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#1 2022-09-11 10:06:10

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

When the fans stop working because they are not needed and I am in a quiet room, I can hear buzzing/humming noises similar to faint noises from an HDD coming from my laptop. (I have the stock NVMe SSD installed)
The noise isn't very loud but it can be heard from 1 meter distance, especially in a quiet room.

When does it happen:

press a key or use the touchpad or scrolling (e.g. in firefox). it doesn't matter if its an external keyboard or external mouse.
this is reproducible, consistently happening every time I'd do any of these.
also easily noticeable while changing brightness levels be it via button or on GNOME desktop.


What I tried to do so far and didn't help:

BIOS: CPU Power Management ON/OFF
BIOS disable: Audio | USB | Bluetooth | Ethernet | Smart Card | SD Card
Disable DPMS
Disable TLP
Use TLP with SOUND_POWER_SAVE_ON_AC/BAT=0 and SOUND_POWER_SAVE_CONTROLLER=N
Use gnome-power-manager toggle between power saving and max power settings
try live boot ISO (fedora) same noises
Alsa disable power saving (options snd_hda_intel power_save=0 power_save_controller=N)

When does it not happen:
don't do anything, all programs closed
inside tty
booting the arch installation iso -> no such noise
inside the BIOS

How to make it stop:
open tty, noise not reproducible anymore

Been searching for hours, found another person on reddit reported the same. It would stop making the noise in tty or if he was booting up his windows install.
No solution was provided for the issue there.

At first I was thinking it was hardware related, the SSD or the CPU frequencies / power state but since I can manipulate the noise by input (keyboard/mouse), I am not sure anymore.
So could this be somewhat influenced by libinput or the wayland session? I read both wiki articles and there is no description of such similar problems.

FYI: BIOS is updated to latest and system is up to date (kernel: 5.19.7) and I am using arch with GNOME - wayland.

`--> lspci
00:00.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne Root Complex
00:00.2 IOMMU: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne IOMMU
00:01.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:02.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:02.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.3 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.4 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.7 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne PCIe GPP Bridge
00:08.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:08.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Internal PCIe GPP Bridge to Bus
00:14.0 SMBus: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SMBus Controller (rev 51)
00:14.3 ISA bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH LPC Bridge (rev 51)
00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 0
00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 1
00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 2
00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 3
00:18.4 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 4
00:18.5 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 5
00:18.6 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 6
00:18.7 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Cezanne Data Fabric; Function 7
01:00.0 Non-Volatile memory controller: SK hynix Gold P31 SSD
02:00.0 Network controller: MEDIATEK Corp. MT7921 802.11ax PCI Express Wireless Network Adapter
03:00.0 Unassigned class [ff00]: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTS522A PCI Express Card Reader (rev 01)
04:00.0 USB controller: Renesas Technology Corp. uPD720202 USB 3.0 Host Controller (rev 02)
05:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Cezanne (rev d1)
05:00.1 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Renoir Radeon High Definition Audio Controller
05:00.2 Encryption controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 17h (Models 10h-1fh) Platform Security Processor
05:00.3 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne USB 3.1
05:00.4 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir/Cezanne USB 3.1
05:00.5 Multimedia controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] ACP/ACP3X/ACP6x Audio Coprocessor (rev 01)
05:00.6 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 17h/19h HD Audio Controller
 

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#2 2022-09-13 17:11:48

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Further fruitless testing:

change kernel to -lts; -zen.
change power to max-performance with ryzenadj.
install windows 10. well somehow after I booted up windows I got coil whine, literal whining (not crackling/buzzing as before) that was audible across my flat, I thought something must have broken inside, it woke up my dog.
I tried to find out if I could hear the buzzing sound in win10 and I think it didn't buzz but I can't confirm for sure due to all the coil whine.

fast forward, reinstalled my arch setup. everything works OOTB and the faint crackling is again present and no more coil whine.

despite the P series being "linux certified", Lenovo does not provide any non windows firmware files. fwupdmgr shows that everything is up to date, although I am not sure if the latest windows NVME firmware matches the latest firmware that fwupd provides. for the SK Hynix PC711 that's inside, there is no firmware anywhere to be found except the windows stuff on the Lenovo and Dell webpage.

I'll try to play with the NVME power saving options once I learn how to set kernel parameters and see if that helps any.

Last edited by Coffeetron (2022-09-13 17:12:31)

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#3 2022-09-21 21:10:05

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

So I think I found a correlation regarding the crackling noise.

when idling my memory clock is at ~30-35% usage. (radeontop)
just moving the cursor / scrolling or pressing a key gets the memory clock to 70-90% usage and produces the crackling noise.

looking into corectrl, the GPU frequency is steadily at 400MHz while memory frequency jumps erratically between 400-1200MHz.

further looking into memory clock usage issues, there seems to have been something faulty (usage at constant 100%) on the Picasso firmware but nothing reported on Cezanne.

I am wondering if this jump in mclk usage that is caused by just moving the cursor is normal expected behavior.

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#4 2022-12-18 18:39:24

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

FYI: with BIOS updated to version 1.21 the humming noise is resolved and mem clock stays around 30% in idle at all times, in battery mode.

The problem still persists when plugged in, almost 100% mem clock usage and humming noises.

I tried all available scaling driver/governor combinations and nothing solved the problem when plugged in. If there is any setting that connects power source (ac/bat) to performance mode inside the driver/governors that could solve it but I cant seem to find anything in the wiki/web.

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#5 2022-12-18 19:21:27

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 7,637
Website

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Does this problem occur in the live environment? I have that exact same machine. It doesn't hum.

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#6 2022-12-18 19:31:35

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

Does this problem occur in the live environment? I have that exact same machine. It doesn't hum.

yes it does. the humming is correlated with the memory clock. I'm right now on battery and its completely stable and quiet at 0.4/1.33G ~ 30% usage.

as soon as I plug it in (both original and other tested charger) it starts to hum and mclk jumps to 80-90% usage.

how is your mem clock behaving in idle / light use?

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#7 2022-12-18 19:47:29

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 7,637
Website

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

I usually run the laptop permanently plugged in with the charge pinned to 50% via /sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/charge_control_{start,end}_threshold to save the battery from charge/discharge cyles. In that state the memory clock is ~30%, just like yours.

Resetting the charge control and letting the battery charge sees the memory clock increase to ~45-60%

I can't hear any humming though but then I am quite old. Is it high pitched?

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#8 2022-12-18 20:23:01

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

I usually run the laptop permanently plugged in with the charge pinned to 50% via /sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/charge_control_{start,end}_threshold to save the battery from charge/discharge cyles. In that state the memory clock is ~30%, just like yours.

Resetting the charge control and letting the battery charge sees the memory clock increase to ~45-60%

I can't hear any humming though but then I am quite old. Is it high pitched?

I'm running it in a similar setup at home, to preserve the battery life, 65/85 start/stop (set with tlp)

The noise sounds like an hdd writing combined with the noise of poorly designed chargers, I opened the backplate cover and tried to locate it, couldn't quite point it down but its coming from the CPU - WWAN - NVME area. I did also swap the 1tb nvme for a 2tb one and that did not change the behavior.

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#9 2022-12-18 20:40:54

Head_on_a_Stick
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From: London
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 7,637
Website

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Coffeetron wrote:

I'm running it in a similar setup at home, to preserve the battery life, 65/85 start/stop (set with tlp)

You don't need tlp to set charge thresholds. Does removing it help?

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#10 2022-12-18 21:12:57

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
Coffeetron wrote:

I'm running it in a similar setup at home, to preserve the battery life, 65/85 start/stop (set with tlp)

You don't need tlp to set charge thresholds. Does removing it help?

I tried that, removed tlp, then tried power profile daemon. Finally nuked the install and reinstalled everything.

I also tried the lts, zen and linux-amd kernel from AUR.
currently on latest linux kernel with the amd-pstate driver and schedutil governor.

Since you are running arch on the same hardware and your mem clock is steady at ~30%, its definitely not normal behavior to have it jump in idle around 80-90%.

tks for the suggestions!

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#11 2023-05-03 18:08:19

Talvon
Member
Registered: 2023-05-03
Posts: 3

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

I can report the exact same problem on an X13 AMD Gen2. When plugged in, the memory speed jumps around on inputs or state changes make the laptop rattle from the top left, it's as you described a bit like a very soft and quiet HDD writing noise. When unplugged, the memory speed is locked at 30% and no noise occurs.

This can be seen/heard beautifully in the System Monitor > History, which updates the graphs every second. The noises coincide with the graphical updates.

The same with keyboard inputs and touchpad. It's especially bad when scrolling websites. At first I thought it was a noise built-in to the touchpad to give audible feedback when scrolling happened. Nope. Memory speed jumping around.

This does not seem to have anything to do with Arch either as it seems, as I'm on KDE Neon. Just this thread seems to be the only place on the internet where the problem is described, so I'm adding my information for posterity.

Were you somehow able to fix this?

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#12 2023-05-03 18:43:35

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Actually, its gotten even worse. I did the latest BIOS upgrade to 1.23 and now memory clock is locked at all times at 90% (1.2/1.33GHz). Plugged in and battery mode.

If I set "power_dpm_force_performance_level" to "low" it goes down to 30% but the performance becomes abysmal.

I suspect its firmware related and I asked Mark @Lenovo about it but didn't get anything back.

Maybe somehow a future mesa or microcode update can fix this but I am not optimistic.

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#13 2023-05-03 19:25:53

Talvon
Member
Registered: 2023-05-03
Posts: 3

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Thank you for getting back at me so fast. I don't care about performance on this machine, so your hint worked for me. The memory clock speed is now locked at 30% even when plugged in. Omg finally silence.

Anyone else who is stumbling upon this, the solution is

sudo su
echo low > /sys/class/drm/card0/device/power_dpm_force_performance_level

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#14 2023-05-03 19:39:56

Head_on_a_Stick
Member
From: London
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 7,637
Website

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Coffeetron wrote:

I suspect its firmware related

The P14s had updated firmware shipped on 2023-04-03:

$ doas dmidecode -s bios-version
R1MET53W (1.23 )
$

The only reported fix is for "optimized fan ON/OFF behavior under Modernstandby" but perhaps it might help.

Also:

Talvon wrote:
sudo su

Better:

sudo -i

Or:

sudo tee /sys/class/drm/card0/device/power_dpm_force_performance_level <<<'low'

Here strings ftw! :-)

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#15 2023-08-16 18:25:00

kobayashison
Member
Registered: 2023-08-16
Posts: 1

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

Thinkpad P14s gen1, here, and I always had the same problem and it's still not resolved. I'm now on fedora 38 with kernel 6.4 and firmware 1.44. Unplugging AC or

sudo tee /sys/class/drm/card1/device/power_dpm_force_performance_level <<<'low'

stops the hummnoing sound. It's /sys/class/drm/card1, in my case.

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#16 2023-08-17 21:41:08

espritlibre
Member
Registered: 2022-12-15
Posts: 119

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

If that nmakes you feel better... i have a ThinkPad P14s Gen3 Intel and i also have this old HDD writing sound, when i'm in a silent room. When unplugged it's barely noticeable, but plugged in to AC it's louder.
how can i check the memory frequency, i dont have "power_dpm_force_performance_level" under /sys/class/

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#17 2023-09-07 12:48:27

Coffeetron
Member
From: Europe
Registered: 2019-07-27
Posts: 10

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

kobayashison wrote:

Thinkpad P14s gen1, here, and I always had the same problem and it's still not resolved. I'm now on fedora 38 with kernel 6.4 and firmware 1.44. Unplugging AC or

sudo tee /sys/class/drm/card1/device/power_dpm_force_performance_level <<<'low'

stops the hummnoing sound. It's /sys/class/drm/card1, in my case.

Yep, that also works for me, although performance can feel sloppy at times. If I input 'low' the memory clock gets a static value at 30% (0.4GHz)

Do you by any chance also have a 4k monitor in your P14s?

I keep nudging Mark from Lenovo support from time to time but so far he hasn't responded to the issue, as always, the Lenovo firmware team is busy.

I also have an X13 with the AMD Ryzen and it does properly scale the memory clock, battery life is almost x3 times higher (~9h)  (with a smaller capacity inside) than on my P14s Gen2.

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#18 2023-09-07 15:05:30

ewaller
Administrator
From: Pasadena, CA
Registered: 2009-07-13
Posts: 19,692

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input


Nothing is too wonderful to be true, if it be consistent with the laws of nature -- Michael Faraday
Sometimes it is the people no one can imagine anything of who do the things no one can imagine. -- Alan Turing
---
How to Ask Questions the Smart Way

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#19 2024-02-07 01:37:43

Talvon
Member
Registered: 2023-05-03
Posts: 3

Re: Lenovo Thinkpad P14s AMD Gen2 - humming noise sound on input

This command does not work anymore on my Thinkpad X13 KDE Neon 5.27 with Kernel version 6.5.0-15-generic and AMD processor (sorry, I'm not too deep into Linux, I don't know what exactly was updated):

sudo tee /sys/class/drm/card0/device/power_dpm_force_performance_level <<<'low'

What works is this:

sudo tee /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/energy_performance_preference <<< 'power'

Have to repeat this for every cpu number in that the cpu directory, in my case cpu0 through cpu15. I guess don't do that if you're interested in your netbook's performance, but I do value silence.

Last edited by Talvon (2024-02-07 02:00:53)

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