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#1 2018-08-02 20:16:17

Roken
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Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 880

[SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Libreoffice-fresh 6.0.5-2 depends on python 3.7.0.3. Although there's an update for Blender, installing all three breaks the Blender GUI, inasmuch as all the buttons in the GUI disappear. Downgrading all three (libre to 6.0.5.1, python to 3.6.6-1, and blender to 17:2.79.b.git3.32432d91-1) fixes it.

None can be updated alone, without breaking dependencies on the other.

These are all official packages, and so should work together.

This week, there seem to be a lot of official packages not working correctly for me.

Last edited by Roken (2018-08-04 16:08:56)


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#2 2018-08-02 20:18:58

progandy
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

These packages are still in testing, btw. The python 3.7 rebuild has not landed in extra yet. Blender might have to be built from git master instead of the beta release.

Last edited by progandy (2018-08-02 20:27:56)


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#3 2018-08-02 20:47:18

jasonwryan
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Moving to Testing...


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#4 2018-08-02 21:11:13

Roken
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From: UK
Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 880

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

I'm already on the git version.

community/blender 17:2.79.b.git3.32432d91-1 [installed]

But another sit back and wait. As long as I know I'm just waiting for stuff to catch up, I can live with it.


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#5 2018-08-02 21:18:31

progandy
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Roken, that is not the git master version, but the version tagged as "blender-v2.79b-release" in git. If you want to try git master, then use blender-git from the AUR.
https://git.blender.org/gitweb/gitweb.c … t/32432d91

Last edited by progandy (2018-08-02 21:19:06)


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#6 2018-08-02 21:42:56

Roken
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

I'll give it a go. Building now.


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#7 2018-08-03 00:00:06

Eschwartz
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Okay, so what does this have to do with libreoffice?

It sounds like you're saying that blender in community-testing, despite having been successfully rebuilt for python 3.7, has additional compatibility issues not caught during the compilation phase. It looks like the source code has tests, but those tests are not run...

Please fix your thread title.

Last edited by Eschwartz (2018-08-03 00:00:20)


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#8 2018-08-03 04:42:02

foutrelis
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Added a patch for Python 3.7 support to blender 17:2.79.b.git3.32432d91-3.

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#9 2018-08-03 05:00:48

Roken
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From: UK
Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 880

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Eschwartz wrote:

Okay, so what does this have to do with libreoffice?

The python version that breaks blender was only installed as a dependency of Libreoffice. It isn't sufficient just to downgrade blender and python, Libre also has to be downgraded.


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#10 2018-08-03 05:23:30

Eschwartz
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Roken wrote:

The python version that breaks blender was only installed as a dependency of Libreoffice. It isn't sufficient just to downgrade blender and python, Libre also has to be downgraded.

Yeah, so I like how you imply that it's totally okay to install mismatched versions of blender from community, which depends on python, libreoffice-fresh from testing which has a versioned dependency on python from testing, and python itself (from testing). And the only problem you see is that libreoffice complains due to the versioned dependency if you try to re-downgrade just python.

You don't care at all that Arch Linux does not support partial upgrades, and you especially don't care that:

$ pkg-list-linked-libraries blender libpython
==> checking linked libraries for blender-17:2.79.b.git3.32432d91-2-x86_64.pkg.tar.xz ...
/usr/bin/blender
  NEEDED               libpython3.7m.so.1.0

It's quite literally impossible to execute the blender binary from community-testing/blender unless you also have the testing/python package.

This is a rather core concept behind rebuilding an entire programming language in incompatible ways. You need to upgrade or downgrade *every* python-related package of any description in lockstep, otherwise those packages simply don't work according to any measure. (But that's hardly important information to announce in the support forums when discussing why one specific package -- blender -- fails to work.)

You've been a member of this forum and the wider Arch community for long enough to know better than this. I'm ashamed and embarrassed on your behalf.

This week, there seem to be a lot of official packages not working correctly for me.

Maybe, they all use python 3.7 and you've downgraded to python 3.6, thereby breaking them...

Might I suggest you don't use [testing], if you find it consistently breaking for you because you do partial updates without understanding what those are?

Last edited by Eschwartz (2018-08-03 05:25:40)


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#11 2018-08-03 22:13:22

Roken
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Are you suggesting that using testing should not be about testing? I've tested. I found a fault. I've come here to see if it's my fault, or something wider. And in the process, I've found that the only way to keep my system going is a (what I hope is temporary) partial upgrade, because a full upgrade doesn't work.

And yes, I've been around Arch and Linux generally to get by.

And no, I did not do a partial upgrade. I had to do a partial downgrade to get things working.

EDIT: No issues with anything else relying on python that I've found.

Last edited by Roken (2018-08-03 22:14:45)


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#12 2018-08-03 22:18:21

Roken
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From: UK
Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 880

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Might I suggest you don't use [testing], if you find it consistently breaking for you because you do partial updates without understanding what those are?

I don't find testing "consistently" breaking. Just a bad week.


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#13 2018-08-03 22:44:04

Eschwartz
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Registered: 2014-08-08
Posts: 2,145

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Roken wrote:

Are you suggesting that using testing should not be about testing? I've tested. I found a fault. I've come here to see if it's my fault, or something wider. And in the process, I've found that the only way to keep my system going is a (what I hope is temporary) partial upgrade, because a full upgrade doesn't work.

And yes, I've been around Arch and Linux generally to get by.

Sigh.

If you're correctly using testing and didn't do a partial upgrade, then why, when you discovered a bug in blender, did you start talking about libreoffice?

And no, I did not do a partial upgrade. I had to do a partial downgrade to get things working.

EDIT: No issues with anything else relying on python that I've found.

No you most certainly did not get things working by doing a partial downgrade. If you downgraded those three packages, then every single other package relying on python will be broken instead, no exceptions. Anything that installs a module. (Okay, a package which only installs one file, that being a python script stored in /usr/bin/, might not break. Might.)

So then you come onto the forums and start, what, complaining that "installing all three breaks the Blender GUI"? That's completely wrong on every level, installing libreoffice is completely unrelated. You wanna argue that libreoffice requires you to install python 3.7? Be my guest -- just don't try to pretend-associate that with the actual issue, which is blender and python 3.7.

And the correct and only way to downgrade over 1000 packages repository-wide (and I guarantee you had more than three of those installed on your computer, if for no other reason than that blender depends on several of them) is to temporarily disable [testing] and use pacman -Suu to downgrade to a consistent state.

Finally: If you're going to go off on wild tangents about libreoffice breaking blender, then it is simply not worth my time to read your threads, because maybe the next one will be as obtuse and difficult to extract meaning from as this one was.

So long.


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#14 2018-08-04 08:18:00

Roken
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From: UK
Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 880

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

I'm not going to get into an argument. A partial upgrade would involve excluding stuff from the upgrade to start with, something I didn't do.

Anyhoo, blender has been upgraded in the repo now, and the issue is fixed, so I'm marking as solved. For the record. Nothing is ignored in pacman.conf again.


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#15 2018-08-04 13:54:45

Trilby
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Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Gents, Libreoffice was a red herring.  I agree the thread title should be revised, but it doesn't seem symptomatic of anything more than a title influenced by a coincidence.

I suspect one need not have libreoffice installed to see this problem: the problem is between blender and python.  Of course if you were to downgrade python you'd need to downgrade everything that depends on it - and, in fact, pacman would not even let you downgrade python without downgrading everything that had a versioned dependency on it.  In this case, on Roken's machine, that just happened to coinincidentally be libreoffice.

Eschwartz seems to be emphasizing that if you did downgrade just these three, everything else that also depends on python might also be broken: despite not having a versioned dependency, those packages would assume python 3.7 was installed.  So if they are broken too, that is not because of a "bad week" but because of the partial downgrade.

Roken, I hope this helps you see why LO is not actually relevant to the problem and is a bit of a distraction.  Removing it from the title would be good as it's not an LO dependency that is a problem for blender, but rather the current testing version of python might be.

Last edited by Trilby (2018-08-05 03:50:54)


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#16 2018-08-05 03:16:56

Eschwartz
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Registered: 2014-08-08
Posts: 2,145

Re: [SOLVED]python breaks blender UI

Roken wrote:

I'm not going to get into an argument. A partial upgrade would involve excluding stuff from the upgrade to start with, something I didn't do.

Anyhoo, blender has been upgraded in the repo now, and the issue is fixed, so I'm marking as solved. For the record. Nothing is ignored in pacman.conf again.

"partial upgrade" == "partial downgrade"
"partial downgrade" == "partial upgrade"

A partial upgrade by any other name breaks just as bad. You claim to have downgraded three and only three packages, leaving your system in a partially upgraded state, and that's all there is to it.
I don't understand what pacman.conf has to do with anything, though -- at any rate, using IgnorePkg in pacman.conf is by no means the only way to end up in a partially upgraded state...

But, the thread title no longer erroneously conflates libreoffice with either:

  • the source of the problem, or

  • the cause of a completely different problem (called "doing partial upgrades/downgrades/however you wish to paint the shed")

So I suppose I'm as happy as I'm likely to get.


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