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#26 2011-04-30 16:44:29

dolby
Member
From: 1992
Registered: 2006-08-08
Posts: 1,581

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

Debian seems to have switched to libav in their unstable branch. Also libav seems to use launchpad for bug reports now..


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#27 2011-04-30 18:39:07

skottish
Forum Fellow
From: Here
Registered: 2006-06-16
Posts: 7,931

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

dolby wrote:

Debian seems to have switched to libav in their unstable branch...

So has gstreamer in the gstreamer-ffmpeg package as well as OpenSuse.

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#28 2011-05-03 04:25:03

herzen
Member
From: Pennsylvania, US
Registered: 2009-10-28
Posts: 38

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

I thought I would find an informative thread about this here.

dolby wrote:

Debian seems to have switched to libav in their unstable branch.

That's exactly the kind of behavior I would expect from Debian. Ubuntu and Gentoo also have libav packages, but I don't know if they have "switched".

I certainly hope that Arch stays away from libav. If enough distributions do so, the point will have been made that power grabs have no place in the world of FOSS. I maintain package specs for Solaris, and we certainly will stick with ffmpeg.

For what it's worth, the #ffmpeg channel currently has about four times as many people joined as #libav, while the development channels are about even.

One thing that will be interesting to see is the extent to which the two projects pull code from each other. That's a possibility because both are open source, neither really has a goal that the other doesn't so far, and, judging by the development channels, both are evenly matched in terms of people interested in development.

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#29 2011-08-12 20:52:44

Diaz
Member
From: Lisbon, Portugal
Registered: 2008-04-16
Posts: 361
Website

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

Hi people,

so a couple of months have passed and i was looking in stuff about ffmpeg and mplayer and remembered this thread...

To people informed, how haz all this crazy stuff evolved? I see some distros changing to libav and i'm not sure what are my feelings about it :x ( i was looking at the homepages and it is a exact copy, for example ).

And how is the crazy relation between mplayer, mplayer2, ffmpeg and libav? What can be compiled with for example?


Owner of Asus 1215B :: User of Xfce :: Vasco Dias @blog

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#30 2011-08-12 21:02:55

Gusar
Member
Registered: 2009-08-25
Posts: 3,431

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

Diaz wrote:

And how is the crazy relation between mplayer, mplayer2, ffmpeg and libav? What can be compiled with for example?

Nothing crazy about mplayer and mplayer2. mplayer2 is a fork. Though it does every so often incorporate fixes from mplayer, in certain areas it's codebase is quite different. It has a few neat things, just check the comparison page on their website. The neatest IMO is automatically determining the number of threads to use.

As for libav and ffmpeg, they're still API and ABI compatible, so no difference from that perspective. About the difference in feature set, that I don't know exactly, at some point I stopped following the development of those two. I believe both now have multithreaded decoding. FFmpeg has more video filters still, I'd say. Beyond that, no idea.

Oh, and just FYI: The mplayer2 fork happened many, many months before the libav fork and is in no way related to it. Completely different thing that happened there. I'm just mentioning this because a lot of people probably link the two forks somehow. But the events have nothing in common.

Last edited by Gusar (2011-08-12 21:10:43)

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#31 2011-08-12 21:07:26

karol
Archivist
Registered: 2009-05-06
Posts: 25,426

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=n … &px=OTc4Mg <- a short update on mplayer2

Last edited by karol (2011-08-12 21:08:19)

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#32 2011-08-12 22:25:07

DrZaius
Member
Registered: 2008-01-02
Posts: 168

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

One recent difference is that libav has renamed some of the binaries: ffplay to avplay, ffprobe to avprobe, ffserver to avserver, and I believe they will transition ffmpeg to avconv. Semantics of some options (such as -map) are changing and some options (-new*) are have been dropped. Other than that I don't think a general user should notice much of a difference.

Ubuntu has moved to libav as of Natty. I don't know (or really care) what else has decided to use it. Personally, I've stayed with FFmpeg.


Damned dirty ape.

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#33 2011-08-13 01:01:23

skottish
Forum Fellow
From: Here
Registered: 2006-06-16
Posts: 7,931

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

DrZaius wrote:

One recent difference is that libav has renamed some of the binaries: ffplay to avplay, ffprobe to avprobe, ffserver to avserver, and I believe they will transition ffmpeg to avconv. Semantics of some options (such as -map) are changing and some options (-new*) are have been dropped. Other than that I don't think a general user should notice much of a difference.

Wow, I didn't even know about this. The changes are quite significant.

DrZaius wrote:

Ubuntu has moved to libav as of Natty. I don't know (or really care) what else has decided to use it. Personally, I've stayed with FFmpeg.

I jumped back and forth for a while between the two, then I got tired of reading either mailing list. I happened to be using FFmpeg at the moment, so that's where I've stayed for some months.

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#34 2012-01-10 18:39:38

stefanwilkens
Member
From: Enschede, the Netherlands
Registered: 2008-12-10
Posts: 624

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

I may be rehashing some info here, just trying to make sense of the massive amount of crap on mailing lists on this subject.

Debian seems to be building ffmpeg from libav:
http://packages.debian.org/source/sid/libav

a developer's reasoning on this (dec 25th 2011) shows why they did this, though we should keep in mind that this reply came from a dev that is part of the libav fork:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermai … 23070.html

Reading that reply, I think it's odd that libav is being tagged the "safer" choice with the more "conservative" developer while this fork set out to push changes that were being held back in ffmpeg.

And a little mud-slinging is apparantly taking place: running ffmpeg on Gentoo currently gives me this:

"This program is not developed anymore and is only provided for
compatibility. Use avconv instead (see Changelog for the list of
incompatible changes)."

It does not on arch.

it looks like Gentoo is offering choices, either build against ffmpeg or libav.

GStreamer seems to be using libav for gst-ffmpeg:
http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/g … 49319.html
http://gstreamer-devel.966125.n4.nabble … 02479.html

Bloody mess isn't it.


Arch i686 on Phenom X4 | GTX760

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#35 2012-01-10 19:00:46

DrZaius
Member
Registered: 2008-01-02
Posts: 168

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

stefanwilkens wrote:

And a little mud-slinging is apparantly taking place: running ffmpeg on Gentoo currently gives me this:

"This program is not developed anymore and is only provided for
compatibility. Use avconv instead (see Changelog for the list of
incompatible changes)."

I believe this is the message a user will receive if they attempt to use ffmpeg (the binary) from libav (the project), but it does seem to imply that "ffmpeg" is dead and might confuse some general users who pay no mind to the split. Maybe it was written with that intention?

You can see if you're using FFmpeg:

$ ffmpeg 2>&1 | head -n1
ffmpeg version N-36637-g4805a33 Copyright (c) 2000-2012 the FFmpeg developers

or libav:

ffmpeg version 0.7.2-4:0.7.2-1ubuntu1, Copyright (c) 2000-2011 the Libav developers
stefanwilkens wrote:

It does not on arch.

Arch is using ffmpeg (the binary) from FFmpeg (the project) which does not make such statements.

stefanwilkens wrote:

it looks like Gentoo is offering choices, either build against ffmpeg or libav.

Arch has libav-git in AUR (just pointing it out: I'm not recommending it's usage, comparing Gentoo with Arch, or suggesting that this package counts as a real choice).


Damned dirty ape.

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#36 2012-01-10 21:34:58

wiasefri
Member
Registered: 2012-01-10
Posts: 1

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...

It is so sad what the people at Libav are doing. They have been nothing but petty and malicious, and I have nothing but contempt for them. The really sad thing is that they are doing rather well, but in life being ruthless can get you places. "It's not personal, it's business!"

In fact, the ffmpeg-devel list had some discussion about funding via FFmtech foundation, but all of it is being directed to Libav, which of course is nothing to do with the fact that FFmtech board of directors is comprised of only Libav members...

Again, I have nothing but contempt for the Libav developers. Sure, maybe Michael had his flaws as a leader, but what the Libav people are doing is just plain unacceptable.

(Sorry, I just get so angry when nasty underhanded people do well.)

Last edited by wiasefri (2012-01-10 21:37:11)

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#37 2012-01-10 21:51:50

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 12,690

Re: So, FFmpeg has finally blown itself to pieces...


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Like you, I have no idea what you are doing, but I am pretty sure it is wrong...Jasonwryan
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