Arch Linux

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

hi I know it might have been answered at sometime but I have no idea why after 3 months of not updating I get the following errors:
[...]

anyone have any ideas?? thanks.

did something happen to aurs address??? like did it change? I dont see any info anywhere on it. Also if it did how would I modify where it looks for packages?? thanks.

splippity> You might want to decrease the number of threads used by cower (see cower -h). It does use 10 threads by default but you might want to decrease that number, depending on the quality of your internet line.

I know I'm a little late to the party but in case MAroco still reads this thread I'd like to point this out -
https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php … 61#p802661 - you REALLY shouldn't be doing -Sy, and I'm somewhat surprised Spyhawk went along with changing the behaviour of pacaur.
In a perfect world -Sy would simply fail without an additional option like rm's --no-preserve-root, but clearly The Arch Way precludes dealing with problematic extreme-edge-case system destroyers in ways other than a phrik command.

ZekeSulastin> You're perfectly correct. Using -Sy <package> isn't recommended as that command might cause some trouble in some cases. However, it is pacaur's design to prevent anything the user wants to do. As long as pacman allows it, I don't see any reason why pacaur couldn't not execute such command too. Again, pacaur has been designed for people that know what there are doing - if they want to break their system, pacaur will break it
But again, you're perfectly right - don't use that command unless you're ready to take responsibility for it.

anonymous_user, mhertz> Thanks for providing high-quality end user support

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-11-30 20:28:57)

MAroco

Member

From: Germany

Registered: 2010-01-20

Posts: 72

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Hi ZekeSulastin,
indeed MAroco is still reading on... 
Thanks for your warning concerning -Sy. I know about the problems that could arise and *try* to get rid of that bad habbit but from time to time just slip back...
But it shouldn't be too much of an issue on my box anyway as I also have alunn (update notifier) running, which checks right after system boot and then every few hours and if it finds any new versions it will ask me to update (via pacaur -Syu).
So the system is very up-to-date anyway and when I lapse back to doing 'pacaur -Sy package' again I had most likely either already  run a pac -Syu before or alunn didn't find anything new i.e. system is up to date and then "-Sy" shouldn't do any harm.  But nonetheless, good to be aware of the danger and to warn others to not blindly follow my sillyness 
So thanks and cheers
MAroco

MAroco

Member

From: Germany

Registered: 2010-01-20

Posts: 72

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Hi again,
actually after reading the pages ZekeSulastin linked and following the links there etc. I stumbled upon the fact that "sudo pacman -Syu mc" would update the system and then install mc as expected and without danger BUT doing "pacaur -Syu mc" ONLY upgrades the system i.e. it does the "-Syu" part but ignores the implicit "install mc" part completely...  At least on my box...
Not sure if that is intended or not, just wanted to let you know...
Cheers
Marco

Last edited by MAroco (2011-12-08 20:00:29)

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Hi again,
actually after reading the pages ZekeSulastin linked and following the links there etc. I stumbled upon the fact that "sudo pacman -Syu mc" would update the system and then install mc as expected and without danger BUT doing "pacaur -Syu mc" ONLY upgrades the system i.e. it does the "-Syu" part but ignores the implicit "install mc" part completely...  At least on my box...
Not sure if that is intended or not, just wanted to let you know...

Why are bugs discovered *after* a new release, not before?
Thanks for the report, stay tuned for a fix.

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-08 20:53:50)

MAroco

Member

From: Germany

Registered: 2010-01-20

Posts: 72

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Cause after the release is before the next release anyways.
Just want to help speed up the development cycle to keep you off the streets, away from drugs. What more could you want? And me personally don't mind it anyways, still trying to learn pac -S**no not y again*

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Cause after the release is before the next release anyways.
Just want to help speed up the development cycle to keep you off the streets, away from drugs. What more could you want? And me personally don't mind it anyways, still trying to learn pac -S**no not y again*

Thanks to you, the only drug I need is coffee
That specific issue should now be fixed in git: "pacaur -Su <binary pkg>" should now work as expected, and "pacaur -Su <aur pkg>" should mimic pacman behavior. Selective update is still possible with "pacaur -u <pkg>". You can grab the last file and test it if you want.

I'll wait a bit before releasing 2.4.3, just to be sure that the changes I did don't introduce any regressions.

Edit: Fixed some rough edges with the previous changes, and released 2.4.3.

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-10 12:51:18)

MAroco

Member

From: Germany

Registered: 2010-01-20

Posts: 72

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Hi Spyhawk,
Whoaaa that was fast.  But coffee can't be counted as drug. Without the world would just stop turning, so it's rather fuel  But good to see the concept works... Well I "grabbed the latest file" and did a quick 'pacaur -Syu mc' and now it updates the system and afterwards installs mc. Grrrreat.
Guess I'll have to go search for regressions now to make sure you stick with the coffee 
Jokes aside, THANKS A TON for this great program and the work and time you put into improving and maintaining it! Seems after jumping from yaourt to bauerbill to clyde to... I finally found home
Cheers
MAroco

amsri

Member

Registered: 2011-06-17

Posts: 48

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I just upgraded to pacaur 2.4.4 and some thing funny is happening:

<code>[ashu@smitaashuanjan packages]$ pacaur -y subsonic
pactree: invalid option -- 's'
pactree v3.5.4
Usage: pactree [options] PACKAGE

  -b, --dbpath <path>  set an alternate database location
  -c, --color          colorize output
  -d, --depth <#>      limit the depth of recursion
  -g, --graph          generate output for graphviz's dot
  -l, --linear         enable linear output
  -r, --reverse        show reverse dependencies
  -u, --unique         show dependencies with no duplicates (implies -l)

  -h, --help           display this help message

:: 1 AUR package(s) to build: subsonic

Proceed with installation? [Y/n] y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

Enter a number (default=1): Invalid number: y

.....
.....
......
.....
.....
</code>

what is this happening. What suddenly went wrong

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I just upgraded to pacaur 2.4.4 and some thing funny is happening:

what is this happening. What suddenly went wrong

You did nothing wrong - that's me that optimized some code and introduced some other bugs while doing it. Although I try to test my changes as much as possible, there's always something that breaks - and I'm sorry about it :]

I just released 2.4.5 after an user has emailed me about another problem and I actually cannot reproduce your problem. Please upgrade to 2.4.5 and see if the problem still exist (both bugs might be related). If it is still happening on your machine, please post the output of "bash -x pacaur -y subsonic" here and I'll try to fix it as soon as possible.

Edit: Meh. Seems pactree isn't working as intended when using pacman 3.x. Hope pacman 4 reaches [core] soon :]

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-15 21:24:38)

amsri

Member

Registered: 2011-06-17

Posts: 48

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

It is still the same. When I run "bash -x pacaur -y subsonic" I get the following till Y or n question:

[ashu@smitaashuanjan ~]$ bash -x pacaur -y subsonic
+ name=pacaur
+ version=2.4.5
+ tmpDir=/tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
+ [[ -d /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu ]]
+ rm -rf /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
+ mkdir -p /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
+ export LANG=C
+ LANG=C
+ buildDir=/tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
+ editor=vi
+ color=false
+ clean=true
+ fallback=true
+ editpkgbuild=true
+ editinstall=true
+ cleandevel=true
+ carchmagic=false
+ source /etc/pacaur.conf
++ buildDir=/tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
++ editor=
++ color=false
++ clean=true
++ fallback=true
++ editpkgbuild=true
++ editinstall=true
++ cleandevel=true
++ carchmagic=false
+ [[ -r /home/ashu/.config/pacaur/config ]]
+ false
+ pacmanBin=pacman
+ cower=cower
+ [[ -n -y ]]
+ pkgs=()
+ count=0
+ [[ -n -y ]]
+ case "$1" in
+ operation=makepkg
+ installpkg=true
+ coweropts+=("-f")
+ shift
+ [[ -n subsonic ]]
+ case "$1" in
+ pkgs+=("$1")
+ shift
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ [[ ! -n '' ]]
+ [[ ! -f /usr/bin/vi ]]
+ [[ ! -d /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu ]]
+ [[ ! -f /usr/bin/pacman ]]
+ [[ ! -n makepkg ]]
+ [[ '' = sync ]]
+ [[ '' = info ]]
+ [[ '' = search ]]
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ [[ makepkg = search ]]
+ [[ makepkg = info ]]
+ [[ makepkg = download ]]
+ [[ makepkg = makepkg ]]
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ aurpkgs=(${pkgs[@]})
+ Core subsonic
+ IgnoreChecks
+ [[ ! -n '' ]]
+ GetIgnoredPkgs
+ ignoredpkgs+=($(grep '^ *IgnorePkg' '/etc/pacman.conf' | cut -d '=' -f 2-))
++ grep '^ *IgnorePkg' /etc/pacman.conf
++ cut -d = -f 2-
+ [[ -e /home/ashu/.config/cower/config ]]
+ ignoredpkgs=(${ignoredpkgs[@]//,/ })
+ [[ -z '' ]]
+ return
+ DownloadPkgs subsonic
+ source /etc/makepkg.conf
++ DLAGENTS=('ftp::/usr/bin/wget -c --passive-ftp -t 3 --waitretry=3 -O %o %u' 'http::/usr/bin/wget -c -t 3 --waitretry=3 -O %o %u' 'https::/usr/bin/wget -c -t 3 --waitretry=3 --no-check-certificate -O %o %u' 'rsync::/usr/bin/rsync -z %u %o' 'scp::/usr/bin/scp -C %u %o')
++ CARCH=x86_64
++ CHOST=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
++ CFLAGS='-march=x86-64 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector --param=ssp-buffer-size=4 -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2'
++ CXXFLAGS='-march=x86-64 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector --param=ssp-buffer-size=4 -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2'
++ LDFLAGS=-Wl,-O1,--sort-common,--as-needed,-z,relro,--hash-style=gnu
++ BUILDENV=(fakeroot !distcc color !ccache check)
++ OPTIONS=(strip docs libtool emptydirs zipman purge)
++ INTEGRITY_CHECK=(md5)
++ STRIP_BINARIES=--strip-all
++ STRIP_SHARED=--strip-unneeded
++ STRIP_STATIC=--strip-debug
++ MAN_DIRS=({usr{,/local}{,/share},opt/*}/{man,info})
++ DOC_DIRS=(usr/{,local/}{,share/}{doc,gtk-doc} opt/*/{doc,gtk-doc})
++ PURGE_TARGETS=(usr/{,share}/info/dir .packlist *.pod)
++ PKGDEST=/home/ashu/makepkg/packages
++ SRCDEST=/home/ashu/makepkg/sources
++ SRCPKGDEST=/home/ashu/makepkg/srcpackages
++ PKGEXT=.pkg.tar.xz
++ SRCEXT=.src.tar.gz
+ [[ false = false ]]
+ recursive=true
+ DownloadAur subsonic
+ [[ -n true ]]
+ d=-dd
+ [[ makepkg = download ]]
+ [[ ! makepkg = download ]]
+ deps+=($($cower $d ${coweropts[@]} $@ -t $buildDir 2>"$tmpDir/repodeps" | awk -F " " '{print $2}'| sed -r "s:\x1B\[[0-9;]*[mK]::g"))
++ cower -dd -f subsonic -t /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu
++ sed -r 's:\x1B\[[0-9;]*[mK]::g'
++ awk -F ' ' '{print $2}'
+ [[ -e /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/repodeps ]]
+ grep 'no results found for' /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/repodeps
+ nothingtodo subsonic
+ [[ -z subsonic ]]
+ return 0
+ timeout subsonic
++ echo subsonic
++ grep -v 'no results found for'
++ grep -v 'resolve host name'
+ [[ -z subsonic ]]
+ return 0
+ aurdepspkgs=(${deps[@]:${#aurpkgs[@]}:${#deps[@]}})
+ for i in '"${deps[@]}"'
++ grep CARCH /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/subsonic/PKGBUILD
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ [[ -e /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/repodeps ]]
+ repodeps=($(cat "$tmpDir/repodeps" | grep -v 'no results found for' | awk -F " " '{print $2}' | sed -r "s:\x1B\[[0-9;]*[mK]::g"))
++ cat /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/repodeps
++ sed -r 's:\x1B\[[0-9;]*[mK]::g'
++ grep -v 'no results found for'
++ awk -F ' ' '{print $2}'
+ [[ -n java-runtime ]]
+ for i in '${repodeps[@]}'
+ allrepopkgs+=($(pactree -su "$i"))
++ pactree -su java-runtime
pactree: invalid option -- 's'
pactree v3.5.4
Usage: pactree [options] PACKAGE

  -b, --dbpath <path>  set an alternate database location
  -c, --color          colorize output
  -d, --depth <#>      limit the depth of recursion
  -g, --graph          generate output for graphviz's dot
  -l, --linear         enable linear output
  -r, --reverse        show reverse dependencies
  -u, --unique         show dependencies with no duplicates (implies -l)

  -h, --help           display this help message
+ repodepspkgs=($($pacmanBin -T "${allrepopkgs[@]}"))
++ pacman -T
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ ReinstallChecks subsonic
+ exist=($(expac -Q %n "${deps[@]}"))
++ expac -Q %n subsonic
+ Qversion=($(expac -Q %v "${deps[@]}"))
++ expac -Q %v subsonic
+ (( i=0 ))
+ (( i<0 ))
+ OutofdateChecks subsonic
+ for i in '"${deps[@]}"'
+ paraexec
+ DownloadJson subsonic
+ [[ ! -f /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/subsonic.json ]]
+ curl -Lfs 'https://aur.archlinux.org/rpc.php?type=info&arg=subsonic'
++ wc -l
++ jobs
+ ((  1 >= 10  ))
+ wait
+ for i in '"${deps[@]}"'
++ grep '"OutOfDate":"1"' /tmp/pacaurtmp-ashu/subsonic.json
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ Prompt subsonic
+ [[ -n '' ]]
+ [[ ! -n '' ]]
+ echo ''

+ info '1 AUR package(s) to build: subsonic'
+ echo -e ':: 1 AUR package(s) to build: subsonic'
:: 1 AUR package(s) to build: subsonic
+ echo ''

+ [[ ! -n '' ]]
+ [[ -n true ]]
+ action=installation
+ proceedY 'Proceed with installation?'
+ echo -ne 'Proceed with installation? [Y/n] '
Proceed with installation? [Y/n] + read -n 1 yn

amsri

Member

Registered: 2011-06-17

Posts: 48

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I mean it is still the same with 2.4.5.

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

amsri > Seems the change I did aren't backward compatible with pacman 3.5.x (pactree has a new option for pacman 4.x).

To all:
pacaur 2.4.4/2.4.5 brings some code optimization for those that use carchmagic=true and some speed up to the binary dependencies listing code. Unfortunately, it seems the pactree option that pacaur uses is included in pacman 4.x only (needed option -s is missing in pactree 3).

Therefore,
- If you're still using pacman 3, please install pacaur-legacy (old version 2.4.3, using "cower-legacy").
- the "stable" pacaur package now requires "cower" which needs pacman 4 to be installed.

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-15 22:40:27)

amsri

Member

Registered: 2011-06-17

Posts: 48

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

OK I have installed pacaur-legacy. I removed pacaur 2.4.5. I just used pacman -R to remove and not pacman -Rns. Pacaur-legacy seems to be working ok but I was worried about any configuration overlap/conflict between the two versions.

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

OK I have installed pacaur-legacy. I removed pacaur 2.4.5. I just used pacman -R to remove and not pacman -Rns. Pacaur-legacy seems to be working ok but I was worried about any configuration overlap/conflict between the two versions.

Configuration options are the very same in the 2.4.x branch. In fact, 2.4.4 should have been a very minor release and I wouldn't have released it yet if I knew I was breaking stuff for pacman 3.5.4 users. Anyway, time for most of you to move to pacaur-legacy... or to pacman 4 :]

ZekeSulastin

Member

Registered: 2010-09-20

Posts: 266

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Thanks for your continued work on pacaur   Here's a bit of a screwy feature request; if it is already doable I apologise for missing it.

When you --ignore/IgnorePkg an aur package, no notification of any sort is given if there is an update for the package that is being ignored, unlike a repo package.  Is there a method to have a package that is ignored but updatable print such a warning that I'm missing, and if not is adding such a message possible to do without excessive effort/breakage (hopefully in pacaur-legacy)?

Last edited by ZekeSulastin (2011-12-16 15:03:11)

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Thanks for your continued work on pacaur   Here's a bit of a screwy feature request; if it is already doable I apologise for missing it.

When you --ignore/IgnorePkg an aur package, no notification of any sort is given if there is an update for the package that is being ignored, unlike a repo package.  Is there a method to have a package that is ignored but updatable print such a warning that I'm missing, and if not is adding such a message possible to do without excessive effort/breakage (hopefully in pacaur-legacy)?

Yes, I am aware of this missing warning message. However, there isn' t much that I can do on the pacaur side as that is something that needs to be implemented in cower itself. The good news is that I proposed a patch to falconindy some time ago and that cower 3.0.9 will likely provide that feature :]

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-16 15:27:52)

amsri

Member

Registered: 2011-06-17

Posts: 48

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Does pacaur-legacy installs as pacaur? After installing pacaur-legacy I am getting a paconky alert that that there is a pacur-2.4.5 aqvailable. I ran pacman -Qs pacaur-legacy and nothing came up. I then ran pacman _Qs pacaur I receive:

[ashu@ashu-laptop ~]$ pacman -Qs pacaur
local/pacaur 2.4.3-1
    A fast workflow AUR wrapper using cower as backend

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

amsri > "pacman -Qs pacaur" should return pacaur-legacy, not pacaur. I'd recommend you to reinstall pacaur-legacy (and uninstall pacaur before if necessary).

splippity

Member

Registered: 2010-05-25

Posts: 144

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I just thought about it. Is it possible to make pacaur work kind of like powerpill did where it had the feature of: "parallel and segmented downloads"

It allowed me to maximize my connection for getting updates downloaded quickly.
Pacaur is awesome but that would be icing on the cake. I dont know if it is possible to even implement that feature but figured I would ask.

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

splippity> pacaur actually downloads binary packages through pacman (you wouldn't have bet on it, would you? :] ), but there might be possible to redirect downloads to another script that allows parallel and segmented downloads (such as pacman2aria2/powerpill-light). Implementing such a feature directly in pacaur is out of scope of this project, but I could make it easy to choose your preferred "pacman binary" in a future release. In the meatime, just try to play with powerpill-light (or any other similar tool) by changing the "pacmanBin" var in /usr/bin/pacaur. Any report of improved performance is warmly welcome :]

Also, pacaur actually does parallelize many internal tasks, either through cower threads or parallel bash jobs. Update checks, PKGBUILD/tarball downloads, Json calls are all parallelized. What could be improved in pacaur is parallelizing of package building, but that's not that easy to achieve as many packages depend on other packages.

Last edited by Spyhawk (2011-12-19 07:45:28)

nicoulaj

Member

From: France

Registered: 2011-10-10

Posts: 34

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I started writing one, it will be available here when it's ready.

Last edited by nicoulaj (2011-12-28 10:06:24)

---

AUR | github | IRC:nicoulaj

ethail

Member

From: Spain

Registered: 2011-02-10

Posts: 225

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

I'm seeing an issue with both pacaur and pacaur-git.

pacaur does not use config file and reports:

/usr/bin/pacaur: line 39: /etc/xdg:/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg/pacaur/pacaur.conf: No such file or directory

config file exists at /etc/xdg/pacaur/pacaur.conf but it seems to take the path as "/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg/pacaur/pacaur.conf"

XDG_CONFIG_DIR:

0 akai@Arch-Akai: ~ 13:32 ---> echo $XDG_CONFIG_DIRS
/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg:/etc/xdg

Last edited by ethail (2012-01-05 12:33:33)

---

My GitHub Page

Best Testing Repo Warning: [testing] means it can eat you hamster, catch fire and you should keep it away from children. And I'm serious here, it's not an April 1st joke.

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

ethail> Thanks for the report, and really sorry about that. I hate it when bugs appear although it work on my system
Will try to fix that asap, but I don't have the time to look into that right now.

Spyhawk

Member

Registered: 2006-07-07

Posts: 485

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

ethail > So that bug appear when XDG_CONFIG_DIR is defined on your system *and* when it defined more than one directory. Before I start coding a workaround that doesn't make sense, could I ask you if you have an idea where that variable is defined on your system? Having "/etc/xdg/" defined three time looks weird to say the least (although the xdg spec allows more than one directory).

Edit: That should now be fixed in 2.5.1.

Last edited by Spyhawk (2012-01-05 19:27:46)

donbex

Member

Registered: 2010-12-23

Posts: 53

Re: pacaur - an AUR helper that minimizes user interaction

Hello folks.
Fist of all, thank you Spyhawk for pacaur, as it is my favourite AUR helper since bauerbill.
I'm experiencing what seems like an odd behaviour, though, and I'd like to know if this is a bug or a feature: when updating AUR packages with "pacaur -u" I don't get to edit any PKGBUILD or .install file, even if I have "editpkgbuild=true" and "editinstall=true" in my pacaur.conf file.
Note that if I use "pacaur -Syu" it asks me if I want to edit them one by one, while if I use "pacaur -e -u" I get to edit them without being prompted, which is the behaviour I was expecting.

I looked for this in this forum topic and in the git bugtracker, without finding anything about it. Please excuse me in case I missed something.