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#26 2012-08-21 11:48:39

Trent
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From: Baltimore, MD (US)
Registered: 2009-04-16
Posts: 986

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

@Daedalus1, @drobole: Anybody can have a favorite book. Not to put too fine a point on it but do either of you have any credentials on the basis of which to defend your choices? I usually try to use books recommended by professional programmers, not professional academics nor students. Herb Schildt has great reviews on Amazon even though his carelessness is legendary.

Edit to be clear I'm not defending Stroustrup; I already disclaimed any real knowledge and do not consider myself a professional programmer as regards C++.

Last edited by Trent (2012-08-21 11:49:51)

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#27 2012-08-21 12:20:07

drobole
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From: Norway
Registered: 2012-07-23
Posts: 123

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Trent wrote:

...do either of you have any credentials on the basis of which to defend your choices?

Yes, but I announced those books here just as an alternative to look into. There is no way I'm going into a flame war about books.

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#28 2012-08-21 14:35:13

Trent
Member
From: Baltimore, MD (US)
Registered: 2009-04-16
Posts: 986

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

drobole wrote:

Yes, but I announced those books here just as an alternative to look into. There is no way I'm going into a flame war about books.

I don't want to start a flamewar about books or anything else, sorry if that came across wrong. I just wondered if your advice has any experience to back it up, and on the Internet there's no way to know but ask.

Edit: On second thought, never mind. Sorry OP for hijacking your thread.

Last edited by Trent (2012-08-21 14:44:42)

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#29 2012-08-21 17:42:27

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

nobody in response to your question... id like to do a good mix of reading and coding... furthermore id like some of the people interrested in this project to help with ideas on running it.  I think doing some reading in between groups is good but do people have the time for that?  then in group times we could do small projects i was thinking we could talk about a project we want to do relating to the reading and as a group compare coding and help new beginners understand why it is coded the way it is so that everyone has a good understanding of the language and how it works... does that seem like a good idea to people and please give feedback on how you think it could be done better


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#30 2012-08-21 17:48:45

jwele
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Registered: 2012-07-03
Posts: 62

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

duster wrote:

nobody in response to your question... id like to do a good mix of reading and coding... furthermore id like some of the people interrested in this project to help with ideas on running it.  I think doing some reading in between groups is good but do people have the time for that?  then in group times we could do small projects i was thinking we could talk about a project we want to do relating to the reading and as a group compare coding and help new beginners understand why it is coded the way it is so that everyone has a good understanding of the language and how it works... does that seem like a good idea to people and please give feedback on how you think it could be done better


I think it would be an good idea to have a Arch++ group.  We could possibly make a Google plus account for the group and talk code.  We can meet up weekly/biweekly and have exercises that we all do between groups.  Just ideas not necessarily what we 'have' to do.  But I am all for a C++ group of some sort. Sign me up!

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#31 2012-08-21 18:23:21

nobody44
Member
Registered: 2011-08-25
Posts: 28

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

If you haven't found anyone yet, I would like to review your code and comment it.
But I am not the "10 years experience c++ programer" hmm.

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#32 2012-08-21 18:42:40

jwele
Member
Registered: 2012-07-03
Posts: 62

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

duster wrote:

...
if there are no objections we can use C++ for dummies 5th edition

My favorite books to date
Beginner(Best explanation to date imo):
----C++ Without Fear 2nd -- Brian Overland  (Very great beginner book)
Intermediate (cool exercises, very descriptive):
----C++ How to Program 7th ed -- Dietel (More advanced book)
Advanced(Never read but revered as 'the' reference):
----The C++ Programming Language 4th ed -- Bjarne Stroustup


Just my suggestion. I am all down for free resources I wouldn't want to exclude those who are unable to buy these overpriced books.

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#33 2012-08-21 18:46:51

Banton
Member
Registered: 2010-05-28
Posts: 67

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

I'm also very interested in this, did try to learn C++ a few times myself but I always gave up after a few lesson. Maybe we could meet up in an irc channel or jabber conference room?

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#34 2012-08-21 18:56:02

Larry65
Member
Registered: 2012-08-20
Posts: 3

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Hi, I'm new here but interested in joining this group, time permitting. If I could make one suggestion that either during or at the end there is a real world type of project or at least a larger project.

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#35 2012-08-21 20:23:23

drobole
Member
From: Norway
Registered: 2012-07-23
Posts: 123

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Trent wrote:
drobole wrote:

Yes, but I announced those books here just as an alternative to look into. There is no way I'm going into a flame war about books.

I don't want to start a flamewar about books or anything else, sorry if that came across wrong. I just wondered if your advice has any experience to back it up, and on the Internet there's no way to know but ask.

Edit: On second thought, never mind. Sorry OP for hijacking your thread.

No harm done.

I don't feel like I have anything to defend here so I'm not going to do that. All the books that has been suggested are interesting. I have read a few of them at some point myself, but not all. And not the book from Stroustrup either.
In fact, my first C++ book back in 95 was Teach yourself C++ in 21 days. Not a bad book at all back then but probably too dated by now. Its funny how writing software proper in C++ has changed a lot over the years even though the language itself hasn't!
The books I suggested has been recommended over and over at gamedev.net, and I can assure you the guys with a high ranking over there is no amateurs smile

However, there is as many ways to go about learning C++ as there are programmers, so I don't claim to know better than anyone else here. If there is one thing I have learned the past 20 years is that there is _always_ someone out there who knows a lot more than me, which is a good thing I guess.

That said, starting out with the old "The C programming language" is not necessarily a bad idea either, even if its a pure C book.
Its free for download and it still kicks ass, seriously.

Last edited by drobole (2012-08-21 20:28:31)

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#36 2012-08-21 20:25:31

drobole
Member
From: Norway
Registered: 2012-07-23
Posts: 123

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Larry65 wrote:

Hi, I'm new here but interested in joining this group, time permitting. If I could make one suggestion that either during or at the end there is a real world type of project or at least a larger project.

This is a very good idea IMO.
A project that could be done in steps and still has the potential to grow in time.

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#37 2012-08-21 20:39:33

jwele
Member
Registered: 2012-07-03
Posts: 62

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

drobole wrote:
Larry65 wrote:

Hi, I'm new here but interested in joining this group, time permitting. If I could make one suggestion that either during or at the end there is a real world type of project or at least a larger project.

This is a very good idea IMO.
A project that could be done in steps and still has the potential to grow in time.

Sounds great to me too.

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#38 2012-08-21 23:12:23

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Thanks for all the input... and yes I'd love to do a real world project at the end of the lessons...  and though i appreciate all the input on books lets get off the topic of what material to use and get back to making this study group work. i agree with either the irc or jabber conference room idea and love the real world project idea  lets get the scheduling thing worked out next and as a group we can decided from the infinite list of ideas what book we use... but lets try to get off the topic of books for now as it could go on forever.  so most important is there a day that works for everyone?  myself am busy tuesday and wednesday other than that im avalible... anyone else have time constraints?


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#39 2012-08-21 23:33:40

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

also my jabber info is
xdusterx@jabber.org/home
feel free to message me if im on
or if you have questions about starting this group
i would appreciate some help facilitating it

--edit--

apparently having issues with jabber right now

Last edited by duster (2012-08-22 00:17:42)


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#40 2012-08-22 23:45:08

dysoco
Member
Registered: 2011-10-11
Posts: 43

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Hello.
I have a few experience with C++, I don't consider myself a "professional" but I have been using it for some months.

First, let me say that I think this idea is great, also the "group project", I will sign up for sure.

But, let me warn you... C++ is an old language, and it's a huge one... so please choose a good resource to get started.
Ditch everything with "21" or "Dummies" in the title.

I read "C++ without fear", it seems OK... but it isn't: teaches you bad things like "void main()" or using "system ("pause")" it also assumes you run Windows, so some of the code won't run in Linux... not to mention is outdated and suggests you to use old compilers/IDEs.
Deitel books are usually bad too.

I'd say, currently: There are three mayor C++ books to start programming:

"C++ primer" , "Accelerated C++" and "Principles and practises using C++".
The latter is written by Bjarne Stroustrup , creator of C++, and it's used in several universities.
It's a deep book, full of excersises, images, and full color, it's also easy to understand: I'd say it's my favourite.

"Accelerated C++", is, as stated in the name: a more "accelerated" approach, it's shorter than the others, and it assumes you have a programming background: It's a great book, and I'd read this if you know C or Java and want to learn C++ quickly.

I don't like "C++ Primer" too much, but it's a good book, something in the middle of the other two ones.

"The C++ programming language" covers C++ and the Standard Library more in deep, but I'd not choose it as introductory book, you have the other one from Bjarne.

Ah, and "Thinking in C++", I read "Thinking in Java" and Bruce is a very good author, I have not read the aforementioned, but seems OK to me.

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#41 2012-08-23 03:12:43

Larry65
Member
Registered: 2012-08-20
Posts: 3

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

duster wrote:

so most important is there a day that works for everyone?  myself am busy tuesday and wednesday other than that im avalible... anyone else have time constraints?

One day is as good as another for me but I'm in Australia so there is a time difference. The time here is UTC/GMT +9:30 hours.

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#42 2012-08-23 15:20:59

jwele
Member
Registered: 2012-07-03
Posts: 62

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

duster wrote:

so most important is there a day that works for everyone?  myself am busy tuesday and wednesday other than that im avalible... anyone else have time constraints?

Yea, from experience. It's hard for college study groups to find a good time for everyone. Can we just communicate through a forum or something that allows peoples input throughout week and up to a deadline day like once a week.

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#43 2012-08-23 21:43:23

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

jwele wrote:
duster wrote:

so most important is there a day that works for everyone?  myself am busy tuesday and wednesday other than that im avalible... anyone else have time constraints?

Yea, from experience. It's hard for college study groups to find a good time for everyone. Can we just communicate through a forum or something that allows peoples input throughout week and up to a deadline day like once a week.

i think thats a great idea maybe the forum admins will give us a place to post


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#44 2012-08-24 07:02:11

kniren
Member
Registered: 2011-10-12
Posts: 40
Website

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

I'm in!

I always wanted to wrap my head around C++, but never made a serious attempt, maybe a focused study group is just what I needed.

Already know ANSI C and Java, so I supose it won't be that difficult for me to understand the basics, right?.

I support the Google+/Subforum idea for organization, and I think we should address weekly and monthly objetives and submit our assignments to a googledrive/dropbox shared account only visible after the deadline, forcing us to avoid cheating.

Another suggestion may be the usage of game mechanics, with custom badges or trophies, but that will require a manager, of course.

Last but not least, I stumbled upon this neat google tuts, that could be useful for anyone in this thread: http://code.google.com/intl/es-ES/edu/l … arted.html


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#45 2012-08-24 15:14:00

dysoco
Member
Registered: 2011-10-11
Posts: 43

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

What if we create a subreddit ?

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#46 2012-08-24 15:40:21

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

i like the ideas coming out but ill leave this open for discussion... i would suggest getting jabber guys and ive posted my info one thought that well definitly do is a jabber conference room so send me a message


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#47 2012-08-25 15:01:33

duster
Member
From: Western MASS USA
Registered: 2012-08-16
Posts: 48

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

we have a jabber conference room heres the info for everyone who plans to take part

room        -- archcppstudy
server      -- conference.jabber.org
password -- cppstudy

the start date for the group is to be discussed but hopefully early september


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#48 2012-08-26 03:17:02

flagators
Member
Registered: 2012-02-09
Posts: 4

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Count me in.

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#49 2012-08-27 02:05:56

madprops
Member
Registered: 2012-05-26
Posts: 26

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

How appropiate I'm struggling to start learning C++ for openGL 3D programming. I love the idea of the study group. I think a forum approach is better to keep up with time differences but an IRC room would be nice.

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#50 2012-08-27 10:00:28

kniren
Member
Registered: 2011-10-12
Posts: 40
Website

Re: C++ Study Group Anyone?

Hi there! I created a Google Group as a mini-forum to ease the communication through all interested people.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/archcppstudy

Feel free to apply and I will let you in as soon as possible.

Cheers

Last edited by kniren (2012-08-27 10:00:51)


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