OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

bmentink · 2010-04-22 20:03:16

Hi All,

I notice with the standard packages, that OpenGL is only version 1.5 .... does anyone know why this version is so low.

According to Wikipedia Version 1.5 came about in 2003!! and OpenGL is up to version 4.0 now.

Is there any way to get at least version 2.0 for my ATI card? (My card supports OpenGL upto version 3.2 ..)

Cheers,
B.

HoboJ · 2010-04-22 21:43:48

Firstly what ATI video card do you have? If it's r600-evergreen then you can use ati catalyst which will give you up to opengl 4.0 support and the best 3d performance possible. You can find that driver and associated utils in the AUR. If it's older than r600 then you have to use the open source radeon driver. That driver only provides opengl support up to 2.1 with the latest git builds.

Last edited by HoboJ (2010-04-22 21:44:15)

bmentink · 2010-04-22 21:58:44

HoboJ wrote:

Firstly what ATI video card do you have? If it's r600-evergreen then you can use ati catalyst which will give you up to opengl 4.0 support and the best 3d performance possible. You can find that driver and associated utils in the AUR. If it's older than r600 then you have to use the open source radeon driver. That driver only provides opengl support up to 2.1 with the latest git builds.

Hi, I have an r730 chipset and am using the latest stable xf86-video-ati driver with early KMS enabled.

I don't want to use the Catalyst driver if possible. Is it the -git version of xf86-video-ati that provides opengl 2.1? ..and do I need to get the -git versions of any other libs (libgl, mesa etc ..) or
just xf86-video-ati-git by itself ok?

Thanks,
B.

Last edited by bmentink (2010-04-22 22:06:07)

flamelab · 2010-04-22 22:53:18

The OpenGL libraries are provided by Mesa.

Currently, with TTM drivers (the old ones), you can experience up to v.1.5 OGL.

Now, there is great development within Gallium3D for v2/3/4 OGL support.

bmentink · 2010-04-23 00:40:28

flamelab wrote:

The OpenGL libraries are provided by Mesa.
Currently, with TTM drivers (the old ones), you can experience up to v.1.5 OGL.
Now, there is great development within Gallium3D for v2/3/4 OGL support.

Thanks,

Where can I find info on Gallium3D ... havn't hear of that one.

B.

ChemBro · 2010-04-23 07:14:51

bmentink wrote:

Where can I find info on Gallium3D ... havn't hear of that one.

You don't need infos about Gallium3D. All you need to know is: If Gallium3D OpenGL3.0 support is ready, Mesa 8.0 will be released. Or: Mesa 8.0 will have OpenGL 3.0 support.

jarryson · 2010-04-24 07:07:30

now the gallium 3d is not very usable for every ati card, and intel cards can not use gallium for this moment.

R800 seem will use gallium only, instead of classic r300 driver

dptkby · 2010-04-24 09:27:24

flamelab wrote:

The OpenGL libraries are provided by Mesa.
Currently, with TTM drivers (the old ones), you can experience up to v.1.5 OGL.
Now, there is great development within Gallium3D for v2/3/4 OGL support.

So even though Mesa supports OpenGL 2, it won't be supported on something like xf86-video-ati until Gallium3D comes along?

I ran into this when trying to compile code from a tutorial on "modern OpenGL" floating around the Internet a few weeks ago (r600 here). It's quite a long time until usable Gallium3D drivers can be expected though, isn't it?

flamelab · 2010-04-24 09:45:10

dptkby wrote:

flamelab wrote:
The OpenGL libraries are provided by Mesa.
Currently, with TTM drivers (the old ones), you can experience up to v.1.5 OGL.
Now, there is great development within Gallium3D for v2/3/4 OGL support.
So even though Mesa supports OpenGL 2, it won't be supported on something like xf86-video-ati until Gallium3D comes along?
I ran into this when trying to compile code from a tutorial on "modern OpenGL" floating around the Internet a few weeks ago (r600 here). It's quite a long time until usable Gallium3D drivers can be expected though, isn't it?

At this moment, the G3D drivers for ATi (only R300g) supports OGL 2.1, as far as I know.

It will take time, a long time for the drivers to catch up the upstream OGL development.

At least 1,5/2 years.

ChemBro · 2010-04-24 10:11:53

dptkby wrote:

So even though Mesa supports OpenGL 2, it won't be supported on something like xf86-video-ati until Gallium3D comes along?

I think, Mesa 7.8 supports OpenGL 2.0 and it's released, but not in Arch repo. You have to wait, I guess.

TemplarGR · 2010-04-24 11:23:40

Sometimes people puzzle me with their constant need to answer posts without knowledge on the subject. OpenGL 2.0 is already supported for r600-r700 in classic Mesa and we are rapidly progressing with OpenGl2.1+ . I believe Opengl3.0 gallium3d support will arrive during this year, with Mesa 8.0 . Then it will be a matter of time for r600g to catch up.

Of course performance needs improvement but things are really great right now. The base work is done and user-visible change will happen rapidly from now on.

dptkby · 2010-04-24 11:41:21

TemplarGR wrote:

Sometimes people puzzle me with their constant need to answer posts without knowledge on the subject. OpenGL 2.0 is already supported for r600-r700 in classic Mesa and we are rapidly progressing with OpenGl2.1+ . I believe Opengl3.0 gallium3d support will arrive during this year, with Mesa 8.0 . Then it will be a matter of time for r600g to catch up.
Of course performance needs improvement but things are really great right now. The base work is done and user-visible change will happen rapidly from now on.

Then I'm even more confused; the tutorial I mentioned should only require OpenGL 2.0 and it didn't compile on my system, I mailed the author who replied with something to the effect that he thinks ATI open source driver doesn't support OpenGL 2.

Should it work or not, running updated Arch with [testing] and r700 (not r600, I was mistaken earlier)?

flamelab · 2010-04-24 11:49:11

dptkby wrote:

TemplarGR wrote:
Sometimes people puzzle me with their constant need to answer posts without knowledge on the subject. OpenGL 2.0 is already supported for r600-r700 in classic Mesa and we are rapidly progressing with OpenGl2.1+ . I believe Opengl3.0 gallium3d support will arrive during this year, with Mesa 8.0 . Then it will be a matter of time for r600g to catch up.
Of course performance needs improvement but things are really great right now. The base work is done and user-visible change will happen rapidly from now on.
Then I'm even more confused; the tutorial I mentioned should only require OpenGL 2.0 and it didn't compile on my system, I mailed the author who replied with something to the effect that he thinks ATI open source driver doesn't support OpenGL 2.
Should it work or not, running updated Arch with [testing] and r700 (not r600, I was mistaken earlier)?

You could try mesa from git (check on aur), and build gallium radeon. If you want to know how to find the gallium driver, check on src/gallium/ within the mesa source. You can be helped by the nouveau-dri-git PKGBUILD, which installs the Nouveau gallium driver. You can do the same thing for Radeon, by changing the names or paths.

While doing that, you could use the temporary [xorg18] repo, with xorg-server 1.8 or before doing that.

Also, you should use the latest kernel possible (kernel26-git).

As you can see, they are all still in experimental state, if you want to try, and if you have time, why don't you try it.

You could visit this thread for more info or even repos with the packages you may need --> http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=79509

Cdh · 2010-04-24 18:00:15

Actually the -git Versions do work well.

There is an inofficial repo:

[nightly]
Server = http://nightly.uhuc.de/i686

it includes all the stuff needed for xf86-video-ati-git and mesa-git (glproto-git, libdrm-git and stuff).

For me it always worked very well.
More information is available in the threads about 3d on r600/r700 and the AMD bar/grill
http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=79509
http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=57084

Someone there has also a repo with a new kernel with powermanagement patches.

jarryson · 2010-04-24 18:51:33

official xorg18 repo contains mesa 7.8 and xorg 1.8

Last edited by jarryson (2010-04-24 18:51:44)

sultanoswing · 2010-04-24 21:40:51

Please don't take this as a troll - it isn't meant to be - and apologies for being OT... but the above thread is why I have never bought ATI's cards. In my limited experience with them, the drivers - both windows and linux - have been 'challenging' if I could put it so eumphemistically. Most recently, after fiddling around with multiple open-source and closed-source drivers, editing KMS options etc. I ditched my grandparent's 9600Pro and went 7600GT. Black screens/locking graphics/odd colours/no resolutions available etc. - solved. I am sure others will have had polar opposite experiences, but there's mine.

OK - back OT.

Last edited by sultanoswing (2010-04-24 21:42:34)

Ultraman · 2010-04-25 09:31:32

Why did you post then? It doesn't really add anything to the thread. Am I now supposed to post about my great experience with ATi cards? No? The topicstarter has an ATi card right now, and it can work fine.
Catalyst drivers have come a huge way, on Windows I experience zero pain and on Linux I hear they also run fine if you stick to stable repos for X and get the latest 10.4 Catalyst.
I'm also sticking to the open-source driver, it works fine for what I want to do, just lacks decent 3D support. But there is work being done on that, as some people already mentioned

sultanoswing · 2010-04-26 08:00:07

Ultraman wrote:

Why did you post then? It doesn't really add anything to the thread. Am I now supposed to post about my great experience with ATi cards? No? The topicstarter has an ATi card right now, and it can work fine.
Catalyst drivers have come a huge way, on Windows I experience zero pain and on Linux I hear they also run fine if you stick to stable repos for X and get the latest 10.4 Catalyst.
I'm also sticking to the open-source driver, it works fine for what I want to do, just lacks decent 3D support. But there is work being done on that, as some people already mentioned

Yes, I agree to a point, but my point was that the solutions posted to date seem to involve pre-release git repositories etc. which leads me back to the fact that the drivers for ATI aren't good enough. So with respect to the OP's original question of "how do I get (paraphrasing here) an expected feature of my card to work?", then the answer is "an experimental, pre-release hack."

Or get another brand of card.

Sorry to sounds harsh but I have been peeved off with my experiences of ATI cards in the distant and also recent past on both linux and windows. I promise to not let it affect me any longer, so I shan't comment on it anymore here

[EDIT] It seems from the above that the ATI catalyst drivers will provide what the original poster wants - Yay! Do they also provide compiz/3D rendering? If so, perhaps I shall take a new look at ATI next time I come to purchase a new card.....

Last edited by sultanoswing (2010-04-26 08:03:38)

pedepy · 2010-08-01 18:50:33

how is opengl 2.0 support enabled in r600/r700 chips but not r500 ? ... afaik, r600+ chips can still use fglrx, but anything below that can't. again, afaik my chip supports opengl 2.0, but i can't seem to get anything past 1.5. ... i am missing anything here ? why are cards supported by the closed source driver getting more support than the ones that have been deprecated by amd, in explicit favor of open source development ? ..........

flamelab · 2010-08-01 21:16:07

The R5xx chips can use GL extensions till OpenGL 1.5.x due to hardware limitations.
The same applies for the newer devices. OpenGL 4.x can be used by HD5xxx only (as I can remember) (and tesselation)

ChemBro · 2010-08-01 22:30:32

flamelab wrote:

The R5xx chips can use GL extensions till OpenGL 1.5.x due to hardware limitations.

?

And why is it possible to get OpenGL 2.1 with Gallium3D-drivers for R5xx chips?

flamelab · 2010-08-01 22:31:56

ChemBro wrote:

flamelab wrote:
The R5xx chips can use GL extensions till OpenGL 1.5.x due to hardware limitations.
?
And why is it possible to get OpenGL 2.1 with Gallium3D-drivers for R5xx chips?

I'm not really sure about the exact opengl versions, but I'm definitelly sure that there are hardware limitations.

ssri · 2010-08-02 01:44:00

Interestingly, R300s support OpenGL 2.1 and R500 support OpenGL 2.0...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison … rsion_note

Arch Linux

#1 2010-04-22 20:03:16

OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#2 2010-04-22 21:43:48

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#3 2010-04-22 21:58:44

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#4 2010-04-22 22:53:18

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#5 2010-04-23 00:40:28

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#6 2010-04-23 07:14:51

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#7 2010-04-24 07:07:30

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#8 2010-04-24 09:27:24

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#9 2010-04-24 09:45:10

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#10 2010-04-24 10:11:53

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#11 2010-04-24 11:23:40

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#12 2010-04-24 11:41:21

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#13 2010-04-24 11:49:11

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#14 2010-04-24 18:00:15

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#15 2010-04-24 18:51:33

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#16 2010-04-24 21:40:51

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#17 2010-04-25 09:31:32

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#18 2010-04-26 08:00:07

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#19 2010-08-01 18:50:33

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#20 2010-08-01 21:16:07

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#21 2010-08-01 22:30:32

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#22 2010-08-01 22:31:56

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

#23 2010-08-02 01:44:00

Re: OpenGL > 2.0 for ATI

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