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#1 2009-03-13 00:36:59

Nazgulled
Member
Registered: 2009-03-08
Posts: 102

Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Hi,

I use Windows Vista as main OS and I'm trying to install Arch on VMware, the problem is, when I log in into the console and try to type anything else, it will crash my host system (Vista).

This is very weird because:
a) I'm running a virtual Gentoo on VMware and it doesn't freeze as Arch.
b) Arch Linux doesn't freeze the system if I use VirtualBox instead of VMware
c) I did a clean install of XP (just for testing purposes) and virtual Arch also crashed the system.

This is confusing me because:
a) Why does Gentoo work and Arch doesn't? Are there base configurations/software so different that one works and the other doesn't?
b) Why can VirtualBox handle Arch and VMware can't?
c) Even a clean install can't handle Arch on VMware? Does this mean it's something wrong in my hardware? How come if Gentoo works on VMware and VirtualBox handles Arch?

Please note that I can't use VirtualBox, I must use VMware and I would really like to use Arch instead of Gentoo. I'm trying to ditch Gentoo and use Arch but this problem is leaving me no choice than to keep using Gentoo...

Any ideas?

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#2 2009-03-13 02:32:50

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,541

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Is it that you can't use VBox, or you must use VMware? There are still other virtual machine apps.

Anyways, is it the Arch install CD that crashes, or is it Arch after it has been installed? Have you read http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Ins … _in_VMWare ?

Do you get any specific error messages from Windows? Are you using the latest version of VMware? Can you at least try VirtualBox to help isolate the problem?

This is very odd, and may actually indicate a problem with hardware, or something... a virtual machine should NOT be able to bring down the host, under any circumstances. If it can, both the OS and the virtual machine are bugged. Not too much of a surprise, but yeah.

Last edited by Ranguvar (2009-03-13 02:35:30)

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#3 2009-03-13 03:02:33

fumbles
Member
Registered: 2006-12-22
Posts: 246

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Sounds like a problem with VMware (or maybe Vista?) not Arch. Try reinstalling VMware, make sure it is at the lastest version (maybe try even roll back to the previous version), make sure Vista is updated. When you say crash, do you mean BSoD? Or does it just freeze? If it is a BSoD then what is the specific error?

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#4 2009-03-13 03:16:36

Joe_Arch
Member
Registered: 2008-11-27
Posts: 67

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

How much ram are you allocating to Arch? Counterintuitively, you might want to try lowering it. If you allocate too much your host OS freaks out.

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#5 2009-03-13 04:39:12

jacko
Member
Registered: 2007-11-23
Posts: 840

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

someone else was having this issue the other day on irc. the fact is a guest OS should NEVER even come close to crashing the host OS. So more then likely this is a bug in VMware and not arch. What arch packages that is causing the conflict with VMware is unapparent, but it's not likely a bug arch can fix.

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#6 2009-03-13 10:43:17

Nazgulled
Member
Registered: 2009-03-08
Posts: 102

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Ranguvar wrote:

Is it that you can't use VBox, or you must use VMware? There are still other virtual machine apps.

I know, but I want to use VMware. I don't like VirtualBox that much and VMware is better for me. The other virtual machine apps don't even come close to VMware, at least in my point of view. But it doesn't matter, I want to use VMware.


Ranguvar wrote:

Anyways, is it the Arch install CD that crashes, or is it Arch after it has been installed? Have you read http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Ins … _in_VMWare ?

After installation, it never crashed during the install as far as I remember.

Ranguvar wrote:

Do you get any specific error messages from Windows? Are you using the latest version of VMware? Can you at least try VirtualBox to help isolate the problem?

No specific error messages, nothing in the log files, there's nothing anywhere... Yes, I'm using the latest version. What do you mean try VirtualBox to help isolate the problem? I've already used VirtualBox, installed Arch fine and it didn't freeze.

Ranguvar wrote:

This is very odd, and may actually indicate a problem with hardware, or something... a virtual machine should NOT be able to bring down the host, under any circumstances. If it can, both the OS and the virtual machine are bugged. Not too much of a surprise, but yeah.

My thoughts exactly but how can be an hardware problem if VirtualBox works just fine? How can it be a virtual machine problem if Gentoo works fine on VMware?

fumbles wrote:

Sounds like a problem with VMware (or maybe Vista?) not Arch. Try reinstalling VMware, make sure it is at the lastest version (maybe try even roll back to the previous version), make sure Vista is updated. When you say crash, do you mean BSoD? Or does it just freeze? If it is a BSoD then what is the specific error?

It just freezes, not a BSOD. It is not a problem with Vista because it also happens on XP. Like I said on my first post, I did a clean install of XP, update all drivers and did all Windows updates, installed latest VMware version and the same thing still happened.

Joe_Arch wrote:

How much ram are you allocating to Arch? Counterintuitively, you might want to try lowering it. If you allocate too much your host OS freaks out.

I have 2Gb (2x1024Mb) installed on my laptop and I'm using just 256Mb for Arch.

jacko wrote:

someone else was having this issue the other day on irc. the fact is a guest OS should NEVER even come close to crashing the host OS. So more then likely this is a bug in VMware and not arch. What arch packages that is causing the conflict with VMware is unapparent, but it's not likely a bug arch can fix.

That was me... I'm not saying it's a bug on Arch, but it's weird that Gentoo doesn't have a problem and Arch does. They must differ somehow, one must use some package where the other doesn't or some global system configuration is different from one to the other, there must be some difference, otherwise, they both would freeze or they both would work...

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#7 2009-03-13 16:41:00

Bob_Sheep
Member
From: Scotland
Registered: 2008-10-06
Posts: 27

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

I have some advice, its not directly from me, but from a Windows and VMware loving friend (We have so far failed to convert him sad )

Tell him to download WinDbg, set it up with the MS symbol server, open the kernel crash dump, and run an !analyze -v

Last edited by Bob_Sheep (2009-03-13 16:50:40)

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#8 2009-03-14 04:12:26

Nazgulled
Member
Registered: 2009-03-08
Posts: 102

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Bob_Sheep wrote:

I have some advice, its not directly from me, but from a Windows and VMware loving friend (We have so far failed to convert him sad )

Tell him to download WinDbg, set it up with the MS symbol server, open the kernel crash dump, and run an !analyze -v

That's not possible, there is no kernel dump cause the system doesn't crash, it just freezes, stops responding, hangs, whatever you want to call it. As far as I know, for a memory dump to be created, the system must crash as BSOD and there's no BSOD of any kind...

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#9 2009-03-15 16:42:40

Nazgulled
Member
Registered: 2009-03-08
Posts: 102

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

Bob_Sheep's friend, ralish, helped me debug the problem and I used Windows Driver Verifier to produce a BSoD crash when any driver problems were identified. This happened while powering the Arch Linux virtual machine in VMware. After that, an analysis was done to the kernel crash dump with WinDbg to look for culprit. The conclusion was that the problem lies on the VMware virtualization driver.

There's nothing anyone else can do but the VMware support team. I happened to have a student license from the "VMware Academic Program" and as such, I don't have direct contact with the support team. I've already contacted my university's IT department to see if there's anyway they can contact VMware support to solve this issue.

Thanks to everyone that tried to help.

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#10 2009-03-15 19:54:35

Ranguvar
Member
Registered: 2008-08-12
Posts: 2,541

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

The only thing I can think of is that your installed Arch is loading different modules than Gentoo or the Arch install CD, and one of those is bugged and/or exposing a bug in VMware/Winodws. Again, for sure there has to be a bug in the VM/OS if a VM can crash the system itself, but that doesn't mean it's not the OS exposing that bug. Comparing the list of running modules (lsmod) across Gentoo and especially the Arch install CD to installed Arch might be helpful.

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#11 2009-03-16 00:34:24

Nazgulled
Member
Registered: 2009-03-08
Posts: 102

Re: Arch Linux freezes the whole system in VMware

The problem is that the Arch guest will crash the system before I can type "lsmod" and press return hmm

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