[Solved] i3 won't start

Nan123 · 2022-03-28 07:47:49

Hi, I made a post of the forum a few days ago with this same issue, and for some reason, on my 4th install in a row doing the same thing, it worked. When starting x, I am met with my mouse cursor, with a clock icon, after about 30 secs it goes to a regular x11 cursor and nothing else. I have my xorg log file here: https://pastebin.com/gkAga6fM. When using the zen kernel(at least I think that's was causes it), i get errors about it not being able to find modules, and a radically different xorg log. I have dkms drivers so I'm not sure why it says that. I have tried to reinstall the nvidia drivers, boot without them, add nvidia to mkinitcpio, nomodeset. Pretty much everything I could think of, yet this issue still won't go away. I don't know why it can't see modules. I really need help, I have no other ideas. Please refer to my new logs, most of this can be disregarded.

EDIT: SOLVED! This issue has been solved: gnu-free-fonts, or perhaps another font package is needed for i3 to work, but is not listed as a dependency. Installing gnu-free-fonts fixed this, I'm going to let the package maintainer know about this.

Last edited by Nan123 (2022-03-29 01:11:08)

V1del · 2022-03-28 08:26:41

For zen not being able to find modules it's likely you don't have linux-zen-headers installed. In that xorg.log xorg is correctly starting and running. so you need to get more specific towards your issue.

FWIW you have a autogenerated xorg.conf, if that doesn't exist for no other reason than to have generated it you generally want to remove that.

Nan123 · 2022-03-28 13:56:47

I have headers, it was the first thing I made sure of. I generated the xorg conf later on as a debugging step, same issue happens without.

V1del · 2022-03-28 14:07:27

Well according to that log the xorg server runs fine. Post a full journal as well as your .xinitrc if you need to look at this more in depth

sudo journalctl -b

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/List_o … n_services

Regarding the issue on zen, make sure the headers the installed kernel and the booted kernel match...

pacman -Qs 'linux-zen|nvidia'
uname -a

Also the clocks and the terminal is what is started by a default .xinitrc. Are you aware of that and is that your intention or is your actual goal to start something else ?

Last edited by V1del (2022-03-28 14:21:36)

Nan123 · 2022-03-28 14:40:00

I am aware, I changed it to start i3. I'll being doing a fresh install once I get home, clear of any strange modifications I made and I'll provide you with the xorg log and the other info you requested, thanks for the help.

seth · 2022-03-28 15:26:47

wrt. your other thread you can add your xinitrc and the i3 config … and your .zsh* … to the list.

Nan123 · 2022-03-28 15:40:19

Will do, though I'm gonna be using bash for now.

Nan123 · 2022-03-28 22:37:19

Hello again, here is the info requested on a fresh install:

Xorg log: https://dpaste.com/3FNQG9YMW
Bootlog: https://dpaste.com/2RX452MER
Xinitrc: https://dpaste.com/ESG9LFABP

Bash and zsh profiles haven't been touched and I haven't configured Getty for autlogin, i3 config hasn't been created yet. Also, the pacman and uname commands check out, everything accounted for, including headers. Also, no xconf yet. Also, some of the stuff I said in my original post can be disregarded, please check my main post. Thanks again.

Last edited by Nan123 (2022-03-28 22:41:53)

Nan123 · 2022-03-29 00:51:43

Also, rebuilding initramfs didn't work either. It seems to be complaining about missing modules for a GPU, even though drivers are installed properly.

Last edited by Nan123 (2022-03-29 00:52:56)

Nan123 · 2022-03-29 01:03:43

Potential related issue: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=275140

Here is my i3 log BTW: https://dpaste.com/GC3D6KUA6

Nan123 · 2022-03-29 01:10:21

This issue has been solved: gnu-free-fonts, or perhaps another font package is needed for i3 to work, but is not listed as a dependency. Installing gnu-free-fonts fixed this, I'm going to let the package maintainer know about this.

seth · 2022-03-29 06:41:49

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/I3#New … rbled_text

Nan123 · 2022-03-30 19:47:33

Hm, never showed garbled text for me. Nothing but a black screen and a mouse cursor.

seth · 2022-03-30 20:31:35

I guess the elements shrunk into nothingness, but the point was that there's general awareness of the requirement.
But short of depending on ttf-font (what's technically false) and since a WM likely implies usecases where you need *some* font anyway, I don't expect changes to the dependency list of i3-wm.

Trilby · 2022-03-30 20:38:36

seth wrote:

... depending on ttf-font (what's technically false)

How is it false? That is the dependency that should be added. If the software doesn't work properly without one of the packages fulfilling the ttf-font virtual-package, then that is a dependency.

seth wrote:

... and since a WM likely implies usecases where you need *some* font anyway

That kind of reasoning has never been valid (and has been explicitly rejected) for any other dependency listing questions.

seth · 2022-03-30 20:58:06

Because afaik i3 doesn't require ttf specifically and otf/otb/type1 packages systematically don't (can't reasonably) provide ttf-font.
You need somefont™ and that pseudo package doesn't exist.
More technically, you don't even need any font package installed, because you could have just something from dafont etc. in your ~/.fonts

At least openbox has the same "issue" and I guess some more not-DEs will.

Edit: more technicallyier, one might not even want to use i3bar and the WM itself would work fine w/o fonts (oc, the managed clients probably not so much…)

Last edited by seth (2022-03-30 21:01:05)

Trilby · 2022-03-30 21:04:49

seth wrote:

you could have just something from dafont etc. in your ~/.fonts

That initially seems like a fair point - but it would completely invalidate the use of the ttf-font package which many packages do depend on just to avoid the sort of problem described in this thread.

But more importantly, initially in the above statement is the operative word. I could have all sorts of stuff installed locally that could provide what other packages require. I3-wm depends on yajl - but I could locally build and install my own yajl. That ability doesn't mean that the dependency shouldn't be listed.

seth · 2022-03-30 22:04:08

Initially that seems like item-picking

So that'd leave us w/ the other reasons that
a) i3 doesn't necessarily require a font
b) certainly not a ttf (what makes, the intial contention, "ttf-font" still technically false)

which many packages do depend on

In particular this many:
-------------------------------
efl (requires ttf-font)
enlightenment (requires ttf-font)
firefox (requires ttf-font)
firefox-developer-edition (requires ttf-font)
inkscape (requires ttf-font)
intellij-idea-community-edition (requires ttf-font)
josm (requires ttf-font)
juce (requires ttf-font)
mplayer (requires ttf-font)
netbeans (requires ttf-font)
opera (requires ttf-font)
php7-imagick (requires ttf-font)
php-imagick (requires ttf-font)
pycharm-community-edition (requires ttf-font)
qt5-webengine (requires ttf-font)
qt6-webengine (requires ttf-font)
sddm (requires ttf-font)
slim (requires ttf-font)
steam (requires ttf-font)
sway (requires ttf-font)
thunderbird (requires ttf-font)
vala (requires ttf-font)
vivaldi (requires ttf-font)
zaproxy (requires ttf-font)
zim (requires ttf-font)
perl-tk (requires ttf-font) (check)

Then there're of course some packages that draw specific fonts (most notably gtk3/4 will get you cantarell) - ttf-font is btw. also rather limited:

ttf-font (ttf-dejavu, ttf-liberation, ttf-bitstream-vera, ttf-droid, gnu-free-fonts, noto-fonts, ttf-croscore, ttf-ibm-plex)

Returning to the initially picked item cherry:

I3-wm depends on yajl

Yes: yajl. Versioned libraries.
Not "some json thing, any of the gazillion flavors out there will do".
Otoh, https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Fonts# … stallation - installing fonts w/o packages isn't recommended, but expected (and reality)

I'm not saying that the status quo is ideal, but in reality you'd need a "somesortoffont" pseudo package, every font (well, maybe not pcf's anymore?) would have to provide that and pretty much every GUI package can add it to its dependencies (unless indirectly resolved) - and then i3 is among the packages that would have most credibility to turn that "optional". Unlike eg. https://archlinux.org/packages/extra/x86_64/xterm/ (to pick one more example that fonts are simply assumed across the field)
Alternatively arch could pick a default font and add that to the base package.

Trilby · 2022-03-31 01:36:42

I'm not sure why you are listing a bunch of WMs. Most WMs do not need a font, period. Those that display a bar or title bars might, like sway which does depend on ttf-font. And even though some WMs may require a font and don't list it is not an argument that for what is correct. If a package requires something else to be installed in order to function properly, that something else is called a dependency - that's really the definition of the word.

The fact that ttf-font does not encompass all possible things that would satisfy the dependency is not relevant to whether or not a dependency exists.

Last edited by Trilby (2022-03-31 01:37:19)

seth · 2022-03-31 07:58:25

I'm not sure why you are listing a bunch of WMs

To point out the status quo.

Most WMs do not need a font, period.

Such as the keyboard driven, titlebarless, tiling WM i3? …
What about icewm, openbox, blackbox, fluxbox, twm and arguebly awesome.

it is not an argument that for what is correct

No. It is indicative of the general situation that a shitload of packages (including several WMs) silently expect you to have installed some font somehow.

The fact that ttf-font does not encompass all possible things that would satisfy the dependency is not relevant to whether or not a dependency exists.

No, but it is very relevant as to whether ttf-font is a sensible dependency to add. May I remind you of

Trilby wrote:

How is it false? That is the dependency that should be added.

And that raises the question to be answered what *is* the sensible dependency that i3 (optionally?) and maaaaaaany other packages should™ add.

Again: having a more generic "somefont" or "somemonospacefont" or "pangocompatible[monospace]font" (because it's obviously not that simple) dependencies that all sorts of fonts should™ provide and all sorts of GUI packages should™ depend on seems viable (but outside the scope of any individual package)
As does actually enforcing an "arch-brand" font family on everybody (though on a different, arguebly "un-arch" attitude)
Simply listing "ttf-font" as dependency is arbitrary.

Trilby · 2022-03-31 12:10:23

seth wrote:

Such as the keyboard driven, titlebarless, tiling WM i3?

i3 has titlebars. That's why it needs a font.

seth · 2022-03-31 12:30:16

Not on any unixporn screenshot I've ever seen, but you're right - it does support titlebars.
=> So, which provision should™ it require to account for that?

Btw. even https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Genera … ions#Fonts is off about that - ther base package doesn't get you any font.

Trilby · 2022-03-31 12:53:17

ttf-font is the most sensible one in my view - but that's really up to the packagers if not indicated by any upstream defaults.

Nan123 · 2022-04-01 23:48:48

Just chiming in as an average user, the experience of figuring this out was awful, but I also understand adding a dep that isn't technically required goes against the Arch ethos. IMO, this should be up the community. Deps that are needed for full functionality, but not for basic usage should be optional, but having a compatible font installed is needed for functionality. So it seems that the issue is actually figuring out if a user has a font that is needed, but that's out of the scope for me, but installing unnecessary packages is a no no for me. I just want the wiki updated, Arch is not geared toward user friendliness, but simplicity and minimalism and it is up to the user to know that this is needed. So I am not against keeping the package as is, as long as documentation makes it clear that a font is needed.

Last edited by Nan123 (2022-04-02 02:08:06)

Arch Linux

#1 2022-03-28 07:47:49

[Solved] i3 won't start

#2 2022-03-28 08:26:41

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#3 2022-03-28 13:56:47

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#4 2022-03-28 14:07:27

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#5 2022-03-28 14:40:00

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#6 2022-03-28 15:26:47

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#7 2022-03-28 15:40:19

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#8 2022-03-28 22:37:19

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#9 2022-03-29 00:51:43

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#10 2022-03-29 01:03:43

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#11 2022-03-29 01:10:21

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#12 2022-03-29 06:41:49

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

#13 2022-03-30 19:47:33

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#14 2022-03-30 20:31:35

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#17 2022-03-30 21:04:49

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#18 2022-03-30 22:04:08

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#19 2022-03-31 01:36:42

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#20 2022-03-31 07:58:25

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#21 2022-03-31 12:10:23

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#22 2022-03-31 12:30:16

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#23 2022-03-31 12:53:17

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#24 2022-04-01 23:48:48

Re: [Solved] i3 won't start

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