Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

ArchArael · 2010-01-05 13:16:04

Does anybody know if is possible to enlarge the number of commands in Commands plugin? Eleven commands are not enough for me and I wouldn't like to use xbindkeys.

EDIT: Tried to modify Default.ini file in ~/.config/compiz/compizconfig directory but it doesn't work. It seems that number of available commands is stuck on 11.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-05 13:24:22)

Chokkan · 2010-01-05 13:40:15

I had a look in the forums over on http://forum.compiz.org and from what I can gather, it isn't possible.

ArchArael · 2010-01-05 13:49:33

Chokkan wrote:

I had a look in the forums over on http://forum.compiz.org and from what I can gather, it isn't possible.

You're right. I asked to compiz developers on their irc channel and they told me that the number of commands is hard coded. If one would like to expand the number of commands one should write a patch.

Well...that's strange for me. Number of commands should be something easily expandable. Well....maybe I'll stick to xbindkeys in the end. Pity...I would like better having all configurations centralized in the ccsm.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-05 13:54:49)

sHyLoCk · 2010-01-05 13:53:23

Yes that ticked me off as well. And it's not even that mouse bindings and keyboards,edges,etc. have different sets of commands but they run the same commands just different ways of running them. Missing fluxbox hotkeys.

Last edited by sHyLoCk (2010-01-05 13:53:43)

ArchArael · 2010-01-05 14:33:33

sHyLoCk wrote:

Yes that ticked me off as well. And it's not even that mouse bindings and keyboards,edges,etc. have different sets of commands but they run the same commands just different ways of running them. Missing fluxbox hotkeys.

And I miss my openbox clunky rc.xml file. I like it although many of users in the community don't. For many things compiz is better but for other openbox is still unbeaten.

At the moment these are my personal impressions.

Compiz pros:
*Vieport Switcher
*Desktop Wall
*Expo
*Scale plugin (really really useful)
*Maximumize plugin
*Grid plugin
*Edges (Improve mouse using experience a lot, the next point is obviously )
*More mouse friendly than Openbox (less clicks for the same actions)
*Good placement algorithm, at least on single monitor

Compiz cons:
*Limited number of comands in Commands plugin (can be solved with xbindkeys but I don't like that solution)
*Cannot set the offset for moving windows by keyboard ( the x and y offset when moving is always the same and is too small)
*Windows placement algorithm is not that good (Smart mode)
*Some minor glitches (Firefox text fields sometimes messed up, but that can be only my problem, usually happens after resuming the machine)
*Edges well...it's matter of habbit but I found myself involuntarily activating Expo and Scale plugin many times
*Slows down when my hard disc is transferring huge files
*Cannot move windows between monitors using the keyboard (you have to use the mouse or trigger window moving and keep the down arrow pressed waiting until the window is moved on the other monitor)

Openbox pros:
*Placement algorithm + MoveToNorth,South,West,Ovest Actions (does what does Grid plugin in Compiz but works on two monitors)
*Highly configurable. (Example: I can set the x and y offset as I like, so moving windows with keyboard is usable and useful)
*Integrated root menu (more flexible and better than compiz-deskmenu)
*Fast window switcher (Switch between windows in all virtual desktops easely. Not fancy as in Compiz but still usable and useful. client-list-combined-menu. Actually it's visually inferior to the Scale plugin but it's more keyboard friendly)
*Dynamic virtuals desktops, create virtual desktops easely (I don't use it often but it's useful sometimes)
*GrowToNorth, South, East, West action (actually is better than Grid plugin in compiz, but I admit it maybe a matter of habbit)
*MoveResizeTo action is configurable to move windows between monitors. I use this a lot at work mapped as Super-W --> main monitor and Super-E --> laptop monitor
Example of the configuration:

<action name="MoveResizeTo">
    <!-- move the window to the second monitor -->
    <monitor>2</monitor>
  </action>

*More keyboard friendly than Compiz
*More reactive when my hard disc is transferring huge files

Openbox cons:
*Not fancy as Compiz
*Less mouse friendly than Compiz (I can do everything I do in Compiz but is less friendly, more clicks because of the lack of Compiz-like Edges)
*No Expo and Scale plugin (although client-list-combined-menu provides both functionalities in one is less usable, I mean visually)

That's all at the moment. Still wondering if is worth switching to Compiz.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-05 19:56:31)

Nagian · 2010-01-05 16:28:54

You really like the windows placement in openbox? Compiz do it much better, the new windows are only overlapping if there is really no place left.
And this GrowToX-Things have also a good implementation in Compiz, take a look at the Maximumize-Plugin (Grid is also very useful, but it's not the same functionality)

Last edited by Nagian (2010-01-05 16:30:40)

ArchArael · 2010-01-05 19:33:22

Nagian wrote:

You really like the windows placement in openbox? Compiz do it much better, the new windows are only overlapping if there is really no place left.
And this GrowToX-Things have also a good implementation in Compiz, take a look at the Maximumize-Plugin (Grid is also very useful, but it's not the same functionality)

You are right. Compiz overlaps windows less but with two monitors Openbox placement is better because it uses smartly the second monitor. I modified my list of cons and pros.
The placement+MoveToEdgeNorth, South, West and Ovest actions in my opinion are better than Grid plugin in Compiz. But probably I could used to that if I had a simple mode to move windows between monitors without using the mouse.

Moving windows offset is important to me and not having it on Compiz is a huge cons. I forgot Maximumize plugin, I added it in the Compiz pros list. Really useful. The only thing I don't like is how the windows is minimized after you "maximumize" them. GrowToX is more flexible than Maximumize plugin but the latter is more simple to use. Well..guess that only couple of days are not enough to decide and the habits are not a great help for an objective evaluation.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-05 20:01:56)

toketin · 2010-01-05 19:53:30

Hi, how can i configure compiz-deskmenu to be activated with the right click of mouse?

ArchArael · 2010-01-05 19:59:47

toketin wrote:

Hi, how can i configure compiz-deskmenu to be activated with the right click of mouse?

http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php? … 97#p682497

I noticed that you still can use the key binding so it's not necessary to remove it.

Felice anno nuovo

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-05 20:15:06)

pogeymanz · 2010-01-05 21:13:29

ArchArael wrote:

Nagian wrote:
You really like the windows placement in openbox? Compiz do it much better, the new windows are only overlapping if there is really no place left.
And this GrowToX-Things have also a good implementation in Compiz, take a look at the Maximumize-Plugin (Grid is also very useful, but it's not the same functionality)
You are right. Compiz overlaps windows less but with two monitors Openbox placement is better because it uses smartly the second monitor. I modified my list of cons and pros.
The placement+MoveToEdgeNorth, South, West and Ovest actions in my opinion are better than Grid plugin in Compiz. But probably I could used to that if I had a simple mode to move windows between monitors without using the mouse.
Moving windows offset is important to me and not having it on Compiz is a huge cons. I forgot Maximumize plugin, I added it in the Compiz pros list. Really useful. The only thing I don't like is how the windows is minimized after you "maximumize" them. GrowToX is more flexible than Maximumize plugin but the latter is more simple to use. Well..guess that only couple of days are not enough to decide and the habits are not a great help for an objective evaluation.

I don't have two monitors so I have no idea how this works.

Have you tried using the "Place Windows" plugin and changing the Multi-Output Mode? That might help with the smart placement.

Also, the "Put" plugin allows you to send a window to the next output with a keystroke; is that what you are looking for?

I don't like the maximumize plugin, but I love the grid plugin. Also, how much moving offset do you like? It would be nice to change those values.

Hopefully we'll see more configuration options in the .9 series. After all, it's being completely rewritten in C++, which should make re/writing plugins easier.

Last edited by pogeymanz (2010-01-05 21:17:48)

toketin · 2010-01-05 22:32:52

ArchArael wrote:

toketin wrote:
Hi, how can i configure compiz-deskmenu to be activated with the right click of mouse?
http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php? … 97#p682497
I noticed that you still can use the key binding so it's not necessary to remove it.
Felice anno nuovo

Thanks (auguri anche a te )
Now i have two problem, the first that i can't use my own mouse theme, in .Xdefaults i have this to line:

Xcursor.theme:         neutral
Xcursor.size:         32

but i stil see the default one. The other problem is that if i run conky at the startup Compiz doesn't work well , for example it doesn't refresh the desktop, why?

And i've discovered another problem: docky can't start with compiz standalone
This is the output:

[marco@sondarch ~]$ docky

** (/usr/lib/docky/Docky.exe:12232): WARNING **: Symbol file /usr/lib/mono/gac/NDesk.DBus/1.0.0.0__f6716e4f9b2ed099/NDesk.DBus.dll.mdb has incorrect version (expected 50.0, got 39)

Unhandled Exception: System.Exception: Unable to open the session message bus. ---> System.ArgumentNullException: Argument cannot be null.
Parameter name: address
  at NDesk.DBus.Bus.Open (System.String address) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at NDesk.DBus.Bus.get_Session () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  --- End of inner exception stack trace ---
  at NDesk.DBus.Bus.get_Session () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at NDesk.DBus.BusG.Init () [0x00015] in /home/jan/svn/ndesk-dbus-glib/trunk/src/ndesk-dbus-glib-0.4.1/src/GLib.cs:22 
  at Docky.Docky.Main (System.String[] args) [0x00014] in /tmp/yaourt-tmp-marco/aur-docky-bzr/docky-bzr/src/docky/Docky/Docky/Docky.cs:66

P.s. i've solved the issue about mouse theme adding these lines two .gtkrc-2.0 (created by lxappearance):
gtk-cursor-theme-name="neutral"
gtk-cursor-theme-size=16

Last edited by toketin (2010-01-05 23:12:12)

ArchArael · 2010-01-06 02:05:32

pogeymanz wrote:

Have you tried using the "Place Windows" plugin and changing the Multi-Output Mode? That might help with the smart placement.
Also, the "Put" plugin allows you to send a window to the next output with a keystroke; is that what you are looking for?
I don't like the maximumize plugin, but I love the grid plugin. Also, how much moving offset do you like? It would be nice to change those values.
Hopefully we'll see more configuration options in the .9 series. After all, it's being completely rewritten in C++, which should make re/writing plugins easier.

Thank you pogeymanz, you are the man! That's exactly what I was looking for but somehow I completely overlooked it.

Your hints solve my issues.

As for moving windows would be great to have something between 30 and 100 pixel but not 10 pixel like now. Same thing for resize window. Anyway I solved almost everything with your hints. The resizing is not so important and for moving windows the "Put" plugin does the job greatly. It is what I need. Now in Compiz I have almost every functionality I had in Openbox plus much more. Thank you.

What remains are the commands list but in the end I could move static key bindings to xbindkey (such as multimedia key bindings) and spare some slots.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-06 02:14:53)

toketin · 2010-01-06 13:02:34

Nagian wrote:

Yeah, I have Ati and the radeon-driver. But i don't have PageFlip enabled.
And the games are supertux and super maryo chronicles. I should mention that the work fine under openbox.

it happens only for me the games are slow with compiz I have an nvidia 6200

Last edited by toketin (2010-01-06 13:02:59)

Nagian · 2010-01-06 14:00:48

toketin wrote:

Nagian wrote:
Yeah, I have Ati and the radeon-driver. But i don't have PageFlip enabled.
And the games are supertux and super maryo chronicles. I should mention that the work fine under openbox.
it happens only for me the games are slow with compiz I have an nvidia 6200

Well, Compiz needs also perfomance, I think it's not abnormal that the games are a bit slower.

sHyLoCk · 2010-01-06 14:07:49

If you list the games we can test for you. Games that I tried work fine for me in compiz.

Nagian · 2010-01-06 16:22:57

ArchArael wrote:

Nagian wrote:
You really like the windows placement in openbox? Compiz do it much better, the new windows are only overlapping if there is really no place left.
And this GrowToX-Things have also a good implementation in Compiz, take a look at the Maximumize-Plugin (Grid is also very useful, but it's not the same functionality)
You are right. Compiz overlaps windows less but with two monitors Openbox placement is better because it uses smartly the second monitor. I modified my list of cons and pros.
The placement+MoveToEdgeNorth, South, West and Ovest actions in my opinion are better than Grid plugin in Compiz. But probably I could used to that if I had a simple mode to move windows between monitors without using the mouse.
Moving windows offset is important to me and not having it on Compiz is a huge cons. I forgot Maximumize plugin, I added it in the Compiz pros list. Really useful. The only thing I don't like is how the windows is minimized after you "maximumize" them. GrowToX is more flexible than Maximumize plugin but the latter is more simple to use. Well..guess that only couple of days are not enough to decide and the habits are not a great help for an objective evaluation.

Well, I am also using two monitors, and although i hate openbox' windows placement... Compiz is also much better in this section.

m4co · 2010-01-06 16:27:33

ArchArael wrote:

sHyLoCk wrote:
Yes that ticked me off as well. And it's not even that mouse bindings and keyboards,edges,etc. have different sets of commands but they run the same commands just different ways of running them. Missing fluxbox hotkeys.
And I miss my openbox clunky rc.xml file. I like it although many of users in the community don't. For many things compiz is better but for other openbox is still unbeaten.
At the moment these are my personal impressions.
Compiz pros:
*Vieport Switcher
*Desktop Wall
*Expo
*Scale plugin (really really useful)
*Maximumize plugin
*Grid plugin
*Edges (Improve mouse using experience a lot, the next point is obviously )
*More mouse friendly than Openbox (less clicks for the same actions)
*Good placement algorithm, at least on single monitor
Compiz cons:
*Limited number of comands in Commands plugin (can be solved with xbindkeys but I don't like that solution)
*Cannot set the offset for moving windows by keyboard ( the x and y offset when moving is always the same and is too small)
*Windows placement algorithm is not that good (Smart mode)
*Some minor glitches (Firefox text fields sometimes messed up, but that can be only my problem, usually happens after resuming the machine)
*Edges well...it's matter of habbit but I found myself involuntarily activating Expo and Scale plugin many times
*Slows down when my hard disc is transferring huge files
*Cannot move windows between monitors using the keyboard (you have to use the mouse or trigger window moving and keep the down arrow pressed waiting until the window is moved on the other monitor)
Openbox pros:
*Placement algorithm + MoveToNorth,South,West,Ovest Actions (does what does Grid plugin in Compiz but works on two monitors)
*Highly configurable. (Example: I can set the x and y offset as I like, so moving windows with keyboard is usable and useful)
*Integrated root menu (more flexible and better than compiz-deskmenu)
*Fast window switcher (Switch between windows in all virtual desktops easely. Not fancy as in Compiz but still usable and useful. client-list-combined-menu. Actually it's visually inferior to the Scale plugin but it's more keyboard friendly)
*Dynamic virtuals desktops, create virtual desktops easely (I don't use it often but it's useful sometimes)
*GrowToNorth, South, East, West action (actually is better than Grid plugin in compiz, but I admit it maybe a matter of habbit)
*MoveResizeTo action is configurable to move windows between monitors. I use this a lot at work mapped as Super-W --> main monitor and Super-E --> laptop monitor
Example of the configuration:
<action name="MoveResizeTo">
    
    <monitor>2</monitor>
  </action>
*More keyboard friendly than Compiz
*More reactive when my hard disc is transferring huge files
Openbox cons:
*Not fancy as Compiz
*Less mouse friendly than Compiz (I can do everything I do in Compiz but is less friendly, more clicks because of the lack of Compiz-like Edges)
*No Expo and Scale plugin (although client-list-combined-menu provides both functionalities in one is less usable, I mean visually)
That's all at the moment. Still wondering if is worth switching to Compiz.

Very nice list.

I miss compiz Grid + Maximumize plugin. Right now I'm trying to make openbox a little bit more "tilable".

In openbox I set "place new windows under the mouse cursor" and I'm trying to tile the windows around. I just have to remember that I should position the mouse pointer first

I do love all the customization power you have in the rc.xml too but I haven't use all that yet (one monitor) because I don't need to. It feels it's too much for too little.

So I don't know if it fits me, but it's lighter than compiz so I will stick with it for a while

ArchArael · 2010-01-07 09:41:00

On my laptop compiz performance is not that good. It's rather slow and sluggish.

This reflects also on the applications. Firefox, Thunderbird and Terminal sometimes lag in getting the focus.

Any idea about how could I improve compiz performance?

lspci | grep VGA

00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 0c)

xrandr

Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1920 x 2000, maximum 8192 x 8192
VGA1 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
LVDS1 connected 1280x800+0+1200 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 287mm x 180mm
   1280x800       60.0*+
   1024x768       60.0  
   800x600        60.3  
   640x480        59.9  
DVI1 connected 1920x1200+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 518mm x 324mm
   1680x1050      60.0 +
   1920x1200      60.0*+
   1600x1200      60.0  
   1280x1024      75.0     60.0  
   1440x900       75.0     59.9  
   1280x800       74.9     59.8  
   1024x768       75.1     60.0  
   800x600        75.0     60.3  
   640x480        75.0     60.0  
   720x400        70.1

I played with several settings and I obtained some improvements but maybe there is something else I could do that I didn't.
I set:
Lose Binding on
Indirect Rendering on
General Settings --> Refresh Rate 50
General Settings --> Texture Filter Fast
No effects, except Window Decoration

m4co wrote:

So I don't know if it fits me, but it's lighter than compiz so I will stick with it for a while

I understand your decision. For now I have back to good old openbox on laptop because it's lighter.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-07 12:30:53)

habbe · 2010-01-07 09:51:38

ArchArael wrote:

Openbox cons:
*Not fancy as Compiz
*Less mouse friendly than Compiz (I can do everything I do in Compiz but is less friendly, more clicks because of the lack of Compiz-like Edges)
*No Expo and Scale plugin (although client-list-combined-menu provides both functionalities in one is less usable, I mean visually)

I would add the difficult configurability by editing menu.xml and rc.xml. There is a gui for the former, but it didn't work for me. AFAIK there isn't one for the latter. I hate to edit these files to change my keyboard-shortcuts.

Then again, once you have your setup complete, this is not a problem. I never got there, now using gnome+compiz.

Meyithi · 2010-01-07 10:12:12

Well, after reading this thread I decided to switch from Openbox to Compiz Standalone and I'm impressed!

I have a problem with panels though where apps will occasionally "get stuck" on the panel (tint2, Bmpanel2) and I have to switch to another task before it will accept mouse input. Working through the plugins to see if it's fixable.

ArchArael · 2010-01-07 10:12:51

habbe wrote:

ArchArael wrote:
Openbox cons:
*Not fancy as Compiz
*Less mouse friendly than Compiz (I can do everything I do in Compiz but is less friendly, more clicks because of the lack of Compiz-like Edges)
*No Expo and Scale plugin (although client-list-combined-menu provides both functionalities in one is less usable, I mean visually)
I would add the difficult configurability by editing menu.xml and rc.xml. There is a gui for the former, but it didn't work for me. AFAIK there isn't one for the latter. I hate to edit these files to change my keyboard-shortcuts.
Then again, once you have your setup complete, this is not a problem. I never got there, now using gnome+compiz.

I know that most people don't like openbox because of its rc.xml configuration file. I don't mind editing xml files at all because it is part of my job anyway.

I'm sort of web developer so for me it's not a problem nor annoyance. I can understand that for other people doesn't bother to configure a window manager by editing strange files.

Probably at work I will still use openbox, my laptop doesn't seem to be able to run compiz properly. At home I have a barebone with nvidia gpu and it runs compiz very well.

Last edited by ArchArael (2010-01-07 10:15:56)

Chokkan · 2010-01-07 11:33:04

I'm getting used to not having a panel or tray or anything. The one thing I was missing was a clock. I set cairo-clock to pop up on a key press and now I'm happy. Also the scale thingy is a revelation.

pogeymanz · 2010-01-07 17:33:24

ArchArael wrote:

On my laptop compiz performance is not that good. It's rather slow and sluggish.
This reflects also on the applications. Firefox, Thunderbird and Terminal sometimes lag in getting the focus.
Any idea about how could I improve compiz performance?
lspci | grep VGA
00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 0c)
xrandr
Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1920 x 2000, maximum 8192 x 8192
VGA1 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
LVDS1 connected 1280x800+0+1200 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 287mm x 180mm
   1280x800       60.0*+
   1024x768       60.0  
   800x600        60.3  
   640x480        59.9  
DVI1 connected 1920x1200+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 518mm x 324mm
   1680x1050      60.0 +
   1920x1200      60.0*+
   1600x1200      60.0  
   1280x1024      75.0     60.0  
   1440x900       75.0     59.9  
   1280x800       74.9     59.8  
   1024x768       75.1     60.0  
   800x600        75.0     60.3  
   640x480        75.0     60.0  
   720x400        70.1
I played with several settings and I obtained some improvements but maybe there is something else I could do that I didn't.
I set:
Lose Binding on
Indirect Rendering on
General Settings --> Refresh Rate 50
General Settings --> Texture Filter Fast
No effects, except Window Decoration
m4co wrote:
So I don't know if it fits me, but it's lighter than compiz so I will stick with it for a while
I understand your decision. For now I have back to good old openbox on laptop because it's lighter.

Make your refresh rate a multiple of your monitor's refresh rate (which, monitor? I don't know). My monitor refreshes at 60Hz, so I set it to 120Hz because I have more than enough GPU power and the only GPU-intensive app I have is Compiz anyway.

Anonymo · 2010-01-07 18:37:04

pogeymanz
Does your monitor support this?

pogeymanz · 2010-01-07 21:40:09

Anonymo wrote:

pogeymanz
Does your monitor support this?

My monitor refreshes at 60Hz. The setting in Compiz has nothing to do with my monitor. It tells Compiz how often to redraw windows. If it redraws faster than my monitor refreshes, it means that it will look smooth. If Compiz redraws itself LESS often than my monitor, it will appear choppy, which I believe is ArchArael's problem.

Arch Linux

#51 2010-01-05 13:16:04

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#52 2010-01-05 13:40:15

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#53 2010-01-05 13:49:33

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#54 2010-01-05 13:53:23

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#55 2010-01-05 14:33:33

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#56 2010-01-05 16:28:54

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#57 2010-01-05 19:33:22

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#58 2010-01-05 19:53:30

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#59 2010-01-05 19:59:47

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#60 2010-01-05 21:13:29

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#61 2010-01-05 22:32:52

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#62 2010-01-06 02:05:32

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#63 2010-01-06 13:02:34

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#64 2010-01-06 14:00:48

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#65 2010-01-06 14:07:49

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#66 2010-01-06 16:22:57

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#67 2010-01-06 16:27:33

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#68 2010-01-07 09:41:00

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#69 2010-01-07 09:51:38

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#70 2010-01-07 10:12:12

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#71 2010-01-07 10:12:51

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#72 2010-01-07 11:33:04

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#73 2010-01-07 17:33:24

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#74 2010-01-07 18:37:04

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

#75 2010-01-07 21:40:09

Re: Compiz has improved as a potential minimalistic WM

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