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#1 2005-10-13 23:31:03

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

I have an ATI Radeon 9600 and I have the fglrx drivers installed with xorg but I still get lame results with glxgears and fgl_glxgears.  Why? I'm getting the same FPS as with my old Radeon 7500 using the OSS radeon drivers on my old PIII system! (my new system is a dual athlon-mp 2800)

Directed rendering is on, here is the output for fglrxinfo :

display: :0.0  screen: 0
OpenGL vendor string: ATI Technologies Inc.
OpenGL renderer string: RADEON 9600 Generic
OpenGL version string: 1.3.4769 (X4.3.0-8.8.25)

here is the glxgears output:

5296 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1059.200 FPS
5412 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1082.400 FPS
5410 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1082.000 FPS
5411 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1082.200 FPS

the fgl_glxgears output

927 frames in 5.0 seconds = 185.400 FPS
1089 frames in 5.0 seconds = 217.800 FPS
1090 frames in 5.0 seconds = 218.000 FPS
1102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 220.400 FPS
1089 frames in 5.0 seconds = 217.800 FPS

here is the display device section of my xorg.conf

Section "Device"
    Identifier                          "ATI Graphics Adapter"
    Driver                              "fglrx"
# ### generic DRI settings ###
# === disable PnP Monitor  ===
    #Option                              "NoDDC"
# === disable/enable XAA/DRI ===
    Option "no_accel"                   "no"
    Option "no_dri"                     "no"
# === misc DRI settings ===
    Option "mtrr"                       "off" # disable DRI mtrr mapper, driver has its own code for mtrr
# ### FireGL DDX driver module specific settings ###
# === Screen Management ===
    Option "DesktopSetup"               "0x00000000" 
    Option "MonitorLayout"              "AUTO, AUTO"
    Option "IgnoreEDID"                 "off"
    Option "HSync2"                     "unspecified" 
    Option "VRefresh2"                  "unspecified" 
    Option "ScreenOverlap"              "0" 
# === TV-out Management ===
    Option "NoTV"                       "yes"     
    Option "TVStandard"                 "NTSC-M"     
    Option "TVHSizeAdj"                 "0"     
    Option "TVVSizeAdj"                 "0"     
    Option "TVHPosAdj"                  "0"     
    Option "TVVPosAdj"                  "0"     
    Option "TVHStartAdj"                "0"     
    Option "TVColorAdj"                 "0"     
    Option "GammaCorrectionI"           "0x00000000"
    Option "GammaCorrectionII"          "0x00000000"
# === OpenGL specific profiles/settings ===
    Option "Capabilities"               "0x00000000"
# === Video Overlay for the Xv extension ===
    Option "VideoOverlay"               "on"
# === OpenGL Overlay ===
# Note: When OpenGL Overlay is enabled, Video Overlay
#       will be disabled automatically
    Option "OpenGLOverlay"              "off"
# === Center Mode (Laptops only) ===
    Option "CenterMode"                 "off"
# === Pseudo Color Visuals (8-bit visuals) ===
    Option "PseudoColorVisuals"         "off"
# === QBS Management ===
    Option "Stereo"                     "off"
    Option "StereoSyncEnable"           "1"
# === FSAA Management ===
    Option "FSAAEnable"                 "no"
    Option "FSAAScale"                  "1"
    Option "FSAADisableGamma"           "no"
    Option "FSAACustomizeMSPos"         "no"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX0"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY0"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX1"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY1"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX2"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY2"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX3"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY3"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX4"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY4"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosX5"                "0.000000"
    Option "FSAAMSPosY5"                "0.000000"
# === Misc Options ===
    Option "UseFastTLS"                 "0"
    Option "BlockSignalsOnLock"         "on"
    Option "UseInternalAGPGART"         "yes"
    Option "ForceGenericCPU"            "no"
    BusID "PCI:1:5:0"    # vendor=1002, device=4150
    Screen 0
EndSection

Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#2 2005-10-13 23:41:55

Deciare
Member
From: UTC -8:00
Registered: 2005-05-05
Posts: 79

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

In my experience, glxgears is a very poor benchmark. It's not good at much beyond showing that your 3D is accelerated (thousands of fps) or not accelerated (dozens of fps).

I underwent a major hardware upgrade a couple of months ago and glxgears had less than a 16% fps improvement to show for it. Everything else moved about 15 times faster.

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#3 2005-10-13 23:46:08

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

could you recommend a better benchmark? I still have my old box (PIII with Radeon 7500), so I could prepare a duel. I want my new box to wipe the floor with the old one! Just a question of rationalizing  my purchase.


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#4 2005-10-13 23:47:41

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

I mean, I've seen people get a 4500FPS with glxgears and a Radeon 9600 and they weren't satisfied. How could I be with a minute 1000FPS?


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#5 2005-10-13 23:54:07

cactus
Taco Eater
From: t͈̫̹ͨa͖͕͎̱͈ͨ͆ć̥̖̝o̫̫̼s͈̭̱̞͍̃!̰
Registered: 2004-05-25
Posts: 4,622
Website

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

From what I hear... ati drivers for linux are just THAT BAD.
You would be better off buying an nvidia card.


"Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept." -- Postel's Law
"tacos" -- Cactus' Law
"t̥͍͎̪̪͗a̴̻̩͈͚ͨc̠o̩̙͈ͫͅs͙͎̙͊ ͔͇̫̜t͎̳̀a̜̞̗ͩc̗͍͚o̲̯̿s̖̣̤̙͌ ̖̜̈ț̰̫͓ạ̪͖̳c̲͎͕̰̯̃̈o͉ͅs̪ͪ ̜̻̖̜͕" -- -̖͚̫̙̓-̺̠͇ͤ̃ ̜̪̜ͯZ͔̗̭̞ͪA̝͈̙͖̩L͉̠̺͓G̙̞̦͖O̳̗͍

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#6 2005-10-13 23:59:54

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

you mean having bought an nvidia card. shit. should've check about the drivers before buying ATI.


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#7 2005-10-14 00:11:46

Deciare
Member
From: UTC -8:00
Registered: 2005-05-05
Posts: 79

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

tyler wrote:

could you recommend a better benchmark?

Don't do much gaming myself, but I have the demo version of Unreal Tournament 2004 lying around. I read that the UT engine tends to stress the CPU more than the graphics card, so it's probably not an ideal benchmark, but it represents my hardware upgrade more accurately than glxgears. (average 2 fps (minimum detail, 640x480) -> average 38 fps (maximum detail, 1280x1024))

Edit: The nvidia driver has stability issues--especially with Composite and RenderAccel--but at least it's fast when it works.

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#8 2005-10-14 00:41:37

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

still, some people got 4500FPS out of glxgears, i should be able to get more then 1000FPS. is it my config?


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#9 2005-10-14 00:51:38

Deciare
Member
From: UTC -8:00
Registered: 2005-05-05
Posts: 79

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

glxgears seems very sensitive to processes other than itself, even sleeping and niced processes. For best results, I would try killing all non-essential daemons, stopping the network, restarting X with just an xterm (no window manager), then running glxgears like that.

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#10 2005-10-14 03:32:50

Cerebral
Forum Fellow
From: Waterloo, ON, CA
Registered: 2005-04-08
Posts: 3,108
Website

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

In my experience, if you have MESA installed, whether or not it's in use, it interferes with ATI's drivers.  Try pacman -R mesa and see if that does anything... that is, if it's installed. tongue

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#11 2005-10-15 22:04:07

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

I do have mesa installed, i will promptly remove it and see if it changes anyhting. Also, I can get about 60fps in UT2004 on my dual athlon in 800x600 and a lot of effects, whilst on my P3 I can barely get 20fps, all is good I suppose. The moral being: glx_gears is a shitty benchmark, only useful to check if 3Dacc is actualy working.


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#12 2005-10-16 13:01:58

Rotonen
Member
From: Espoo, Finland
Registered: 2005-03-08
Posts: 31
Website

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

On the Gentoo forums they used ut2004 with certain settings and the certain demo as the benchmark, perhaps we could have a similar thread here on Arch forums for people to see what kind of performance they should expect from their machines?

Also an open source gaming benchmark (3D Mark, anyone?) wouldn't hurt either: It's not fair that only Redmondian products have such a nifty piece of software.

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#13 2005-10-16 13:34:15

Cam
Member
From: Brisbane, Aus
Registered: 2004-12-21
Posts: 658
Website

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

You also need to take into account that people want to look as good as they possibly can online. While you may just type glxgears in a console and wait, some people will hide the glxgears window behind another one. Doing that I get around 15 000 fps in glxgears, when I leave the window on the top it sits at around 8 500 fps. Don't worry too much, if your games are playable at a good resolution and settings then your purchase is justified smile

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#14 2005-10-16 23:19:42

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

8500fps! what's your card? And I do agree that people might go the unethical scientist way and screw around with the data, but still, I get more perf, 3dacc wise, out of my laptop (integrated nvidia, not a marvelous card at all) than my super-desktop, even with UT2004.

As far as anybody knows, there is no OpenGL benchmark for linux gaming?


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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#15 2005-10-17 01:32:15

Rotonen
Member
From: Espoo, Finland
Registered: 2005-03-08
Posts: 31
Website

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

This added an another twist to the glxgears scheme: My 3D acceleration works otherwise perfectly with the new ATI drivers, but glxgears freezes my computer and I have to hardreset out of it.

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#16 2005-10-17 01:37:39

tyler
Member
From: Montreal
Registered: 2004-06-05
Posts: 35

Re: Radeon 9600 vs 7500, no improvement

The same thing happened to me, i had to disable AGPFastWrite in xorg.conf, no more crashes after that.


Till human voices wake us, and we drown. -Eliot

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