[SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

jl2 · 2025-05-05 13:31:40

I'm trying to transition from iwd to NetworkManager, but my wifi device isn't detected by NetworkManager, while they work perfectly fine in iwd.

It isn't blocked by rfkill.

nmcli device:

DEVICE             TYPE      STATE                   CONNECTION 
lo                 loopback  connected (externally)  lo         
48:74:6E:4E:F9:84  bt        disconnected            --         
94:45:60:1E:88:79  bt        disconnected

It works when I manually start iwd, but I don't think this is the correct way to do it.
Somewhen, iwd cleared it's whole storage with all the configured internet passwords, I guess this is a side effect of the above.

I have tried adding iwd as a backend, but it doesn't change anything, so I commented it out.
I couldn't find any other changed configuration values.

While both are enabled, iwd shows the device as disconnected:

NetworkConfigurationEnabled: enabled
StateDirectory: /var/lib/iwd
Version: 3.6
[iwd]# station wlan0 show
                                 Station: wlan0                               *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Settable  Property              Value                                          
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            Scanning              yes                                              
            State                 disconnected                                     

Terminate
[iwd]#

and 'nmcli device wifi list' works as expected:

IN-USE  BSSID              SSID            MODE   CHAN  RATE        SIGNAL  BARS  SECURITY >
        68:CA:E4:59:04:43  SCHULEN_KTZH    Infra  1     130 Mbit/s  52      ▂▄__  WPA2 802.>
        68:CA:E4:59:04:44  --              Infra  1     130 Mbit/s  52      ▂▄__  WPA2     >
        68:CA:E4:59:04:42  Free_WLAN_KTZH  Infra  1     130 Mbit/s  52      ▂▄__  --       >
*       68:CA:E4:59:04:4D  Free_WLAN_KTZH  Infra  36    130 Mbit/s  49      ▂▄__  --       >
        68:CA:E4:59:04:4C  SCHULEN_KTZH    Infra  36    130 Mbit/s  47      ▂▄__  WPA2 802.>
        68:CA:E4:59:04:4B  --              Infra  36    130 Mbit/s  47      ▂▄__  WPA2     >
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:E4  --              Infra  6     130 Mbit/s  44      ▂▄__  WPA2     >
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:E2  Free_WLAN_KTZH  Infra  6     130 Mbit/s  44      ▂▄__  --       >
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:E3  SCHULEN_KTZH    Infra  6     130 Mbit/s  44      ▂▄__  WPA2 802.>
        00:1E:42:48:4E:E2  RUT241_4EE2     Infra  11    65 Mbit/s   24      ▂___  WPA2     >
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:ED  Free_WLAN_KTZH  Infra  40    130 Mbit/s  20      ▂___  --       >
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:EC  SCHULEN_KTZH    Infra  40    130 Mbit/s  19      ▂___  WPA2 802.>
        68:CA:E4:58:FC:EB  --              Infra  40    130 Mbit/s  17      ▂___  WPA2     >
        8C:3B:AD:3B:36:CE  --              Infra  9     130 Mbit/s  12      ▂___  WPA2     >

However, when I stop iwd, it returns to a empty output.

journal: http://0x0.st/8Jo5.txt

Last edited by jl2 (2025-05-06 11:22:19)

V1del · 2025-05-05 13:50:50

That journal shows that you're creating a conflict between iwd and networkmanager (... wpa_supplicant attempting to establish a connection) which leads to the classical multiple separate networkmanagers trying to manage a NIC which will break things.

Fully and properly stop and disable iwd (that should be the case, even when attempting to let networkmanager use iwd) and make sure networkmanager is (re-)started after that fact (depending on what kind of weird state the multiple access has brought the NIC to, the only way to be "sure" it get's properly handled by just one daemon is to reboot)

OT: Any particular reason for the old kernel? And param wise mitigrations=off should probably read mitigations=off and apparently the attempt to set the tickrate also isn't registered by the kernel itself, however that could get picked up by the scheduler later.

Last edited by V1del (2025-05-05 13:54:37)

jl2 · 2025-05-05 14:27:37

Thanks for the fast reply.
Here's a new journal: http://0x0.st/8JHn.txt
I stopped iwd, checked if it stopped, started networkmanager, checked if wifi works (spoiler: it does not), stopped networkmanager, started iwd.

nmcli:

lo: connected (externally) to lo
        "lo"
        loopback (unknown), 00:00:00:00:00:00, sw, mtu 65536
        inet4 127.0.0.1/8
        inet6 ::1/128

Use "nmcli device show" to get complete information about known devices and
"nmcli connection show" to get an overview on active connection profiles.

Consult nmcli(1) and nmcli-examples(7) manual pages for complete usage details.

OT:
Did graysky stop making the ck builds? (anyway, might explain some wierd crashes I had in CS2 that didn't want to disappear)
Also, thanks for finding the typos, it's nohz_full instead of no_hz_full

Last edited by jl2 (2025-05-05 14:40:26)

seth · 2025-05-05 14:41:22

May 05 16:16:31 yoga iwd[560]: Wireless daemon version 3.6
May 05 16:16:46 yoga iwd[1508]: Wireless daemon version 3.6
May 05 16:16:51 yoga sudo[1544]:  janluca : TTY=pts/0 ; PWD=/home/janluca ; USER=root ; COMMAND=/usr/bin/systemctl stop iwd
May 05 16:16:51 yoga iwd[1508]: Terminate
May 05 16:16:51 yoga iwd[1508]: Removing scan context for wdev 3
May 05 16:16:52 yoga iwd[1508]: D-Bus disconnected, quitting...
May 05 16:16:52 yoga systemd[1]: iwd.service: Deactivated successfully.
May 05 16:16:55 yoga sudo[1555]:  janluca : TTY=pts/0 ; PWD=/home/janluca ; USER=root ; COMMAND=/usr/bin/systemctl status iwd
May 05 16:17:03 yoga NetworkManager[1584]: <info>  [1746454623.9016] NetworkManager (version 1.52.0-1) is starting... (boot:5a726dc1-adad-4760-afa1-282f89399860)
May 05 16:18:16 yoga sudo[1765]:  janluca : TTY=pts/0 ; PWD=/home/janluca ; USER=root ; COMMAND=/usr/bin/systemctl start iwd
May 05 16:18:16 yoga iwd[1770]: Wireless daemon version 3.6

There's no iwd nor wpa_supplicant process along NM, https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Networ … Fi_backend

jl2 · 2025-05-05 14:44:33

Even with iwd as a wifi backend it gives me the same result.

seth · 2025-05-05 15:04:38

The point is that you had no wifi backend operating before.
Did you disable the https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Iwd#En … figuration ?

jl2 · 2025-05-05 15:17:13

Tried commenting it out (should be off by default, why else would I have turned it on), still same result.

seth · 2025-05-05 15:26:50

How else did you configure the network? Please post an updated journal.

jl2 · 2025-05-05 15:43:22

http://0x0.st/8JXV.txt (I didn't reboot in between, the relevant stuff is in the last couple of minutes)

/etc/iwd/main.conf

[General]
#EnableNetworkConfiguration=true
#AdressRandomization=network
#Country=ch

RoamThreshold=-80
RoamThreshold5G=-80
RoamRetryInterval=10

[Network]
#NameResolvingService=systemd

[Rank]
BandModifier2_4GHz=0.8
BandModifier5GHz=1.0
BandModifier6GHz=1.2

[Scan]
InitialPeriodicScanInterval=5
MaximumPeriodicScanInterval=10

[Blacklist]
Multiplier=2

[DriverQuirks]
PowerSaveDisable=*

/etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf is stock => only commented out lines
/etc/NetworkManager/conf.d/wifi_backend.conf

[device]
wifi.backend=iwd

I also did the usual DNS linking for systemd-resolved.
Other than that, I can't remember any other changes I did, feel free to ask for more configs.

Last edited by jl2 (2025-05-05 15:43:42)

seth · 2025-05-05 15:50:20

Make sure you don't https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Networ … ic_devices

jl2 · 2025-05-05 15:55:53

sudo find /etc/NetworkManager

/etc/NetworkManager
/etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf
/etc/NetworkManager/conf.d
/etc/NetworkManager/conf.d/wifi_backend.conf
/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d
/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/no-wait.d
/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/pre-down.d
/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/pre-up.d
/etc/NetworkManager/dnsmasq-shared.d
/etc/NetworkManager/dnsmasq.d
/etc/NetworkManager/system-connections
/etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/Wired connection 1.nmconnection
/etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/Free_WLAN_KTZH.nmconnection

(last connection was when iwd.service and NetworkManager.service where enabled at the same time)

seth · 2025-05-06 07:05:00

May 05 17:14:39 yoga NetworkManager[1454]: <info>  [1746458079.2730] Read config: /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf, /usr/lib/NetworkManager/conf.d/20-connectivity.conf, /etc/NetworkManager/conf.d/wifi_backend.conf

grep -r unmanaged /etc/NetworkManager

NM finds the rfkill but completely ignores the wlan0 device.

sudo stat /usr/lib/NetworkManager/conf.d/20-connectivity.conf

jl2 · 2025-05-06 07:17:22

[sudo] grep -r unmanaged /etc/NetworkManager

Exits with 1

  File: /usr/lib/NetworkManager/conf.d/20-connectivity.conf
  Size: 58        	Blocks: 8          IO Block: 4096   regular file
Device: 259,6	Inode: 26434268    Links: 1
Access: (0644/-rw-r--r--)  Uid: (    0/    root)   Gid: (    0/    root)
Access: 2025-04-30 19:10:17.000000000 +0200
Modify: 2025-02-28 19:56:01.000000000 +0100
Change: 2025-04-30 19:10:17.677255625 +0200
 Birth: 2025-04-30 19:10:17.677255625 +0200

[connectivity]
uri=http://ping.archlinux.org/nm-check.txt

Last edited by jl2 (2025-05-06 07:17:31)

seth · 2025-05-06 07:25:28

"Exits with 1" what does that mean? grep crashes??

type -a grep
sudo grep -r unmanaged /etc/NetworkManager /usr/lib/NetworkManager

jl2 · 2025-05-06 07:38:13

No, it means it doesn't find anything. try "echo "hh" | grep df"

Second doesn't find anything either.

seth · 2025-05-06 08:08:36

Ah, you meant $?

There's gonna be *some* reason why NM ignores the wlan0 device…

Have you ever booted w/ iwd disabled so it won't get to the device first?
What are the actual outputs of

rfkill; ip a

w/o iwd?
What if you move away /usr/lib/systemd/network/80-iwd.link to allow the device to be renamed away from wlan0?
What if you completely uninstall iwd?

jl2 · 2025-05-06 08:44:03

Have you ever booted w/ iwd disabled so it won't get to the device first?

Well, that did the trick. Now it works with both backends (although iwd seems to be faster).

rfkill is always the same:

ID TYPE      DEVICE                 SOFT      HARD
 0 bluetooth hci0                blocked unblocked
 1 wlan      ideapad_wlan      unblocked unblocked
 2 bluetooth ideapad_bluetooth   blocked unblocked
 3 wlan      phy0              unblocked unblocked

ip a is always either:

1: lo: <LOOPBACK,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 65536 qdisc noqueue state UNKNOWN group default qlen 1000
    link/loopback 00:00:00:00:00:00 brd 00:00:00:00:00:00
    inet 127.0.0.1/8 scope host lo
       valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever
    inet6 ::1/128 scope host noprefixroute

1: lo: <LOOPBACK,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 65536 qdisc noqueue state UNKNOWN group default qlen 1000
    link/loopback 00:00:00:00:00:00 brd 00:00:00:00:00:00
    inet 127.0.0.1/8 scope host lo
       valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever
    inet6 ::1/128 scope host noprefixroute 
       valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever
3: wlan0: <BROADCAST,MULTICAST,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 1500 qdisc noqueue state UP group default qlen 1000
    link/ether 30:03:c8:55:04:7f brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
    inet 10.45.158.56/25 brd 10.45.158.127 scope global dynamic noprefixroute wlan0
       valid_lft 688sec preferred_lft 688sec
    inet6 fe80::7c97:e51:749b:f45/64 scope link noprefixroute 
       valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever

When it works and when it doesn't, respectively.

removing 80-iwd just renames the device to this (unconnected/connected) (ip a):

2: wlp1s0: <BROADCAST,MULTICAST> mtu 1500 qdisc noop state DOWN group default qlen 1000
    link/ether 30:03:c8:55:04:7f brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
    altname wlx3003c855047f

4: wlan0: <BROADCAST,MULTICAST,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 1500 qdisc noqueue state UP group default qlen 1000
    link/ether 30:03:c8:55:04:7f brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
    altname wlp1s0
    altname wlx3003c855047f
    inet6 fe80::7c97:e51:749b:f45/64 scope link tentative noprefixroute 
       valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever

I think I found a pattern:
Stopping iwd will make NetworkManager (it doesn't matter if iwd is autonomous or started by NetworkManager) ignore it. restarting iwd will make it show up again.
If iwd isn't started, it works as expected with wpa_supplicant, even with restarting NetworkManager and wpa_supplicant.

I don't know, but since I want to transition away from iwd anyway, and it works with wpa_supplicant, this is good?

V1del · 2025-05-06 10:19:54

V1del in post #2 wrote:

(depending on what kind of weird state the multiple access has brought the NIC to, the only way to be "sure" it get's properly handled by just one daemon is to reboot)

This can very well be normal, not sure off hand how iwd handles this, but e.g. stopping NetworkManager will not bring an already established connection down (you'd do that explicitly with the various frontends), and if iwd is similar NM will likely see that that interface is already "taken" and not talk to it.

jl2 · 2025-05-06 11:20:33

@V1del that makes sense.

I'll be using NetworkManager with iwd, just to keep the fancy iwgtk GUI. I was thinking of writing a better desktop-independant one, so that might change in the near future

Anyway, thanks for the help, maybe I should just have more faith in it and not test it to it's full extend.

Arch Linux

#1 2025-05-05 13:31:40

[SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#2 2025-05-05 13:50:50

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#3 2025-05-05 14:27:37

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#4 2025-05-05 14:41:22

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#5 2025-05-05 14:44:33

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#6 2025-05-05 15:04:38

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#7 2025-05-05 15:17:13

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#8 2025-05-05 15:26:50

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#9 2025-05-05 15:43:22

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#10 2025-05-05 15:50:20

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#11 2025-05-05 15:55:53

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#12 2025-05-06 07:05:00

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#13 2025-05-06 07:17:22

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#14 2025-05-06 07:25:28

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#15 2025-05-06 07:38:13

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#16 2025-05-06 08:08:36

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#17 2025-05-06 08:44:03

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#18 2025-05-06 10:19:54

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

#19 2025-05-06 11:20:33

Re: [SOLVED] iwd detects wifi device while networkmanager does not

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