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#1 2012-09-28 23:07:56

boast
Member
Registered: 2010-09-28
Posts: 219

Need help installing on a macbook

I followed this https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/In … ase_system and then rebooted, but my monitor never gets initialized.

* 2008 macbook
* linux only hdd
* partition setup:
-- EFI
-- boot
-- swap
-- root
-- home

* macbook screen is broken, connected to monitor via VGA
* no OSX cd's


Asus M4A785TD-V ;; Phenom II X4 @ 3.9GHz ;; Ripjaws 12GB DDR3-1600 ;; 128GB Samsung 830 ;; MSI GTX460 v2 w/ blob ;; Arch Linux + KDE 4.x

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#2 2012-09-28 23:15:55

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

No "pro" right?  Just a regular old MacBook?  If this is the case, it has integrated Intel graphics.  So go to the "Intel" page of the arch wiki and learn how to set early KMS.

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#3 2012-09-29 00:13:08

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

WonderWoofy wrote:

No "pro" right?  Just a regular old MacBook?  If this is the case, it has integrated Intel graphics.  So go to the "Intel" page of the arch wiki and learn how to set early KMS.

The MacBook 5,1 (late 2008 unibody) has an nVidia graphics card. But, the OP might have the earlier 2008 model (poly-carbonate body).

Last edited by bsilbaugh (2012-09-29 00:15:00)


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#4 2012-09-29 00:22:48

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

For what it's worth, I have Arch running on my MacBook 5,1. I'm using the rEFInd boot manager with the UEFI kernel stub bootloader. I did not experience this issue, nor did I have to resort to a custom configuration/tweaking of my graphics (other than installing the nvidia driver for when I run in X11). In other words, your notebook monitor should "just work".

Out of curiosity, how did you setup your EFI boot? Did you use the OS X "bless" utility to register your boot loader with the firmware?


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#5 2012-09-29 00:55:54

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

Wikipedia mentions 2008 as having Intel GMA x3100 in the white MacBooks and nvidia in the 2008 unibody models. 
So is it booting at all?  Are you seeing your bootloader screen or anything?

Last edited by WonderWoofy (2012-09-29 00:57:03)

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#6 2012-09-29 01:19:45

boast
Member
Registered: 2010-09-28
Posts: 219

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

It's the white model with intel integrated.

bsilbaugh wrote:

Did you use the OS X "bless" utility to register your boot loader with the firmware?

Nope, don't have OS X. And what I read that seemed just for dual booting.

WonderWoofy wrote:

Are you seeing your bootloader screen or anything?

nothing.

But I decided to install Ubuntu to see if that has magic powers during the install, and it worked and boots up fine. Although in the first boot up, the screen was setup to mirror the laptop display, although that display is physically disconnected. Not sure if the arch setup was booting up to the macbook display, which I wouldn't be able to see.


Asus M4A785TD-V ;; Phenom II X4 @ 3.9GHz ;; Ripjaws 12GB DDR3-1600 ;; 128GB Samsung 830 ;; MSI GTX460 v2 w/ blob ;; Arch Linux + KDE 4.x

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#7 2012-09-29 01:27:58

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

Apple's EFI implementation is non-standard. As a result, the "standard" tools for registering a boot loader (e.g. efibootmgr) are not recommended, as it can "brick" your firmware--regardless if you're dual booting or not. This is why it is strongly recommended that you use the "bless" utility provided with OS X (either from the OS X install CD or a existing installation). See warning in the section under Non-Mac UEFI systems

So, is Ubuntu using EFI boot, or BIOS emulation?

Last edited by bsilbaugh (2012-09-29 01:29:21)


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#8 2012-09-29 01:43:46

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

When you boot up your Ubuntu install, do you see the grub bootloader, or does it stay black and then simply appear at some point?  I have a feeling that Ubuntu is taking care of the randr (or xinarama or whatever it uses) for you, whereas w/ arch you are expected to set this up yourself.

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#9 2012-09-29 02:19:14

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

WonderWoofy wrote:

When you boot up your Ubuntu install, do you see the grub bootloader, or does it stay black and then simply appear at some point?  I have a feeling that Ubuntu is taking care of the randr (or xinarama or whatever it uses) for you, whereas w/ arch you are expected to set this up yourself.

But then wouldn't this only be an issue when running Arch in X11. I thought the OP was having issues even when running Arch in console (i.e. run level 3)?

Last edited by bsilbaugh (2012-09-29 02:20:08)


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#10 2012-09-29 02:33:41

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

That is a really good point.  Though, then in the console what if anything controls a dual screen setup.  I still think that when booting into ubuntu, since you are indeed booting to a graphical run level, it is simply taking care of it for you.

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#11 2012-09-29 13:38:23

boast
Member
Registered: 2010-09-28
Posts: 219

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

Yeah, it is black before xorg loads up.

So for arch, I should also setup xorg from chroot before rebooting?


Asus M4A785TD-V ;; Phenom II X4 @ 3.9GHz ;; Ripjaws 12GB DDR3-1600 ;; 128GB Samsung 830 ;; MSI GTX460 v2 w/ blob ;; Arch Linux + KDE 4.x

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#12 2012-09-29 13:43:34

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

I really am unfamiliar with the possibility of dual monitor console (runlevel 3) potential.  So I would have to say that setting up X is what I would do if I were going to be using that anyway.  You have to remember that you not only have to install the graphical interface, but you also have to figure out how to set xrandr to automatically mirror to that particular output in the correct resolution.  I would imagine that booting into Ubuntu might give you some clues. 

You probably want to set up openssh as well.  So that if you need to, you can ssh into your machine and have actual non-chroot access that you can see.

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#13 2012-09-29 14:48:06

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

I would advice against fiddling with X11 until you can get basic console graphics working (run level 3). Arch is known to boot fine on MacBooks (both with EFI and BIOS). For sure, you should be able to successfully boot to run level 3 without a hitch. The fact that you're not able to do this on your machine suggests a serious installation/configuration error that you probably shouldn't ignore. Just my two cents....

EDIT: Fixed silly grammar errors

Last edited by bsilbaugh (2012-09-29 14:50:34)


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#14 2012-09-29 14:52:37

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

@bsilbaugh, you need to read the thread a bit closer, as the problem is that (s)he is not using the normal display, and in fact it was mentioned that it is not even connected.  So this should be normal for a macbook that it is not displaying anything to the second monitor if you never set it up to do so.  This is why I keep saying that I think that ubuntu is doing this for you. 

This is also why I was asking what kind of multi-headed vconsole support arch (or linux in general) has, as I am only familiar with multi-headed support in X.  I am not saying it is not possible, I am just saying that I do not know how to do it if it is.

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#15 2012-09-29 15:07:31

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

WonderWoofy wrote:

@bsilbaugh, you need to read the thread a bit closer, as the problem is that (s)he is not using the normal display, and in fact it was mentioned that it is not even connected.  So this should be normal for a macbook that it is not displaying anything to the second monitor if you never set it up to do so.  This is why I keep saying that I think that ubuntu is doing this for you. 

This is also why I was asking what kind of multi-headed vconsole support arch (or linux in general) has, as I am only familiar with multi-headed support in X.  I am not saying it is not possible, I am just saying that I do not know how to do it if it is.

If I plug in an external monitor to my MacBook 5,1 (late 2008 model), the console will automatically be mirrored on both the laptop display and the external monitor. Likewise, for my dual head workstation at home (custom built AMD system with ATI graphics); the console graphics simply get mirrored across all the active displays.


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#16 2012-09-29 16:03:52

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

Okay, so boast, boot ubuntu, and then go to one of the tty's.  Does the screen go black, or does it continue to mirror?

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#17 2012-09-29 17:11:16

boast
Member
Registered: 2010-09-28
Posts: 219

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

it works fine on a different tty.

I reinstalled arch again, using the grub2 method, but nothing. The CPU fan goes on full blast, and pressing the power button shuts it off, so I think its stuck on the grey boot menu thing of OSX.

I wish I knew how ubuntu did it, because there wasn't even an EFI partition.

edit: tried with syslinux, no luck either.

Last edited by boast (2012-09-29 17:36:15)


Asus M4A785TD-V ;; Phenom II X4 @ 3.9GHz ;; Ripjaws 12GB DDR3-1600 ;; 128GB Samsung 830 ;; MSI GTX460 v2 w/ blob ;; Arch Linux + KDE 4.x

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#18 2012-09-29 18:12:48

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

boast wrote:

I wish I knew how ubuntu did it, because there wasn't even an EFI partition.

It sounds like Ubuntu is using BIOS instead of EFI boot. If I understand correctly, the Apple firmware supports the BIOS boot method (cf ArchWiki MacBook). For instance, if I naively boot off the Arch live CD, it appears to boot in BIOS mode (no EFI variables get loaded).


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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#19 2012-09-30 16:06:25

boast
Member
Registered: 2010-09-28
Posts: 219

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

so is that the same as MBR?

I currently have to keep using the live cd to load syslinux. I wonder if theres a cd out there that does this automatically.


Asus M4A785TD-V ;; Phenom II X4 @ 3.9GHz ;; Ripjaws 12GB DDR3-1600 ;; 128GB Samsung 830 ;; MSI GTX460 v2 w/ blob ;; Arch Linux + KDE 4.x

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#20 2012-09-30 17:59:46

bsilbaugh
Member
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: 2011-11-15
Posts: 141

Re: Need help installing on a macbook

boast wrote:

so is that the same as MBR?

Traditionally, firmware based on the old BIOS system used the MBR.

In your case, you might try using a conventional MBR disk partitioning scheme and booting in BIOS mode. Even though Intel Macs have EFI firmware, the firmware does support booting in legacy BIOS mode (see here). My understanding is that the firmware will automatically fall back to BIOS mode when it detects an MBR on the boot medium, but I could be mistaken.

The fact that you didn't use the "bless" utility when initially setting up your system to boot in EFI mode, has me concerned. If you used something other than "bless" to register a boot loader or boot manager with the Apple firmware, you may have corrupted the firmware. This is because Apple does not follow the standard EFI specs. Corrupted firmware could explain your monitor problems. Perhaps booting in BIOS mode will bypass the problem. (I have about 60% confidence in this hypothesis. Maybe somebody else on this forum can correct me on this.)

The Arch Wiki has a nice article on UEFI and how it compares to the old BIOS system (link). Given your present situation, it wouldn't hurt to take some time to read through it carefully. Also, the rEFInd documentation is quite informative, and probably worth reading even if you don't use rEFInd.


- Good judgement comes from experience; experience comes from bad judgement. -- Mark Twain
- There's a remedy for everything but death. -- The wise fool, Sancho Panza
- The purpose of a system is what it does. -- Anthony Stafford Beer

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