrated to openbox at some point.

Really the only things I missed from fluxbox were vermaden's themes on box-look like java, blackened and some others.

Last edited by creslin (2008-10-16 06:27:22)

Zeist · 2008-10-16 06:28:54

Ranguvar wrote:

As for tiling WMs, what are the advantages of that in your opinion?

In my opinion tiling WMs allow you to interact with your computer more efficiently as they both allow doing window placement in a way that makes them easy to work with and they in general allow very quick keyboard control of your windows which is a speed improvement compared to having to use your mouse. Also, in the case of many tiling window managers such as Awesome, WMII, XMonad, StumpWM, DWM and many more they offer very big extensibility through some form of scripting.

(My favourite WM and my suggestion is Awesome)

molom · 2008-10-16 06:46:36

Zeist wrote:

Ranguvar wrote:
As for tiling WMs, what are the advantages of that in your opinion?
In my opinion tiling WMs allow you to interact with your computer more efficiently as they both allow doing window placement in a way that makes them easy to work with and they in general allow very quick keyboard control of your windows which is a speed improvement compared to having to use your mouse. Also, in the case of many tiling window managers such as Awesome, WMII, XMonad, StumpWM, DWM and many more they offer very big extensibility through some form of scripting.
(My favourite WM and my suggestion is Awesome)

So what would you suggest using for a person that wants the similar functionality and looks as Openbox, but is a tiling WM?

Last edited by molom (2008-10-16 06:50:19)

Arch Linux

#1 2008-10-15 02:27:30

Checking out some WMs, need advice

#2 2008-10-15 02:30:09

Re: Checking out some WMs, need advice

#3 2008-10-15 02:33:03

Re: Checking out some WMs, need advice

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#6 2008-10-15 08:57:01

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