Rename "Beginners Guide" to "Beginners' Guide"

ozar · 2009-10-04 18:56:32

Just rename it New User Guide and we won't have to worry about any special punctuation.

Allamgir · 2009-10-04 18:58:17

Well we could do that, but the ArchWiki Beginners' Guide is famous to an extent. People will have to change their habit of referring to the "Beginners' Guide" in favor of the "New User Guide". Besides, "New User Guide" is slightly unclear in that it could mean it is a guide for new users, or a newly-written user guide.

t4k1t · 2009-10-04 18:58:54

Funny how much you can discuss over the use of apostrophes

ozar · 2009-10-04 19:03:18

If it seems unclear, then perhaps just Beginner Guide is enough!

Anyone that can't figure that out probably shouldn't be using a computer, anyway!

skottish · 2009-10-04 19:08:17

Hey Misfit and Allan,

Do you get the feeling that community is ignoring you?

I remember then last time that this came up and it was technically impossible to fix it. It looks like the newer forum software cured that problem.

XFire · 2009-10-04 19:11:40

Allamgir wrote:

This has been driving me crazy for months. Out beginners guide should have an apostrophe after the s to signify plural possession. I would have changed this myself, but I don't know how or if I can. Perhaps we should make it so searches for "Beginners Guide", "Beginner's Guide", and other variations redirect to the correctly titled article. How can I do this, or will someone who can do so?

I find it ironic, that Allamgir is complaining about the poor English in the wiki, yet has poor English in his own post ("Out beginners guide...").

deltaecho · 2009-10-04 19:13:45

Acecero wrote:

deltaecho wrote:
Acecero wrote:
How about changing the name to "Beginners' Guide" to add the apostrophe to the title?
If the titles are properly escaped, then the title will remain "Beginners' Guide" -- the entity will not be replaced with an apostrophe.
Heh, I proved you wrong. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners_Guide

Maybe so (I don't see the apostrophe, but I'll take your word for it). Hopefully, at least HTML tags are escaped in the wiki; I don't feel like being banned, though, so I'm not going to experiment to find out.

Acecero · 2009-10-04 19:15:54

deltaecho wrote:

Acecero wrote:
deltaecho wrote:
If the titles are properly escaped, then the title will remain "Beginners' Guide" -- the entity will not be replaced with an apostrophe.
Heh, I proved you wrong. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners_Guide
Maybe so (I don't see the apostrophe, but I'll take your word for it). Hopefully, at least HTML tags are escaped in the wiki; I don't feel like being banned, though, so I'm not going to experiment to find out.

I'm trying to fix my mess...

Allamgir · 2009-10-04 19:21:09

XFire wrote:

Allamgir wrote:
This has been driving me crazy for months. Out beginners guide should have an apostrophe after the s to signify plural possession. I would have changed this myself, but I don't know how or if I can. Perhaps we should make it so searches for "Beginners Guide", "Beginner's Guide", and other variations redirect to the correctly titled article. How can I do this, or will someone who can do so?
I find it ironic, that Allamgir is complaining about the poor English in the wiki, yet has poor English in his own post ("Out beginners guide...").

Sorry, I typed that on my phone. I find it ironic that XFire is criticizing my mistakes in grammar while having two (TWO!) comma splices in his own sentence.

lol I feel like a mean English teacher.

Besides all that, it seems to be back to its original setting. What happened?

deltaecho · 2009-10-04 19:23:13

Allamgir wrote:

Perhaps we should make it so searches for "Beginners Guide", "Beginner's Guide", and other variations redirect to the correctly titled article. How can I do this, or will someone who can do so?

Fuzzy search? Sounds like something that would be fun to implement, but I don't have time for such a venture at the moment.

Acecero · 2009-10-04 19:30:55

Allamgir because both front and back apostrophes of Beginners Guide exist, I can't do anything right now. You are going to have to put up with the original page for now.

edit: ah I found it. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beg … 0%99_Guide

Last edited by Acecero (2009-10-04 20:38:05)

brazzmonkey · 2009-10-04 20:05:30

I'm not sure whether the wiki still doesn't handle apostrophes correctly: I filed a bug about one year ago, but it seems fixed. Check http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/NAT'ing_firewall_-_Adding_advanced_features for instance.
Now, about that beginners guide thing, honnestly I don't mind.

Garns · 2009-10-04 21:25:15

Acecero wrote:

Allamgir because both front and back apostrophes of Beginners Guide exist, I can't do anything right now. You are going to have to put up with the original page for now.
edit: ah I found it. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beg … 0%99_Guide

wtf

Whoever is moving around the Beginner[']s['] Guide please stop it. Honestly I don't care personally if it is named Beginners' Guide, Beginner's Guide or Beginners Guide but putting 00002019 RIGHT SINGLE QUOTATION MARK in there seems very wrong.

P.S. I keep my bike in the basement

Gen2ly · 2009-10-04 22:41:21

Oh, that won't break anything.

Edit: probably should put [sarcasm][/sarcasm] tags around it.

Last edited by Gen2ly (2009-10-04 22:47:13)

zenlord · 2009-10-05 09:26:06

Just a heads up that there are now two english beginners('') guides in the wiki. That *will* lead to confusion.

Allan · 2009-10-05 09:55:06

WTF has happened here? All I can see that has gone on is people mucked around with the page and cleared the history...

iphitus · 2009-10-05 10:01:28

Dusty wrote:

Call it the Arch Linux Handbook. Problem solved. :-P
Also, I like to paint my bikesheds in a camo pattern, so nobody can see it and tell me I did it wrong.
Dusty

Doesn't work in the snow.

Garns · 2009-10-05 10:20:30

Allan wrote:

WTF has happened here? All I can see that has gone on is people mucked around with the page and cleared the history...

The original with history has been moved to http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beg … 0%99_Guide

http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners_Guide is a new version, without history.

Allan · 2009-10-05 10:48:57

Hmm... so we have two versions that will gradually diverge? Sounds awesome....

Surgat_ · 2009-10-05 11:50:41

Wouldn't it be better if one page redirects to the other one and therefore having only one page to edit?

iphitus · 2009-10-05 12:05:54

Ok.

Duplicate removed, and now Beginners' guide redirects appropriately for those who love the apostrophe. We can't just go moving pages and renaming them because of grammar. There's a web of links out there, so lets not screw those up.

Everyone, how about you read the content of the page and look for grammar to be pedantic about that. The wiki is full of terrible english, poor descriptions, incorrectly formatted pages and some plain nonsense. Let's focus on that rather than being grammar nuts about a title.

I think this thread has run it's course.

japetto · 2009-10-05 12:26:58

Dusty wrote:

I like to paint my bikesheds in a camo pattern, so nobody can see it and tell me I did it wrong.
Dusty

QOTD!

R00KIE · 2009-10-05 12:29:44

Bickering about the correctness of the title is kind of pointless if the content (which is what really matters) is outdated, incomplete or incorrect.
Although grammar and spelling errors should be corrected I believe the priority should be to have simple to follow, easy to understand and up to date instructions.

Anyway, in the spirit of suggesting the title maybe it can be called "How To Make Tacos - Read This First", that should solve the problem

Cerebral · 2009-10-05 13:30:57

Holy crap people. All this over a single apostrophe? Grammar is important, but seriously?

Don't go changing titles willy-nilly, especially on a page as popular (and widely-linked) as the Beginners' Guide.

Closed. This doesn't need to be discussed anymore.

Arch Linux

#26 2009-10-04 18:56:32

Re: Rename "Beginners Guide" to "Beginners' Guide"

#27 2009-10-04 18:58:17

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#28 2009-10-04 18:58:54

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#29 2009-10-04 19:03:18

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#30 2009-10-04 19:08:17

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#31 2009-10-04 19:11:40

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#32 2009-10-04 19:13:45

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#33 2009-10-04 19:15:54

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#34 2009-10-04 19:21:09

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#35 2009-10-04 19:23:13

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#36 2009-10-04 19:30:55

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#37 2009-10-04 20:05:30

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#38 2009-10-04 21:25:15

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#39 2009-10-04 22:41:21

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#40 2009-10-05 09:26:06

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#41 2009-10-05 09:55:06

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#42 2009-10-05 10:01:28

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#43 2009-10-05 10:20:30

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#44 2009-10-05 10:48:57

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#45 2009-10-05 11:50:41

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#46 2009-10-05 12:05:54

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#47 2009-10-05 12:26:58

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#48 2009-10-05 12:29:44

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#49 2009-10-05 13:30:57

Re: Rename "Beginners Guide" to "Beginners' Guide"

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