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#1 2005-02-09 00:17:15

Dusty
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From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
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Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Hey folks,

I just released a new development milestone of Ensmer that I thought people here might be interested in. Its getting to the point where it kind of looks neat, and is almost to the point where it might be useful.

here's some documentation for this version:
https://ensmer.dev.java.net/doc/core/devel/index.html

Here's the home page:
https://ensmer.dev.java.net/

Here's screenshots:
https://ensmer.dev.java.net/servlets/Pr … folderID=0

Here's a PKGBUILD:

pkgname=ensmer
pkgver=0.1+milestone2
pkgrel=1
pkgdesc="Ensmer is an extensible object oriented 3D interface"
url="http://ensmer.dev.java.net"
license="BSD/Apache style licence"
depends=('j2re>=1.5.0' java3d)
makedepends=(apache-ant)
source=(https://ensmer.dev.java.net/files/documents/2312/11319/file_11319.dat?filename=Ensmer-0.1+milestone-2-src.jar
ensmer)

build() {
    mkdir -p $startdir/pkg/usr/bin
    mkdir -p $startdir/pkg/usr/share/ensmer
    cd $startdir/src
    mv file_11319.dat?filename=Ensmer-0.1+milestone-2-src.jar ensmer.jar
    jar xf ensmer.jar
    cd Ensmer-0.1+milestone-2-src/
    ant dist
    cp -r dist/* $startdir/pkg/usr/share/ensmer
    cp $startdir/src/ensmer $startdir/pkg/usr/bin
    chmod a+x $startdir/pkg/usr/bin/ensmer
}

Here's the ensmer script required by above PKGBUILD:

export ENSMER_HOME=/usr/share/ensmer
export CLASSPATH=$CLASSPATH:$ENSMER_HOME/lib/groovy.jar:$ENSMER_HOME/lib/prevayler.jar:$ENSMER_HOME/lib/j3d-vrml.jar:$ENSMER_HOME/Ensmer.jar
java com.buchuki.ensmer.Ensmer

Here's a java3D PKGBUILD (dependency of Ensmer). AFAIK, there are no versions of this in TUR or extra.

pkgname=java3d
pkgver=1.3.2_build8
pkgrel=1
pkgdesc="Open Java3D project from dev.java.net"
url="http://java3d.dev.java.net/"
depends=( j2re )
source=(https://j3d-core.dev.java.net/files/documents/1674/8522/java3d-1_3_2-build8-linux-i586.jar)

build() {
  mkdir -p $startdir/pkg/opt/java/jre
  cd $startdir/src
  jar xvf java3d-1_3_2-build7-linux-i586.jar
  cd $startdir/pkg/opt/java/jre
  jar xvf $startdir/src/java3d-1_3_2-build7-linux-i586/j3d-132-build7-linux-x86.jar
}

I'd love to have some feedback and bug reports. I seriously think this is something worth looking at now, but maybe I'm too easily excited. wink

In the works: EnsmerMail. Should have a package for that in a week or so.

I didn't post this to 'New and Requested Packages' because I can't really image anybody wanting to put this in their TUR; its pretty new and unknown at the moment.

Dusty

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#2 2005-02-09 00:45:32

phrakture
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From: behind you
Registered: 2003-10-29
Posts: 7,879
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Once I get my internet connection again (moving sucks) and don't have to illegally leech neighbor's wireless, then I'll host the package... my repo is very low volume and I have alot of space...

(I think people only ever download ndiswrapper from me)

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#3 2005-02-09 00:59:08

Dusty
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From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
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#4 2005-02-09 01:00:21

cactus
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From: t͈̫̹ͨa͖͕͎̱͈ͨ͆ć̥̖̝o̫̫̼s͈̭̱̞͍̃!̰
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Posts: 4,615
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

good work dusty. Good to see you have made positive progress.
8)

PS. The image screenshot links are no-worky for me. I get redirection limit exceeded errors.


"Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept." -- Postel's Law
"tacos" -- Cactus' Law
"t̥͍͎̪̪͗a̴̻̩͈͚ͨc̠o̩̙͈ͫͅs͙͎̙͊ ͔͇̫̜t͎̳̀a̜̞̗ͩc̗͍͚o̲̯̿s̖̣̤̙͌ ̖̜̈ț̰̫͓ạ̪͖̳c̲͎͕̰̯̃̈o͉ͅs̪ͪ ̜̻̖̜͕" -- -̖͚̫̙̓-̺̠͇ͤ̃ ̜̪̜ͯZ͔̗̭̞ͪA̝͈̙͖̩L͉̠̺͓G̙̞̦͖O̳̗͍

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#5 2005-02-09 01:34:16

Dusty
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From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

cactus wrote:

PS. The image screenshot links are no-worky for me. I get redirection limit exceeded errors.

Stupid java.net.

It works for me, only when I click the link firefox won't show the image, it asks me to 'open with' kview.  Maybe its a timing thing.

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#6 2005-02-15 19:30:25

Dusty
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From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Right now I don't give a shit about anything whatsoever, but I did release EnsmerMail 0.1 today and thought I should mention it. It allows retrieval from pop3, but its pretty well feature-empty right now, not really worth trying out or anything like that. But its there.

There are screenshots in the same folder as linked in the Ensmer message. Java.net has done some work on there, so I think they may even load! (They do for me in firefox, anyway)

There's docs on the documentation section of the Ensmer home page, but they're incoherent, just like me.

Dusty

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#7 2005-02-15 19:44:16

dp
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From: Zürich, Switzerland
Registered: 2003-05-27
Posts: 3,366
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

short feedback from my side:

- emails should be stored in mbox or maildir ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbox http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maildir )

- what about a gecko compatible webbrowser

- text-quality: i think, the emails and "windows" should remain in 2d (respectively the user should face them in 90°) so that there is no quality-trouble (the displays + 3d-technology today is not yet to powerfull that the things would be readable sharply from angles other than 90° (antialiasing would help on the other side, but this costs cpu in 3d)) ... also consider using the free bitstream vera and courier 10 fonts

- notification that an email arrived: what about a lamp on the table that changes colour if there are unread emails?

great that ensmer is advancing! looks very promising!!


The impossible missions are the only ones which succeed.

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#8 2005-02-15 22:11:59

phrakture
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Registered: 2003-10-29
Posts: 7,879
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

wow, those screenshots of EnsmerMail kick ass... I'm with dp on having a lamp light up... or better yet, the graphic for mail could be a phone, and it has a little light that lights up when mail arrived... like those standard office phones....

other ideas (at random): ability to archive messages into different drawers on the desk?

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#9 2005-02-15 22:19:50

cactus
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From: t͈̫̹ͨa͖͕͎̱͈ͨ͆ć̥̖̝o̫̫̼s͈̭̱̞͍̃!̰
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

:?
I still can't get the screenshots to work. I keep getting "url redirection limit exceeded".
Maybe I need to try a different browser...

EDIT: That didn't help. Konqueror spat out a more meaning message at least..

An error occured while loading https://ensmer.dev.java.net/files/documents/2312/11483/mail-m1-ss4.jpg:
Found a cyclic link in https://www.dev.java.net/files/documents/2312/11483/mail-m1-ss4.jpg

"Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept." -- Postel's Law
"tacos" -- Cactus' Law
"t̥͍͎̪̪͗a̴̻̩͈͚ͨc̠o̩̙͈ͫͅs͙͎̙͊ ͔͇̫̜t͎̳̀a̜̞̗ͩc̗͍͚o̲̯̿s̖̣̤̙͌ ̖̜̈ț̰̫͓ạ̪͖̳c̲͎͕̰̯̃̈o͉ͅs̪ͪ ̜̻̖̜͕" -- -̖͚̫̙̓-̺̠͇ͤ̃ ̜̪̜ͯZ͔̗̭̞ͪA̝͈̙͖̩L͉̠̺͓G̙̞̦͖O̳̗͍

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#10 2005-02-16 16:06:34

Dusty
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From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Thanks for the feedbacks! I'm trying to actually care about them right now, lol.

I have issues with using MailDir or mBox for storing messages. The main problem is that Ensmer information is basically stored above the filesystem, so it would be hard to get them into a MailDir or mBox file.

Web-browser.... its doable, I suppose, lol. Its a pretty big undertaking in this context.  I actually visualize networked Ensmer worlds in 3D instead of text-based web browsers inside the 3D world. I think it'll be quite a while before either can be supported. I don't know of any successful/non-alpha Java based gecko web browsers.

The text is already anti-aliased, in a half-assed sort of way. I had to write the text-processing from scratch. The input side of things is pretty ok, but the output does indeed need work. I'm finding you have to move back and forth a bit in the view to position the text at just the right location to be readable. At a certain distance it looks as clear as a bell, but trying to get it there looks a lot like an advertisement for reading glasses.

As for making the texts always oriented towards the user, the display of the messages is performed in the frontend. This means that it can be customized fully; using an OrientedShape3D would probably be all that's needed. I certainly could make this an option, I'll add it to the issue tracker, but as I say its up to the frontend. One thing I like about the messages not being oriented is that they can be rotated to lie flat 'on' the desk or bookshelf when they aren't needed. Also, I'm doing some experimenting with the amount of screen real estate needed to fit words; if you rotate a paper away from you somewhat, you can fit more words on the screen, but the ones farther up the page are harder to read (A long time ago in a galaxy far away....).

Lamp on the desk... good idea, I never thought about that. It couldn't just be a lamp, of course. The whole idea is to be customizeable, and a lamp would look out of place in a non-office type world. But I think I could easily make a backend that polls the mail server, and put a default frontend that looks like a lamp or phrakture's office phone.

Desk drawers. I've been trying to think of the best way to do something like this. This is basically a multiple container problem. As mentioned, I don't want the backend to be tied to the frontend, so I have to abstract the desk drawers idea away from the actual storage. For example, somebody might want to use desk drawers, somebody else might want a filing cabinet, and another person might be looking at pockets in a large coat. These display concepts are all the same, but I have trouble abstracting the backend. I'll look into it at a later date. It would basically be a sort of list/array storage in the back, I guess.

Its impossible right now anyway, the drawers on that VRML desk don't open. It looks like something designed by Terry Pratchett's incarnation of Death.... like where the brush is a part of the dressing table instead of laying on top of it. wink

There is already functionality in Ensmer to place stuff in containers and then go 'inside' those containers. The default frontend for containers is a butt-ugly box, but that can, of course, be totally customized. It would be possible to make this mimic desk drawers, somehow.

Java.net screenshots. I'll talk to support at java.net. Its strange you've never been able to see them and others don't have any problems. :-S

Thanks for all the ideas!

Dusty

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#11 2005-02-16 17:25:09

Dusty
Schwag Merchant
From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

cactus: re screenshots not loading -- this is just a shot in the dark, but do you, by any chance, reject cookies?

Dusty

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#12 2005-02-16 18:48:25

dp
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From: Zürich, Switzerland
Registered: 2003-05-27
Posts: 3,366
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

maildir:

do you know about this:

http://javamaildir.sourceforge.net/examples/

?


The impossible missions are the only ones which succeed.

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#13 2005-02-16 19:56:36

cactus
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From: t͈̫̹ͨa͖͕͎̱͈ͨ͆ć̥̖̝o̫̫̼s͈̭̱̞͍̃!̰
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Posts: 4,615
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Dusty wrote:

cactus: re screenshots not loading -- this is just a shot in the dark, but do you, by any chance, reject cookies?

Dusty

I accept edible cookies of all kinds, but as you say...computer cookies I generally reject (unless given a reason to accept). I will try allowing cookies and see if that improves my "screenshot fever".  wink


"Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept." -- Postel's Law
"tacos" -- Cactus' Law
"t̥͍͎̪̪͗a̴̻̩͈͚ͨc̠o̩̙͈ͫͅs͙͎̙͊ ͔͇̫̜t͎̳̀a̜̞̗ͩc̗͍͚o̲̯̿s̖̣̤̙͌ ̖̜̈ț̰̫͓ạ̪͖̳c̲͎͕̰̯̃̈o͉ͅs̪ͪ ̜̻̖̜͕" -- -̖͚̫̙̓-̺̠͇ͤ̃ ̜̪̜ͯZ͔̗̭̞ͪA̝͈̙͖̩L͉̠̺͓G̙̞̦͖O̳̗͍

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#14 2005-02-16 20:32:03

Dusty
Schwag Merchant
From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

it would explain a lot. If it works, I can ask the java.net people what's up with it, because who needs cookies to look at a picture?????

EDIT: I just tried it without cookies and it breaks, I'll let you know what they say about it.

dp, I hadn't seen the maildir examples. They take care of setting up the maildir, but you'd still have to decide what to call each folder and where to store it. I could use them to export ensmer format to maildir though, I think.

Dusty

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#15 2005-02-16 21:24:23

cactus
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From: t͈̫̹ͨa͖͕͎̱͈ͨ͆ć̥̖̝o̫̫̼s͈̭̱̞͍̃!̰
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Posts: 4,615
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

I see them!


"Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept." -- Postel's Law
"tacos" -- Cactus' Law
"t̥͍͎̪̪͗a̴̻̩͈͚ͨc̠o̩̙͈ͫͅs͙͎̙͊ ͔͇̫̜t͎̳̀a̜̞̗ͩc̗͍͚o̲̯̿s̖̣̤̙͌ ̖̜̈ț̰̫͓ạ̪͖̳c̲͎͕̰̯̃̈o͉ͅs̪ͪ ̜̻̖̜͕" -- -̖͚̫̙̓-̺̠͇ͤ̃ ̜̪̜ͯZ͔̗̭̞ͪA̝͈̙͖̩L͉̠̺͓G̙̞̦͖O̳̗͍

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#16 2005-02-22 06:32:22

dp
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From: Zürich, Switzerland
Registered: 2003-05-27
Posts: 3,366
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2


The impossible missions are the only ones which succeed.

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#17 2005-02-22 16:57:37

neotuli
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From: San Francisco, CA
Registered: 2004-07-06
Posts: 1,201
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

dp wrote:

*vote to integrate into ensmer*  :twisted:  That just kicks ass.


The suggestion box only accepts patches.

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#18 2005-02-22 18:10:59

phrakture
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From: behind you
Registered: 2003-10-29
Posts: 7,879
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Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

yeah Dusty, I want weapons.... can I get a battle axe please?

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#19 2005-02-22 18:41:17

Dusty
Schwag Merchant
From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

I doubt the app could be incorporated into Ensmer's OO framework, but it could likely be reimplimented as Ensmer objects. I don't currently have any mechanism to attach an item to the window (like the weapon out in front of you), but that could be done.

On the topic of 3D filemanagers for Ensmer, I covered this in a FAQ once:
https://ensmer.dev.java.net/faq.html

Basically, it seems like a good idea and will probably be implemented by somebody eventually, but I'd like to move Ensmer away from the filesystem concept.

Dusty

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#20 2005-02-22 20:35:18

neotuli
Lazy Developer
From: San Francisco, CA
Registered: 2004-07-06
Posts: 1,201
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

On the file system viewer...
Although I do realize it is difficult to represent files and such as objects, there is a possibility that using a sort of modular system would sort of enable this to happen, while easing the stress put on the primary developer. It could work something like this: A filesystem could be represented as a library, there are many rooms and each room can contain anything from books to sculptures to paintings...etc. / could be like the entranceway to the library, from there you can walk into many rooms, which lead to more rooms. Now, each of these rooms should represent a subdirectory. Each individual room in turn, could be a bit like rooms in an actual (like old-style) library. Each room can have tables, paintings on walls, and bookshelves, whatever. This is where the modular design comes in. By default, the room should be filled with book shelves, and each file is represented as a book. However, modules for various file types could be developed where maybe there would be 'paintings' on walls that are actually all the jpeg's or perhaps there is a certain table with all the photos arranged on it. For audio files, maybe a rack of CD's and a cd player with headphones to put them in and listen to them with. For text files, perhaps a stack of papers. The point is though, it is up to the creator of the module to decide how the file type should be represented in a room.

Wow that was a long winded explanation of a simple idea  :?  anywho..just throwin' some thoughts around.


The suggestion box only accepts patches.

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#21 2005-02-25 03:39:44

Dusty
Schwag Merchant
From: Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
Registered: 2004-01-18
Posts: 5,986
Website

Re: Ensmer 0.1+milestone-2

Yeah, I'll think about filesystem viewers later on, I don't understand this beast well enough to know what I've created. Every time I go to do something new with it I'm surprised how simple it can be... and then how many damn bugs I have to fix to make it that simple! lol

I'm posting today to tell everybody that yesterday I released 0.1+milestone-3 of the Ensmer core. Its nothing exciting really, it just contains a generic configuration system that doesn't really do anything, and yet it does everything. A lot of code, not much visuals. There's two new screenshots.

This release isn't really worth downloading yet, but it will be when I release the next EnsmerMail, which really takes advantage of the code I added to the core. That'll be a week or two now. I'm behind.

Dusty

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