arch gnu/linux

Misfit138 · 2007-07-07 19:43:22

FWIW, Debian's official name is Debian GNU/Linux.
It's listed that way on their home page, but everyone still calls it "Debian".
I call Arch "arch" or "archlinux", but it would be nice to see "a simple, lightweight GNU/linux distribution." instead of "a simple, lightweight linux distribution." underneath the archlinux logo on the webpages.
My $.02
BTW, if you disagree with me, you are 100% wrong.

dtw · 2007-07-07 21:07:32

osc~ wrote:

Arch isn't hung up on the whole free software thing and we support closed source applications (although some don't like that).
what does that mean. if it means that you use closed source apps that is ok i guess, you are 100% free to do what you wish. but if you develop closed source apps or programs, to be honest, that scares me a little - it is a turn-off.

OK, this is exactly my point: Arch isn't about making political statements. We're _all_ free to do what we like with Arch and to use it and adapt it as we see fit (at least within the license), we're not look for permission from anyone.

As people have already said, if we start using the gnu "label" there are plenty of reasons why we should also use another label, like bsd. Now, I can't, and don't, speak for everyone, but I'm pretty sure that most Arch users would agree that aligning ourselves with any pseudo-political movement is not going to improve Arch by one iota.

Your opinion is noted but labour the point much more and you are in danger of looking like a troll.

Last edited by dtw (2007-07-07 21:15:06)

Kenetixx · 2007-07-07 21:38:03

Cant see a need for a name change or to include GNU/Linux somewhere in the title.
It may be right it may be wrong, but no need for it, and essentially it would be something Judd would want to do , he hasnt yet and i cant see him doing it.

skottish · 2007-07-08 00:57:29

The distro name can be changed to something really pretty like Garch Linux. And when someone asks:

Someone:

Garch... now that's an ugly word. Why is your program called Garch?

Someone else:

Well, we wanted it to call it Arch, but in order to satisfy the FOSS zealots, we had to throw in the G.

Someone the First:

So why the 'G' then?

Someone the Second:

The 'G' stands for GNU.

Someone the First:

Gah-new?

Someone the Second:

Yes, GNU. It's a recursive acronym similar to some functions in programming code.

Someone the First:

I think I'll be leaving now.

Someone the Second:

Wait!!!! Have you tried the Gimp?

Someone the First:

Get away from me FREAK!

Nah, the word GNU's not user-friendly. GNUF said.

Last edited by skottish (2007-07-08 01:06:06)

oli · 2007-07-08 08:53:00

dtw wrote:

osc~ wrote:
Arch isn't hung up on the whole free software thing and we support closed source applications (although some don't like that).
what does that mean. if it means that you use closed source apps that is ok i guess, you are 100% free to do what you wish. but if you develop closed source apps or programs, to be honest, that scares me a little - it is a turn-off.
OK, this is exactly my point: Arch isn't about making political statements. We're _all_ free to do what we like with Arch and to use it and adapt it as we see fit (at least within the license), we're not look for permission from anyone.
As people have already said, if we start using the gnu "label" there are plenty of reasons why we should also use another label, like bsd. Now, I can't, and don't, speak for everyone, but I'm pretty sure that most Arch users would agree that aligning ourselves with any pseudo-political movement is not going to improve Arch by one iota.
Your opinion is noted but labour the point much more and you are in danger of looking like a troll.

I'm not very found of the FSF , but the important parts of the userland in Linux are from GNU not from BSD (just some "ideas"). But in the end, it's important to pay respect to GNU, if people do know this, it's okay in my opinion.

qlus · 2007-07-08 09:19:40

Read this, quite interesting. GNU is a big piece, but just a piece.

osc~ · 2007-07-10 12:56:45

what amazes me most is the lack o understanding of my proposition and how i got bombarded by so much opposition. it is important to understand that we live in a horrible and unjust world. maybe those of you who live in the first world couldnt care less or are so immersed in the capitalistic morals that you just cant comprehend the importance of sharing and freedom. some might say that they are not interested or are not political - but that is a political stand which affects so many of us. if we dont live together as a community and care for the well being of each other , then we might as well use microsoft windows. we might join the bill gates brigade.

kth5 · 2007-07-10 16:02:40

osc~ wrote:

what amazes me most is the lack o understanding of my proposition and how i got bombarded by so much opposition. it is important to understand that we live in a horrible and unjust world. maybe those of you who live in the first world couldnt care less or are so immersed in the capitalistic morals that you just cant comprehend the importance of sharing and freedom. some might say that they are not interested or are not political - but that is a political stand which affects so many of us. if we dont live together as a community and care for the well being of each other , then we might as well use microsoft windows. we might join the bill gates brigade.

I do understand, while we have it very good in our "world" some may be off way worse. Capitalism isn't great, communism was never implemented, socializm only the way to communism. But true freedom, is something else. True freedom most do have to admit, is more like anarchy. Now please, don't come up with people throwing bombs at each other and such. We are in fact doing that no matter the system of state. State has to fade away, laws only set by moral. That in fact, is true freedom. To be free to do - really - whatever you want.

To end this philosophical tour, let me say that the FSF does not allow total or true freedom. It is merely trying to bring forth a concept of free software but by no means can they force that everybody must become a free software fanatic that way. BSD has one more freedom, I can close the source for my product. Whether the FSF likes that or not and no matter what they say, that is one option you don't have with GPL.

If you want to discuss true freedom, don't talk about the FSF. There simply is no implementation of that. Not now and probably it is not going to happen in the future. Living beings need to eat each other. A GNU prefix doesn't change that.

Last edited by kth5 (2007-07-10 16:04:37)

CavalierBob · 2007-07-10 16:24:48

what amazes me most is the lack o understanding of my proposition

I think we understand your position quite well

how i got bombarded by so much opposition

Ah, so those of us who disagree with your proposal are not "right thinking" then? You think changing the tag line is a good idea and the rest of us should just agree, since you know best? You need to understand that if you are receiving "so much" opposition, it is because you have not made a compelling arguement, not that those who disagree with you are not thinking "correctly."

it is important to understand that we live in a horrible and unjust world.

Really? OK, for an exercise, let me grant you that statement as true osc~. So how is changing the tag line of a Linux distribution is going to make this better? I am sorry, but that is just silly symbolism masquerading itself as signifigant change.

maybe those of you who live in the first world couldnt care less or are so immersed in the capitalistic morals that you just cant comprehend the importance of sharing and freedom

Capitilistic morals? While I beleive capitialism is not perfect, it sure is better than any other system that has been tried. And the socioeconomics of capitialism certainly does not define my morals...does socialism or communism define yours osc~? If so, that is sad indeed.

some might say that they are not interested or are not political - but that is a political stand which affects so many of us.

So again, changing the tag line of a Linux distribution will go a long way towards curing the worlds ills? Honestly, I think your time and energy could be better spent with a charitable endevor, working with a local foodbank (my choice), etc. rather than lobbying for a change in naming to a Linux distribution.

If we dont live together as a community and care for the well being of each other , then we might as well use microsoft windows.

And now you have crossed that line into the land of the zealot. I was not aware that Windows was a cause (or even a symptom) of this "horrible and unjust world." I just thought it was a product of a corporation, one we are free to choose to use or not.

And there is a definition of a true freedom osc~. Not replacing one choice with another, but having both (or many) options and choosing for yourself (your freedom of choice, not a group choosing for you) the one that best fits your needs and requirements. If you want Linux to be the choice over Windows osc~, you need to help Linux win in the battle of the marketplace, quality, features...not some symbolic name change which in the end matters little.

Dusty · 2007-07-10 17:21:52

No need for political debate on this forum, there's other forums for that. For the most part, Archers typically welcome all sorts of differing opinions, but they also expect their opinions to be heard out as well.

As for the original topic, Arch has a much more lax policy on free vs non-free programs than Debian does. I sincerely think it would be unfair to the GNU philosophies for Arch to claim it was exclusively founded in GNU principles. Arch tends to be on the pragmatic side of the fence.

Note: these are just my personal observations of how the community works as a whole, not an indication of how any one user or developer, including myself, should see the issue.

Dusty

Arch Linux

#26 2007-07-07 19:43:22

Re: arch gnu/linux

#27 2007-07-07 21:07:32

Re: arch gnu/linux

#28 2007-07-07 21:38:03

Re: arch gnu/linux

#29 2007-07-08 00:57:29

Re: arch gnu/linux

#30 2007-07-08 08:53:00

Re: arch gnu/linux

#31 2007-07-08 09:19:40

Re: arch gnu/linux

#32 2007-07-10 12:56:45

Re: arch gnu/linux

#33 2007-07-10 16:02:40

Re: arch gnu/linux

#34 2007-07-10 16:24:48

Re: arch gnu/linux

#35 2007-07-10 17:21:52

Re: arch gnu/linux

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