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#1 2008-10-25 18:00:34

playdafunkimuzic
Member
Registered: 2008-10-25
Posts: 220

Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Hi,

I just installed arch, I'm ready to install openbox. I've used both kde and gnome before. I use programs for instance like pidgin, etc. How does this work, I install openbox through "pacman -S openbox" but like, do I have to install gnome/gtk or kde libaries, I see in the howto's just telling how to install openbox, but what happens if I install a gnome based program or kde based program? Is there an instant messaging client/web browser specifically for openbox. Thanks for all the help. Much appreciated.

-kenny

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#2 2008-10-25 19:10:22

Renan Birck
Member
From: Brazil
Registered: 2007-11-11
Posts: 401
Website

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

playdafunkimuzic wrote:

Hi,
but like, do I have to install gnome/gtk or kde libaries,

If you install anything that depends on them, they will be installed automatically.

but what happens if I install a gnome based program or kde based program?

The libraries will be installed as needed (i.e. they are dependencies of the GNOME/KDE-based app)

Is there an instant messaging client/web browser specifically for openbox.

I use Pidgin and Firefox respectively. Other people here may have different choices, however.

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#3 2008-10-25 19:32:34

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,544

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

"Is there an instant messaging client/web browser specifically for openbox."

Openbox is a window manager - just that. Gnome has a window manager too, Metacity. KDE's is KWin. Many people use Compiz Fusion as a replacement for those two, to provide fancy visual effects. Openbox is also a window manager. Since it's just a window manager, not a full DE (Desktop Environment) like KDE or Gnome (or Xfce, etc.), it provides functionality for managing windows, and that's it.

So, there's no apps specifically for Openbox (well, not exactly) like there are with a DE. Just grab the app that suits you best smile

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#4 2008-10-25 19:41:35

playdafunkimuzic
Member
Registered: 2008-10-25
Posts: 220

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

wow everyone is so nice & helpful here ^_^
i've used debian for many many years but i liked the whole minimalst idea..so much faster!
and it seems like openbox is really higly regarded around here so I decided it's what i'll try. so i just set up openbox, go through the config setup, so i can install the panels and conky and stuff, and then i just install whatever apps i like? that's awesome!

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#5 2008-10-25 19:44:10

kazuo
Member
From: São Paulo/Brazil
Registered: 2008-03-18
Posts: 413
Website

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

playdafunkimuzic wrote:

wow everyone is so nice & helpful here ^_^
i've used debian for many many years but i liked the whole minimalst idea..so much faster!
and it seems like openbox is really higly regarded around here so I decided it's what i'll try. so i just set up openbox, go through the config setup, so i can install the panels and conky and stuff, and then i just install whatever apps i like? that's awesome!

Yes! You choose ^_^

This is for ubuntu, but is a good guide http://urukrama.wordpress.com/openbox-guide/

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#6 2008-10-26 05:09:52

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,544

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Glad you like it here smile The power to choose absolutely everything is exhilarating, isn't it big_smile Let us know if you have problems!

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#7 2008-10-26 08:04:05

SomeGuyDude
Member
Registered: 2008-10-09
Posts: 271

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

So, forgive me if this sounds dumb, is a DE really anything other than a bunch of software? Seems to me like that's all that's going on here. I do everything roughly the same on Openbox that I did on GNOME, using the same themes and all that. Really I've only changed one piece of software: Wicd instead of network-manager. Makes me really wonder what the heck is the difference.


And in the midst of such perfection,
I can't help but feel diseased.

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#8 2008-10-26 10:35:17

celthias
Member
Registered: 2008-04-15
Posts: 83

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

SomeGuyDude wrote:

is a DE really anything other than a bunch of software?

Nope, not really. A Desktop Environment is just that, a suite of applications that all fit together, each serving a different purpose (Email Client, Web Browser, File Manager, Music Player, etc) that come together to create a functional desktop. Because of this cohesion, DEs tend to have branding (Gnome, KDE for example) and technically speaking usually share libs to provide better integration. Other than that..they really are just a bundle o' programs..

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#9 2008-10-26 11:04:07

moljac024
Member
From: Serbia
Registered: 2008-01-29
Posts: 2,676

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

celthias wrote:
SomeGuyDude wrote:

is a DE really anything other than a bunch of software?

Nope, not really. A Desktop Environment is just that, a suite of applications that all fit together, each serving a different purpose (Email Client, Web Browser, File Manager, Music Player, etc) that come together to create a functional desktop. Because of this cohesion, DEs tend to have branding (Gnome, KDE for example) and technically speaking usually share libs to provide better integration. Other than that..they really are just a bundle o' programs..

They can also provide some daemons of their own, and/or make heavy use of inter-app communication (e.g. d-bus) to be more integrated.
But really, just a bunch of software that is designed to work together.


The day Microsoft makes a product that doesn't suck, is the day they make a vacuum cleaner.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But if they tell you that I've lost my mind, maybe it's not gone just a little hard to find...

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#10 2008-10-26 14:05:54

Xyne
Administrator/PM
Registered: 2008-08-03
Posts: 6,963
Website

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

This thread might give you some inspiration for configuring openbox: http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=45692
Take a look at the suggestions made for apps in this thread too: http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=55394


My Arch Linux StuffForum EtiquetteCommunity Ethos - Arch is not for everyone

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#11 2008-10-26 20:33:10

dunc
Member
From: Glasgow, UK
Registered: 2007-06-18
Posts: 559

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

celthias wrote:
SomeGuyDude wrote:

is a DE really anything other than a bunch of software?

Nope, not really. A Desktop Environment is just that, a suite of applications that all fit together, each serving a different purpose (Email Client, Web Browser, File Manager, Music Player, etc) that come together to create a functional desktop. Because of this cohesion, DEs tend to have branding (Gnome, KDE for example) and technically speaking usually share libs to provide better integration. Other than that..they really are just a bundle o' programs..

Exactly. And if you're still using all the same programs you did when you used Gnome, in a sense you're still using Gnome, but without its usual "face" of Metacity, Gnome-panel, etc. If you run gconf-editor from a terminal window, you'll find the whole GConf system works just as it did under "real" Gnome. (Assuming you knew that it did, of course. smile That's one of the things - a unified preferences system for the "bunch of software" - that makes a DE.)


0 Ok, 0:1

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#12 2008-10-26 21:57:34

playdafunkimuzic
Member
Registered: 2008-10-25
Posts: 220

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

now, by installing openbox, and then any gnome apps i may need as i go...it'll be faster than installing gnome correct?

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#13 2008-10-26 23:22:05

SomeGuyDude
Member
Registered: 2008-10-09
Posts: 271

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

dunc wrote:

Exactly. And if you're still using all the same programs you did when you used Gnome, in a sense you're still using Gnome, but without its usual "face" of Metacity, Gnome-panel, etc. If you run gconf-editor from a terminal window, you'll find the whole GConf system works just as it did under "real" Gnome. (Assuming you knew that it did, of course. smile That's one of the things - a unified preferences system for the "bunch of software" - that makes a DE.)

Hm. Interesting. Of course, I don't have any of GNOME's libraries (or, of course, gconf-editor), I just use GTK-friendly apps like Firefox and Pidgin. As a result, my memory usage running the same tasks under OB is roughly half of what it was under GNOME. Although, admittedly, that was Ubuntu so there's a lot of other clutter cleared out.

playdafunkimuzic, I use Firefox/Pidgin/GMPC/Gimp/OpenOffice/VLC and don't use a dang one of GNOME's libraries (admittedly OOo doesn't use GTK and VLC is QT, but still).


And in the midst of such perfection,
I can't help but feel diseased.

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#14 2008-10-27 01:14:03

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,544

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

playdafunkimuzic wrote:

now, by installing openbox, and then any gnome apps i may need as i go...it'll be faster than installing gnome correct?

Likely. But, not much better than just using Gnome with Openbox as the window manager (you can do that). I try to avoid Gnome and KDE apps when using a standalone WM, since they typically carry heavy dependencies. But if there's at least one Gnome app (or KDE, or whatever) that you absolutely need, the others aren't a big problem to install since you already paid most of the dependency price. Xfce and LXDE are a lifesaver... I use a good number of their apps (like Thunar, the Xfce file manager), since they often have very few dependencies and are designed to be lightweight.

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#15 2008-10-27 21:28:31

dunc
Member
From: Glasgow, UK
Registered: 2007-06-18
Posts: 559

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Ranguvar wrote:
playdafunkimuzic wrote:

now, by installing openbox, and then any gnome apps i may need as i go...it'll be faster than installing gnome correct?

Likely. But, not much better than just using Gnome with Openbox as the window manager (you can do that). I try to avoid Gnome and KDE apps when using a standalone WM, since they typically carry heavy dependencies.

Yep. That would be my advice too (and was really the point of my comment: using only Gnome apps under Openbox is hardly any different to using full-on Gnome), but they're hard to avoid sometimes. For example, you can't install Rosegarden without KDE deps; and it's hard to choose between GnuCalc and OpenOffice for size: GnuCalc brings in Gnome stuff, but OO is OO...


0 Ok, 0:1

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#16 2008-10-27 21:43:36

playdafunkimuzic
Member
Registered: 2008-10-25
Posts: 220

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

so why is openbox so strongly favored over an environment like gnome, especially if someone will be using gtk+/gnome dependent libary apps?

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#17 2008-10-27 22:09:25

Lord Illidan
Member
From: Malta
Registered: 2007-10-25
Posts: 248

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

playdafunkimuzic wrote:

so why is openbox so strongly favored over an environment like gnome, especially if someone will be using gtk+/gnome dependent libary apps?

Because openbox is still faster and has less memory requirements than a vanilla gnome with metacity? Personally, I went down that road with Openbox, but now that I have 2G of RAM, I am using Gnome again..

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#18 2008-10-28 01:19:54

SomeGuyDude
Member
Registered: 2008-10-09
Posts: 271

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

playdafunkimuzic wrote:

so why is openbox so strongly favored over an environment like gnome, especially if someone will be using gtk+/gnome dependent libary apps?

For some reason, I think a lot of people (myself included) just like the idea of an very low-resource environment. It's fun to see if I can do all the same things and use half the power.

No joke, I swear my battery lasts ~40 minutes longer or so now that I'm on Arch with OB instead of Ubuntu with GNOME. Pretty useful when you're a student that lugs his machine to class every day.

That and GNOME tends to bring problems that I haven't had with OB. Things like Nautilus suddenly deciding it needs 500MB of memory.


And in the midst of such perfection,
I can't help but feel diseased.

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#19 2008-10-28 01:22:00

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,544

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Becuase it tends to be a good deal faster, lighter, often takes much easier to minimalist themes, etc. smile Personally, I love the feeling of building up my DE rather than using Gnome or KDE, or any of the others even. You set up your own panels, etc. You can use Gnome or KDE's panels, and other tools, but I prefer ones like PyPanel. And in the case of Gnome, Openbox is far more configurable. Gnome just lacks substance IMO smile And DEs often get in my way. With a WM and only the stuff I add, I know much more about my system, and less gets in my way, because nothing was shoved down my throat by the DE.

I have 4GB of RAM myself... I just love minimalism. I don't use Openbox, but similar. It's the Arch Way! big_smile

Last edited by Ranguvar (2008-10-28 01:22:53)

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#20 2008-10-28 01:51:29

Acecero
Member
Registered: 2008-06-21
Posts: 1,373

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

I guess the lesson here is to value quality over quantity in applications, is that about right?

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#21 2008-10-28 02:56:35

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,544

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Always! Well, quantity is often bad in apps tongue Space required, number of dependencies, etc. come to mind.

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#22 2008-10-28 16:18:35

zenos
Member
Registered: 2008-09-23
Posts: 23

Re: Just installed arch, openbox questions.

Welcome to Arch!

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