After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 15:38:42

So basically, this is a little weird to me but when I installed Linux in dual boot with Windows (2 days ago) everything was working fine. I installed the minimal KDE and Dolphin and I could use the SSD where Windows was located, also was my external HDD too, the SSD partition and HDD were being mounted successfully.

I switched to Windows, added a file to that SSD, switch back to Linux and Dolphin can no longer read the partition, it says: "Error mounting /dev/sda3 at /run/media/anto/D80ABAD80ABAB2BC: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/sda3, missing codepage or helper program, or other error".

Even the external HDD and when I created a file there on Windows, on Linux, Dolphin can't read the external HDD aswell (it gives me the same error). I unplugged the HDD and plugged it back on but no luck. On Windows everything works but Linux doesn't for some reasons...

Also, I installed the NTFS-3G for the ntfs drivers but it still cannot read it. Does some of you have an idea of what is happening and why?? Thanks in advance.

(P.S. When I shut down Windows, I don't hibernate it. It shuts down completaly. Also I don't have fast boot enabled on BIOS.)

Last edited by Antonio225 (2024-06-22 15:43:18)

kermit63 · 2024-06-22 15:52:32

Disabling fast boot from uefi is not enough. You should also disable Fast Startup in Windows. Also make sure to reboot at least twice from Windows after disabling it. For some weird reasons, it doesn't always take effect after the first reboot.

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 15:56:34

Alright, thanks I'll try disabling this fast startup. The thing that looks weird it's that the mounting and unmounting from Windows looks fine, when Windows WRITES then it makes it unreadable from Windows. I was on Windows and I wrote a file in the external hard drive, then on Linux it can't read it anymore but it could read the partition where Windows was located. Then I switch back to Windows, write a file on the desktop and now the partition this is also unreadable on Linux, but before creating the file it was readable...

ewaller · 2024-06-22 15:58:04

Antonio225 wrote:

When I shut down Windows, I don't hibernate it. It shuts down completaly. Also I don't have fast boot enabled on BIOS.)

Windows lies. It takes so long to boot, they do hibernate even though they call it shutdown. They call this Windows Fast Stat (not to be confused with Fast Boot in BIOS/uEFI which just omits some built in tests at start up)

Your disk is still mounted in Windows. You need to turn off Windows Fast Boot then really shut down. Microsoft hides the option really well (http://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Dual_bo … ibernation). They also turn it back on without consulting you if you do anything reckless -- like installing security updates.

Edit: Too slow

Last edited by ewaller (2024-06-22 15:58:27)

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 16:19:48

It seems like you were right guys, but even after I typed

powercfg /H off

in the powershell with priviledges and reboot into Windows, then shut down and boot into Linux, Dolphin still shows the error that it can't open the partitions... Do I need to do another thing?

Last edited by Antonio225 (2024-06-22 16:28:13)

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 16:44:47

Also... In my Windows "Power Option" there is no "Turn on fast startup (recommanded)" option... How do I actually turn off this "fast startup" option?

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 17:08:02

Alright so I did

sudo mount /dev/sda3 /home/anto/Scrivania/Test

and it works fine. So this is an issue with Dolphin??? It's still weird to me that it happens only when you write in a partition on Windows...

Last edited by Antonio225 (2024-06-22 17:08:20)

seth · 2024-06-22 17:25:40

The difference is likely ntfs3 and ntfs-3g, see https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=271650
I think you'd also get warnings about this in dmesg/the system journal and ntfs-3g might mount the partition read-only.

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 17:42:45

So, do I have to install and use ntfs instead of ntfs-3g?

seth · 2024-06-22 21:00:59

ntfs3 is an in-tree module, you get that with the kernel.
Check whether the filesystem has the dirty bit set and remove that or (preferably) run chkdisk (on windows)

cryptearth · 2024-06-22 21:48:45

@OP
simple solution: just DO NOT use NTFS in Linux - IF for some reason you NEED to transfer files on physical media instead of over network - use exFAT!

if you somewhat mess up a NTFS partition - use: chkdsk /F /X /R /B - this will take quite some time but usually gets the FS back in order

Antonio225 · 2024-06-22 23:16:29

cryptearth wrote:

@OP
simple solution: just DO NOT use NTFS in Linux - IF for some reason you NEED to transfer files on physical media instead of over network - use exFAT!
if you somewhat mess up a NTFS partition - use: chkdsk /F /X /R /B - this will take quite some time but usually gets the FS back in order

Hmmm... Yeah I'll probably use exFAT then... Is it possible for Windows to work good with ext4 or..?
In case it does, then I'll make a backup of the content inside and format the hard drive to exFAT. I didn't kind of want to use exFAT because people said that "it's corrupted" or things like that so... Yeah. But if it'll fix the issue then I'll use exFAT.
If

sudo mount /dev/sda3 Windows

works without destroying my disk then I can even keep using this but I'll probably turn the drives into exFAT. Thanks for the help guys, I hope that this will fix the issue.

dakota · 2024-06-22 23:51:26

cryptearth wrote:

@OP
simple solution: just DO NOT use NTFS in Linux - IF for some reason you NEED to transfer files on physical media instead of over network - use exFAT!
if you somewhat mess up a NTFS partition - use: chkdsk /F /X /R /B - this will take quite some time but usually gets the FS back in order

You've said this before in other threads, but I really don't get it. Are you saying that the problem *in this thread* is due to using NTFS?

Maybe I'm just lucky, but I've used NTFS on thumb drives for years to transfer files from system to system and have never had a problem.

Cheers,

seth · 2024-06-23 06:54:19

Neither ntfs nor exfat are suitable for regular use on POSIX systems.
One is a proprietary filesystem that microsoft stole from IBM when they parted over OS/2 (ie. you'll never see any code or specs because that could have legal repercussions and so the implementations are all reverse engineered with implicitly unknown compatibility) and the other one is not a real filesystem (it's still fat) to begin with.

Neither ntfs nor exfat are robust against concurrent use (unclean removals, used one one OS while still opened in a hibernating other OS)
NTFS might actually have an edge over the dumb file allocation table, but it's data loss prone either way.
If you're using NTFS with bitlocker and pull the above, you'll most like get completely fucked - (ex)fat can't provide that, so it's an edge here for not providing pot. lethal conditions itfp.

NTFS has meanwhile 3 drivers on linux: ntfs (old, read-only, you cannot break the filesystem), ntfs-3g (less old, but in use for a very long time, but fuse which impedes the througput) and paragon's brand new in-tree ntfs3.

No linux tool is really good at dealing with NTFS filesystem corruptions, if you run into those you need to have access to windows to chkdsk it.
FAT corruptions cannot be really dealt with itfp, but you can remove the dirty bit and select a table on linux just as much as on windows.

If you use ntfs-3g for basic stuff AND DO NOT OPEN THE FS CONCURRENTLY i haven't dealt with issues from that as long as I can remember - but I guess cryptearth got burned somehow at some point
If you just want maximum portability, use good old FAT ("but seth, how can I have special characters and file permissions?") and an non-compressed archive (zip should do but plenty of windows tools do tar)
ntfs3 is gonna outperform ntfs-3g in all fuse-related issues, but as long as it's new-ish, you'll probably get bugs here and there. Also it's less lenient than ntfs-3g what recently woke up a lot of people to the reality that they've done it wrong for probably a good while…

This thread is likely about windows "fast"-"start" (which is neither, actually), but more immediately the concurrent use (just yanking and ntfs key out of a system, even on windows, is prone to the same problems) - there's no magic bullet against that. Journalling FS will have a better record and chance to restore a consistend filesystem, but it's improper data handling nevertheless - even if you don't write the FS. So don't do that (and disabling windows boot emulation is an essential step here)

Ftr, there're ext drivers for windows, but they're not integrated into the system and I think are all read-only. Your best approach is probably wsl or a virtual machine. So I'd not bother.

cryptearth · 2024-06-23 07:51:02

@dakota: in addition to seth's rather technical explanation: all drivers for ntfs are based on reverse engineering - I even read about a project that uses windows' own driver and wrapping it into some translation-layer code - but yet that's as unstable as all the other ones
exFAT on the other hand was made public in 2019 so proper drivers were developed and since it was made public it's support in the multimedia industry increased quite a lot
also: note my wording: along with seth's explanation I specifically mentioned "transfer files between different OSs" - not "oh, you can use ntfs and exfat the same as others like ext, btrfs and zfs" - I only recommend it for basic exchange of files between the OSs - like as in: on windows copy from regular internal ntfs to external exfat - move that over to mac or linux - and copy the data from the external exfat to the internal proper FS like ext, btrfs or zfs
I once tried to use exFAT myself to share a steam library - and although windows at start was somewhat able to make use of it after hooking into it from linux the first time all sorts of issues came up: inconsistent naming and mixing all-lower-case with camel-case caused several issues on linux
if at all exfat can be used to copy games data from one system to another - but I recommend it only when you don't have network available to use

Antonio225 · 2024-06-23 11:35:20

Thanks for the help guys. So yeah, I'll probably use a VM with QuickEmu to work with Windows (so I don't even need to constantly switch) and I'll probably port my hdd to ext4 (I said probably because I'm always scared to mess up and lose everything, I have a backup but I am still scared to do operations like that for some reasons ). I'll use the dual boot Windows when I really need to. Thanks Seth and Cryptareth (and also Ewaller and Keremit63 for mentioning about the Windows "fast-startup" thing even tho my Windows doesn't have the option to disable it or doesn't have this option at all, I saw thons of YouTube videos and articles that shows the same solution to disable that wich is on "Control Panel" ⭢ "Power Option" ⭢ "Choose what the power buttons do" ⭢ "Turn on fast startup (recommanded)" but I don't have the last option so no luck...)

dakota · 2024-06-23 15:40:07

@seth and @cryptearth -- thanks for your detailed explanations. Got it!

ewaller · 2024-06-23 16:36:50

Antonio225 wrote:

I'll probably use a VM with QuickEmu to work with Windows (so I don't even need to constantly switch) and I'll probably port my hdd to ext4 (I said probably because I'm always scared to mess up and lose everything,

If you do that, I suggest you use A tool like WinSCP in the VM to connect to sshd on the host in sftp mode. Essentially, you are doing network transfers with a tool with an interface that might feel familiar to Windows users

Antonio225 · 2024-06-23 17:48:36

ewaller wrote:

Antonio225 wrote:
I'll probably use a VM with QuickEmu to work with Windows (so I don't even need to constantly switch) and I'll probably port my hdd to ext4 (I said probably because I'm always scared to mess up and lose everything,
If you do that, I suggest you use A tool like WinSCP in the VM to connect to sshd on the host in sftp mode. Essentially, you are doing network transfers with a tool with an interface that might feel familiar to Windows users

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll use that

Antonio225 · 2024-06-28 14:34:57

Update on this: I ran chkdsk /F /X /R /B on my 3TB HDD but (it took 6 hours)... On Linux it still gives me the issue that "Error mounting /dev/sdc2 at /run/media/anto/ExternalHDD: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/sdc2, missing codepage or helper program, or other error"... I guess that I'll just copy the files into an ext4 formatted HDD. I just need to get another 3TB HDD for this process...

cryptearth · 2024-06-28 15:03:15

hm, have the chkdsk got it back in order so you can at least use it as normal on windows again?
if you have the space available, as mentioned, for drive used to exchange data between OSs I'd recommend exFAT
another possible option: there're a couple of windows drivers for unix filesystems like ext4, btrfs and zfs - but I only follow the zfs development which should be considered alpha - I'm not aware about the status of ext4 or btrfs drivers - but be aware: all of those drivers emulate a ntfs to the kernel - so windows writes to it as such - which in turn can lead to the same issues as to try ntfs on linux - just don't

seth · 2024-06-28 15:22:05

fdisk -l /dev/sdc
file -s /dev/sdc2

Antonio225 · 2024-06-28 16:38:23

cryptearth wrote:

hm, have the chkdsk got it back in order so you can at least use it as normal on windows again?
if you have the space available, as mentioned, for drive used to exchange data between OSs I'd recommend exFAT
another possible option: there're a couple of windows drivers for unix filesystems like ext4, btrfs and zfs - but I only follow the zfs development which should be considered alpha - I'm not aware about the status of ext4 or btrfs drivers - but be aware: all of those drivers emulate a ntfs to the kernel - so windows writes to it as such - which in turn can lead to the same issues as to try ntfs on linux - just don't

To be honest, at the phase 5 it said something like "unknown error occurred" with a code that I didn't save... Why didn't I save it? I was 6 hours without Linux and I really wanted to switch so I forgot, I'm sorry.
Tbh btw, on Windows it works normaly (or at least, that's what it seems, it opens without complaining), it's just Linux. When I do "sudo mount /dev/sdc2 External1" everything works (I still don't know if it's really safe to mount the partition this way without using Dolphin but... It seems to work fine?).

seth wrote:

fdisk -l /dev/sdc
file -s /dev/sdc2

Disk /dev/sdc: 3,64 TiB, 4000787029504 bytes, 7814037167 sectors
Disk model: Expansion Desk  
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes
Disklabel type: gpt
Disk identifier: 519949A9-1591-4ACC-8D15-D0CDCFBDE554

Dispositivo  Start       Fine    Settori  Size Tipo
/dev/sdc1       34     262177     262144  128M Microsoft reserved
/dev/sdc2   264192 7814035455 7813771264  3,6T Microsoft basic data

Partition 1 does not start on physical sector boundary.

/dev/sdc2: DOS/MBR boot sector, code offset 0x52+2, OEM-ID "NTFS    ", sectors/cluster 8, Media descriptor 0xf8, sectors/track 63, heads 255, hidden sectors 264192, dos < 4.0 BootSector (0x80), FAT (1Y bit by descriptor); NTFS, sectors/track 63, sectors 7813771263, $MFT start cluster 786432, $MFTMirror start cluster 2, bytes/RecordSegment 2^(-1*246), clusters/index block 1, serial number 0c3a27f23a27d80a; contains bootstrap BOOTMGR

This HDD looks strange after doing the "file" command... Can I really make 1 partition and format it as ext4??

Last edited by Antonio225 (2024-06-28 16:42:01)

seth · 2024-06-28 21:26:48

Copy /etc/udisks2/mount_options.conf.example to /etc/udisks2/mount_options.conf, uncomment and change

…
[defaults] # THIS LINE
# allow=exec,noexec,nodev,nosuid,atime,noatime,nodiratime,relatime,strictatime,lazytime,ro,rw,sync,dirsync,noload,acl,nosymfollow
# 
# …
# define order of filesystem driver priorities for the actual mount call,
# required definition for non-matching driver names
ntfs_drivers=ntfs,ntfs3 # AND CHAGE THIS LINE
# …

and restart udisks, you should now be using ntfs-3g via dolphin - however:

Tbh btw, on Windows it works normaly (or at least, that's what it seems, it opens without complaining)

at the phase 5 it said something like "unknown error occurred" with a code that I didn't save

There's clearly some issue w/ the drive that you should sort out, regardless whether windows and ntfs-3g let you mount it.

Arch Linux

#1 2024-06-22 15:38:42

After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#2 2024-06-22 15:52:32

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#3 2024-06-22 15:56:34

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#4 2024-06-22 15:58:04

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#5 2024-06-22 16:19:48

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#6 2024-06-22 16:44:47

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#7 2024-06-22 17:08:02

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#8 2024-06-22 17:25:40

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#9 2024-06-22 17:42:45

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#10 2024-06-22 21:00:59

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#11 2024-06-22 21:48:45

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#12 2024-06-22 23:16:29

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#13 2024-06-22 23:51:26

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#14 2024-06-23 06:54:19

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#15 2024-06-23 07:51:02

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#16 2024-06-23 11:35:20

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#17 2024-06-23 15:40:07

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#18 2024-06-23 16:36:50

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#19 2024-06-23 17:48:36

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#20 2024-06-28 14:34:57

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#21 2024-06-28 15:03:15

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#22 2024-06-28 15:22:05

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#23 2024-06-28 16:38:23

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

#24 2024-06-28 21:26:48

Re: After switching back to Linux from Windows, Linux can't read my HDD

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