Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

phunni · 2017-07-11 19:12:42

From the searches that I've done, I'm thinking there isn't, but I just wanted to ask on here to be sure.

I realise that CUPS is the standard Linux printing system, I just hate that I now have to run a full server (as well as avahi because my printer is on the network) on clients as well as the main print server. I've read the reasons why this is the case and client.conf has been deprecated, but I don't see any of those problems actually being a problem for me. At least not as much of a problem as having to run redundant servers...

I've looked at Google Cloud Print and, while it seems like a fairly elegant solution, I am concerned about security etc.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Are there native alternatives? What about cloud services - does anyone use them as their primary print system?

drcouzelis · 2017-07-11 19:50:55

phunni wrote:

I just hate that I now have to run a full server

Why do you hate it?

Trilby · 2017-07-11 19:52:26

What do you mean by alternative? If you want something that does everything CUPS does in exactly the way CUPS does it, then no, there is no alternative. If you just mean any other way to print, there are many. I've not used CUPS in ages. This is all I use to print at work (IP address and accounting codes removed):

#!/bin/bash

STAPLE=''
#STAPLE='-F finishing=1%20Staple'
HOLES=''
#HOLES='-F punch=2%20Hole%20Punch'
#HOLES='-F punch=3%20Hole%20Punch'
COPY=""
PLAIN=""
PLEX="-F plex=duplex"
while getopts "bc:hps" arg; do case $arg in
   b) PLAIN="yes"; PLEX="-F plex=tumble" ;;
   c) COPY="-F copy-count=$OPTARG" ;;
   h) echo "$(basename $0) [ -b | -c copies | -h | -s ]" ;;
   p) PLAIN="yes" ;;
   s) PLEX="" ;;
esac; done
shift $((OPTIND-1))
[[ -z $1 ]] && exit

[[ -z $PLAIN ]] && pdfjoin "$1" --fitpaper false --paper letter --outfile /tmp/preprint.pdf || cp "$1" /tmp/preprint.pdf

curl -X POST -H 'Content-Type:multipart/form-data' -A 'Mozilla/4.0' \
   -F 'NextPage=/print/print.php?submitted=true' \
   -F 'job_type=print' \
   -F 'noname=' \
   $COPY $PLEX $STAPLE $HOLES \
   -F 'accounting_information_avp="XRX_USERID,XXXXXX"' \
   -F '_adm_SJ=@/tmp/preprint.pdf' \
   -F 'CSRFToken=XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX' \
   http://00.00.00.00/upload/xerox.set

This first makes sure the pdf is on the right size paper, then it sends it directly to the xerox printer via it's network connection.

I also have a label printer with a USB connection. I have a script to send the ZPL (printer control language) code directly to the /dev/ node.

So yes, there are many options. If you want to learn to speak your printer's language, no software nor servers are necessary. If you want to printer to understand your language, and print documents from word processors and other such programs, then you will need CUPS.

loqs · 2017-07-11 19:57:06

If dynamic printer detection / configuration is not needed you could disable AVAHI. Without AVAHI you could then switch to socket based activation so cups its not started on boot.

phunni · 2017-07-11 21:28:35

drcouzelis wrote:

phunni wrote:
I just hate that I now have to run a full server
Why do you hate it?

because it's redundant and a waste of resources.

headkase · 2017-07-11 21:37:23

phunni wrote:

drcouzelis wrote:
phunni wrote:
I just hate that I now have to run a full server
Why do you hate it?
because it's redundant and a waste of resources.

Resources exist to be consumed. And consumed they will be, if not by this generation then by some future. By what right does this forgotten future seek to deny us our birthright? None I say! Let us take what is ours, chew and eat our fill.
CEO Nwabudike Morgan
"The Ethics of Greed"

Last edited by headkase (2017-07-11 21:38:21)

phunni · 2017-07-11 21:39:32

loqs wrote:

If dynamic printer detection / configuration is not needed you could disable AVAHI. Without AVAHI you could then switch to socket based activation so cups its not started on boot.

Interesting. I suppose I could use avahi to identify the URL and then not use it again. This socket-based activation you talk about is very interesting to me...

loqs · 2017-07-11 21:56:36

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php … 9#p1720219 covers the changes needed to switched to socket based activation.

drcouzelis · 2017-07-12 14:16:18

phunni wrote:

because it's redundant and a waste of resources.

What is the resource usage? If you were to install an alternative to CUPS that has all of the features you need, what would you do to compare the two?

This is a serious question. (I'm not trying to be annoying!) On my computer, according to "ps aux --sort -rss | grep cups" and "top | grep cups", CUPS is using 0% of the CPU and 0% of the memory...

phunni · 2017-07-12 16:02:35

@drcouzelis it just annoys my sense of neatness that I have to run the same server on multiple machines - including what should be simple clients - for reason that make no sense to me.

ngoonee · 2017-07-12 18:55:01

phunni wrote:

@drcouzelis it just annoys my sense of neatness that I have to run the same server on multiple machines - including what should be simple clients - for reason that make no sense to me.

The 'server' is effectively free. Do you run, for example, ntpd? Or acpid? Or dbus? Maybe sshd?

phunni · 2017-07-12 22:37:18

ngoonee wrote:

phunni wrote:
@drcouzelis it just annoys my sense of neatness that I have to run the same server on multiple machines - including what should be simple clients - for reason that make no sense to me.
The 'server' is effectively free. Do you run, for example, ntpd? Or acpid? Or dbus? Maybe sshd?

Yes, but in this case, the server is supposed to be running on both what is the actual print server and the client machines. That's just ugly design imho.

brebs · 2017-07-12 22:56:33

phunni wrote:

That's just ugly design imho.

It's more like, real life is ugly.

E.g., you print a 2-page document, which goes into a printer's queue, while the printer is busy printing someone else's document. The printer runs out of paper, after printing the first page of your document. The printer is in a diferent room. By what mechanism, if not a local daemon, would you like to be informed about the incomplete situation?

drcouzelis · 2017-07-13 15:10:57

Can someone help me find a video?? I'm going crazy trying to find it!

It was in the past few years, at something like a Linux developer conference, and the speaker was advocating a new lightweight display manager. The speaker spends the first five minutes of his talk by explaining how horrible and convoluted and bloated and stupid GNOME Display Manager was. Then one of the GNOME developers in the audience stands up and (in a rather uncomfortable exchange) absolutely DESTROYS the speaker's whole argument by explaining why GDM needs to be the way it is, and how it's actually a good design.

It seems applicable to this thread.

(...I hope you don't mind me derailing the thread just a tad...)

Last edited by drcouzelis (2017-07-13 15:11:29)

V1del · 2017-07-13 16:22:52

I'm fairly certain you are talking about https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTdUmlGxVo0 but this really only tangentially relates to this thread.

HiImTye · 2017-07-14 06:18:30

my printer is a network printer, and I've never run avahi. CUPS also is listed as 0% for both memory and CPU for me. for a poorly designed implimentation, it seems to be very CPU and memory efficient

edit: I just watched that video, and it was very entertaining lol

Last edited by HiImTye (2017-07-14 06:51:31)

seth · 2017-07-14 16:40:03

Print by sending mails, see eg. https://blog.thomashampel.com/blog/tomc … errypi.htm

(Yes, this technically means to print emails ... ;-)

Alad · 2017-07-14 17:08:03

seth wrote:

Print by sending mails, see eg. https://blog.thomashampel.com/blog/tomc … errypi.htm
(Yes, this technically means to print emails ... ;-)

NET::ERR_CERT_AUTHORITY_INVALID

Trilby · 2017-07-14 17:15:49

Seth, how is that guide "a realistic alternative to CUPS" when that guide includes "Step 5 - Install and Configure CUPS"?

seth · 2017-07-14 17:19:32

It's not my blog m'key?
He's got a StartCom certificate - and should certainly replace that, yes.

seth · 2017-07-14 17:24:27

@Trilby
You're using CUPS on *one* machine - your print server.
Afaiu the OP, he dislikes the fact that he needs cups on every client - this way he'll only need a mailclient on n-1 machines.

Obviously the approach does not necessarily cover "how do I talk to my printer itfp" - because that vastly depends on the capabilities of the printer.

Edit: moved a comma for better readability.

Last edited by seth (2017-07-15 06:15:10)

Trilby · 2017-07-14 18:03:52

Well in that case, my alternative would be to just use a flash drive. Put the files to print on a flash drive, move it to the computer with CUPS, then print.

Heck, while we're at it, you could actually do away with CUPS entirely if emailing the files or transfering them via the flash drive are viable options: just email the files to a collegue who runs Windows and ask them to print the documents. Or use a flash drive to carry the files to a windows computer: no CUPS needed.

seth · 2017-07-14 18:35:14

Now you're being absurd again. Walk a usb key??? Us fat neckbeards? Out of the basement?
You got crazy...

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php … 3#p1689853

x33a · 2017-07-15 04:46:42

Let's not veer off-topic folks.

seth · 2017-07-15 06:50:26

I thought that was the plan ...? ;-)

Ok, sum up:
You need to be able to print "somehow", ie. either you've got a sufficiently capable printer (as Trilby's Xerox) or "build" a print server using cups (and some cheap hardware)
Then you can use up to random ways to get the print-data to the print server, be it http POST, mail, s/ftp, ... or yes, a usb key.

The advantage of the self-build server are costs. You can do this with any whatsoever cheap consumer printer (good in case of low print volume)
Also you've more freedom on getting the data there (and most office suits allow sending data by mail)
On top of that you still *can* use cups on selected clients.
And ultimately the OP suggests he's already running CUPS on a print server (so he's half-way through)

Everything else is unreasonable for general purpose printing.
You can write PCL directly into the device, just two problems:
a) "the device" (local printer, known device)
b) get PCL out of *.docx (or whatever)
In the end, you'd implement a neat daemon that does this conversion, maybe detects attached printers and perhaps even interprets return codes ....
iow, implement a crippled any probably buggy and more ressource consuming version of CUPS.

--- this is really all I can say to clarify the matter, so I'm out as of here.

Arch Linux

#1 2017-07-11 19:12:42

Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#2 2017-07-11 19:50:55

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#3 2017-07-11 19:52:26

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#4 2017-07-11 19:57:06

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#5 2017-07-11 21:28:35

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#6 2017-07-11 21:37:23

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#7 2017-07-11 21:39:32

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#8 2017-07-11 21:56:36

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#9 2017-07-12 14:16:18

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#10 2017-07-12 16:02:35

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#11 2017-07-12 18:55:01

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#12 2017-07-12 22:37:18

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#13 2017-07-12 22:56:33

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#14 2017-07-13 15:10:57

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#15 2017-07-13 16:22:52

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#16 2017-07-14 06:18:30

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#17 2017-07-14 16:40:03

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#18 2017-07-14 17:08:03

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#19 2017-07-14 17:15:49

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#20 2017-07-14 17:19:32

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#21 2017-07-14 17:24:27

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#22 2017-07-14 18:03:52

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#23 2017-07-14 18:35:14

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#24 2017-07-15 04:46:42

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

#25 2017-07-15 06:50:26

Re: Is there a realistic alternative to CUPS?

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