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#1 2012-12-23 23:17:23

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

[Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Just created a wiki on Lenovo's Thinkpad 230. Let me know how did it go?
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/ThinkPad_X230


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#2 2012-12-24 01:50:57

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

A quick browse over the page, and I will say that I think you supply some good info about the quirks of the machine in the second half.  but the review part may not be suitable for a technical wiki that is supposed to be about the technicalities of running Arch Linux.  I think the first portion might be better suited for a blog.

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#3 2012-12-24 03:31:46

opensrcrox
Member
Registered: 2012-08-10
Posts: 32

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

bassu, according to your wiki entry your cpu is  core i5-3210m with Intel HD 4000.
That would make it "Ivy Bridge" .... not "Sandy Bridge" graphics smile

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#4 2012-12-24 09:04:03

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

WonderWoofy wrote:

A quick browse over the page, and I will say that I think you supply some good info about the quirks of the machine in the second half..... I think the first portion might be better suited for a blog.

Agreed. I just thought it would be nice to sum up personal experience that would help other Archers who may be considering to get the machine.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#5 2012-12-24 09:07:03

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

opensrcrox wrote:

bassu, according to your wiki entry your cpu is  core i5-3210m with Intel HD 4000.
That would make it "Ivy Bridge" .... not "Sandy Bridge" graphics smile

Good catch! Seems like a typo. Corrected now smile


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#6 2012-12-24 16:30:45

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

You know, instead of a blog, I think it actually would probably be suitable to put the review portion on your user wiki page.  Then simply link to it from the actual x230 page.  I think in this way, the ThinkPad X230 page stays relevent to Arch Linux on that particular machine, yet if a given user feels the need to find more information, there is a link to your user page giving a personal opinion of the machine.

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#7 2012-12-25 13:58:26

hiob
Member
Registered: 2007-12-15
Posts: 19

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Thanks for the article, I'll give [[Powerdown]] a try. But what do the kernel-parameters do? A very brief description would be highly appreciated smile

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#8 2012-12-25 15:50:45

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Or the review can be moved to the discussions page leaving a back link on main page.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#9 2012-12-25 15:51:31

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

hiob wrote:

Thanks for the article, I'll give [[Powerdown]] a try. But what do the kernel-parameters do? A very brief description would be highly appreciated smile

Just added that as well including links to internal wikis! smile


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#10 2012-12-25 16:02:13

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

bassu wrote:

Or the review can be moved to the discussions page leaving a back link on main page.

I just think that the x230 page should ideally be left to how the machine functions with Arch Linux specifically.  I think the discussion page is meant specifically for community discussion about what should be involved/changed/added to said wiki page.  The user pages on the other hand can contain all kinds of things, and I feel that this would include your opinion of your machine and its features, since it seems to often be used to tell about the users hobbies, likes, dislikes, etc.  All in all, I don't think that the review is bad, I just think it would be better suited to a different part of the wiki... or a blog that is linked to.

Often on these forums, the statement "...that belongs on a blog..." is generally telling the user they have done something wrong, or their input is not appropriate here.  In this case, I am not saying that the first half is bad, but rather am just trying to brainstorm with you about places it might be better suited.  I think that the information you provided would be quite useful to many.  I know that I would have loved to have known that sometime in the las couple of years, my Thinkpad b/g/n wifi card had been changed from broadcom to a realtek with the worst module I have ever come across in Linux. 

Just in case you are not sure about what I speak of when I talk about the User page, here is a link to your blank page.  Here is an example of a User page that has come in handy for me a few times, and an example of one of the many ways it can be used.

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#11 2012-12-25 20:16:23

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

WonderWoofy wrote:

Just in case you are not sure about what I speak of when I talk about the User page, here is a link to your blank page.  Here is an example of a User page that has come in handy for me a few times, and an example of one of the many ways it can be used.

I don't have a personal blog nor have created a user page yet. The review is just a contribution. I can post it here and have a reference there in wiki although I think most contributions start with a personal experience. What I meant was that until the place for review is found to be moved to, we can put it to discussions temporarily!


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#12 2012-12-26 01:16:53

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/User:Bassu

Just put it there.  I thin that the forums are even less of an ideal place to put information that has nothing to do with Arch Linux.

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#13 2012-12-26 01:20:58

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

WonderWoofy wrote:

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/User:Bassu
I thin that the forums are even less of an ideal place to put information that has nothing to do with Arch Linux.

Negative. I see lots of information on Arch forums that has nothing to do with "Arch" itself tongue I don't prefer to have a User page or a blog so I am gonna post the review in Laptops that run Arch I think or in General Discussions.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#14 2012-12-26 01:23:30

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Yeah, I guess that would be an acceptable place.  I forgot about that thread.

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#15 2013-01-06 14:38:16

Warnaud
Member
From: /dev/random
Registered: 2006-03-02
Posts: 58
Website

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Hi,
I'm thinking of buying one of these x230 to replace my nice x60
However I'd like to have the fingerprint reader to work, have you tried this fix: http://darkblue.homeip.net/fingerprint/ … 71&Posts=7 ?
Seems like changing some udev rules like here: http://volker.de/2012/12/fingerprint-gu … pad-t430s/ (watch out for the funky quotes ... ) do the trick

Many thanks for the wiki page anyhow :-)


-=<>=-
Archlinux French site : http://www.archlinux.fr

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#16 2013-01-06 14:53:24

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Warnaud wrote:

However I'd like to have the fingerprint reader to work, have you tried this fix: http://darkblue.homeip.net/fingerprint/ … 71&Posts=7 ?
Seems like changing some udev rules like here: http://volker.de/2012/12/fingerprint-gu … pad-t430s/ (watch out for the funky quotes ... ) do the trick

Sure. I'll have to reboot cause I disabled the biometric scanner in BIOS earlier. I shall check it out soon when I reboot.

Warnaud wrote:

Many thanks for the wiki page anyhow :-)

Glad, it helped! smile


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#17 2013-01-06 15:46:48

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

@Warnaud, I have a Thinkpad E430, and it has a fingerprint reader. The newer models of Thinkpads typically come with Upeks, and are incompatible with the normal avenues of fprint and thinkfinger.  Though it seems you have found information on fingerprint-gui. 

Fingerprint-gui is actually in the AUR.  It apparently contains a whole bunch of open and prorietary drivers for fingerprint readers.  So it actually was able to get mine working.  I have seen reports though of people who have just received their Thinkpads from Lenovo, and the Upek models are so new there is no Linux driver for them.

Slightly related, but possibly irrelevant, I wanted to get everything working in my computer, so I used fingerprint-gui.  That was all fine and dandy, but my god the fingerprint reader is annoying. Unless you are the slowest typer on the face of the earth, using it for things like sudo and su are terribly irritatingly slow.  Not to mention that if you are not using a GUI (think console/tty) that you simply have to fail authentication before it lets you enter your password via keyboard.

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#18 2013-01-06 15:56:41

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

WonderWoofy wrote:

That was all fine and dandy, but my god the fingerprint reader is annoying. Unless you are the slowest typer on the face of the earth, using it for things like sudo and su are terribly irritatingly slow.  Not to mention that if you are not using a GUI (think console/tty) that you simply have to fail authentication before it lets you enter your password via keyboard.

I had similar experiences with implementation of facial recognition tool. It was terribly slow but regardless the project has been dead for years. What about using fingerprint reader only to login to Display Manager ? If it's not that slow, I may want to set it up with SLiM.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#19 2013-01-06 16:07:10

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

I don't use a login manager so I cannot comment on this.  It is not the functionality of the fingerprint reader itself that is slow.  It is the fact that when you use it for sudo, it actually has to launch a small gui window that indicates whether or not authentication is achieved.  Also, when it is asking for this, you cannot simply type your password in.  It will fail, and then ask again.  The second time it will work, but that just seems silly. 

I think the only use saces in which I think it might be good are actually for a login manager and screen lock.  I know that some thinkpads have a chip that enables them to be turned on with it, but my machine is not one of those.  I am not sure about the X230, but I would imagine that it does... though the increased power consumption from such a feature would probably lead me to turn it off.  I kind of want my system to be drawing as little power as possible when it is off or sleeping.

That brings up another point.  The Upek driver for my fingerprint reader was not the greatest.  So its power consumption was pretty high.  It appeared as though it was nearly constantly polling this little device.  My sdcard reader is the same way, so I only load the module as necessary, but the fingerprint readers power consumption made my sdcard reader look like it was sipping power.  Maybe (hopefully) there have been some improvments since I configured (and then unconfigured) all of this stuff.  But I think it is certainly something to keep an eye on.

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#20 2013-01-06 16:27:20

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

X230's manual says this:

Table 4. LED behavior list_fingerprint reader
LED behavior Description
Steady green The fingerprint reader is ready to swipe.
Blinking green once The fingerprint is being authenticated or has been authenticated.
Blinking green The fingerprint reader is ready to swipe in power-on authentication state.
Blinking amber The fingerprint could not be authenticated.
Steady amber for 15 seconds The power-on authentication feature is disabled after three bad fingerprint swipes.

Nothing on device standby though. I assume it would have normal PCIE power management features but yea I have a conservationist attitude when it comes to spending power so I have disabled the PCI devices that I don't use.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#21 2013-01-06 16:45:27

WonderWoofy
Member
From: Los Gatos, CA
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 8,412

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Yes, I would have to imagine that the firmware would hopefully do a better job of power management than a driver made by upek kind of half assed because they figure it is not windows...

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#22 2013-01-06 16:48:45

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

WonderWoofy wrote:

Yes, I would have to imagine that the firmware would hopefully do a better job of power management than a driver made by upek kind of half assed because they figure it is not windows...

Agreed.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#23 2013-01-06 18:37:41

Warnaud
Member
From: /dev/random
Registered: 2006-03-02
Posts: 58
Website

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

bassu wrote:

Sure. I'll have to reboot cause I disabled the biometric scanner in BIOS earlier. I shall check it out soon when I reboot.

Many thanks I'll use it mostly in terminal/console :-) maybe with xdm if it works


-=<>=-
Archlinux French site : http://www.archlinux.fr

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#24 2013-01-07 06:26:22

bassu
Member
Registered: 2011-12-21
Posts: 90

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

Warnaud wrote:
bassu wrote:

Sure. I'll have to reboot cause I disabled the biometric scanner in BIOS earlier. I shall check it out soon when I reboot.

Many thanks I'll use it mostly in terminal/console :-) maybe with xdm if it works

It works! Flawlessly! Just tested with su on Terminal and xterm using newest SDK precompiled driver.
Contrary to popular believes, this is pretty fast and the device goes to sleep after one scan until next 'su' is called.


The greatest threat to knowledge is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge!

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#25 2013-01-07 06:28:24

Warnaud
Member
From: /dev/random
Registered: 2006-03-02
Posts: 58
Website

Re: [Wiki] ThinkPad X230

bassu wrote:

It works! Flawlessly! Just tested with su on Terminal and xterm using newest SDK precompiled driver.
Contrary to popular believes, this is pretty fast and the device goes to sleep after one scan until next 'su' is called.

Thanks a lot for testing! Going to buy one then tongue no more excuses ... ;-)


-=<>=-
Archlinux French site : http://www.archlinux.fr

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