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#26 2010-09-18 10:04:38

Nicky726
Member
From: Czech Republic
Registered: 2008-02-15
Posts: 128
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

Uh, now whats this... A captcha at every forums login? And not working in rekonq by the way. Could you possibly find out a less intruding method? Or at least make it not browser discriminating?


"Although the masters make the rules
For the wise men and the fools
I got nothing, Ma, to live up to."

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#27 2010-09-18 10:08:50

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

I am working on this. The captcha will be a lot harder to solve than the current one. If it does not work in rekonq its most likely a bug in that browser. It's just a normal input form.

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#28 2010-09-18 10:19:36

Nicky726
Member
From: Czech Republic
Registered: 2008-02-15
Posts: 128
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

OK, isn't an input form used for username too? Strange didn't noticed troubles filling in various other captchas in rekonq.


"Although the masters make the rules
For the wise men and the fools
I got nothing, Ma, to live up to."

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#29 2010-09-18 11:07:14

stefanwilkens
Member
From: Enschede, the Netherlands
Registered: 2008-12-10
Posts: 624

Re: Fighting spammers

bots don't do math do they?

how about a simple x {+,-} x = ?


Arch i686 on Phenom X4 | GTX760

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#30 2010-09-18 11:28:59

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

Bots are not the problem but human spammers. And they are able to solve all kinds of captchas.

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#31 2010-09-18 11:37:12

kgas
Member
From: Qatar
Registered: 2008-11-08
Posts: 718

Re: Fighting spammers

capcha will not be helpful for physically challenged. Another alternative will be using pub/private key combinations for the members but all such line of thinking will introduce its own complexity.

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#32 2010-09-18 11:37:35

Xyne
Moderator/TU
Registered: 2008-08-03
Posts: 5,633
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

Pierre wrote:

Bots are not the problem but human spammers. And they are able to solve all kinds of captchas.

If only there were a way to prevent humans from registering...

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#33 2010-09-18 11:52:23

stefanwilkens
Member
From: Enschede, the Netherlands
Registered: 2008-12-10
Posts: 624

Re: Fighting spammers

Pierre wrote:

Bots are not the problem but human spammers. And they are able to solve all kinds of captchas.

ah, sorry for misunderstanding your original intent smile perhaps an expansion of the wiki team is in order... specifically assigned to keep key topics clean and up to date?

spamming open source wikis... ugh.


Arch i686 on Phenom X4 | GTX760

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#34 2010-09-18 13:19:21

karol
Archivist
Registered: 2009-05-06
Posts: 25,423

Re: Fighting spammers

Xyne wrote:
Pierre wrote:

Bots are not the problem but human spammers. And they are able to solve all kinds of captchas.

If only there were a way to prevent humans from registering...

A small amount of $$$ held in escrow (of whatever it's called) so you get it back after - say - a month or ten posts / edits, whichever comes last.
Is the post of Minister of Infrastructure of Arch still vacant? Maybe I should apply ;P

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#35 2010-09-18 14:49:43

chris-kun
Member
From: SF Bay Area
Registered: 2010-09-07
Posts: 235
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

I think this was suggested in a different thread.. but I really like the idea of having some package in the AUR generate a key or whatnot.


[home page] -- [code / configs]

"Once you go Arch, you must remain there for life or else Allan will track you down and break you." -- Bregol

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#36 2010-09-18 15:55:01

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

So, here is an update. I have implemented some new functions for the Wiki and forums:
* If you want to register or post as guest you have to answer a question correctly.
* For now you only have to answer this question once a day.

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#37 2010-09-18 16:15:03

anonymous_user
Member
Registered: 2009-08-28
Posts: 3,058

Re: Fighting spammers

Is that effective at this moment?

If so, how do you post as a guest?

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#38 2010-09-18 16:15:53

karol
Archivist
Registered: 2009-05-06
Posts: 25,423

Re: Fighting spammers

Pierre wrote:

So, here is an update. I have implemented some new functions for the Wiki and forums:
* If you want to register or post as guest you have to answer a question correctly.
* For now you only have to answer this question once a day.

Let's hope it will work :-)

How other people / forums  are dealing with similar issues?

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#39 2010-09-18 16:37:33

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

@anonymous_user: atm guest posting is disabled by the forum moderators.

@karol: Other forums have similar problems. Other solutions are Blacklisting or moderate registrations. But there is not that much you can do about human spammers. (ok, we could block all ips from indiea, usa etc.)

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#40 2010-09-19 04:33:42

crouse
Arch Linux f@h Team Member
From: Iowa - USA
Registered: 2006-08-19
Posts: 903
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

If you look at some of my websites, you'll see how I protected the sites from bots/automated signups.

If you use .htaccess to protect the https://bbs.archlinux.org/register.php page, you will stop the bot signups ... no php captcha is good enough to prevent bots from bypassing the captcha, they just write smarter bots wink  Once in a blue moon we have a manual registration...just to spam, to prevent that is almost an impossibility. Even if they bypass my .htaccess protection manually, automating the bots to bypass the .htaccess protection on a login, isn't nearly as easy (possible, but not worth their trouble to figure out how).  Login requires not only captcha, but also the .htaccess protection ....   

The forums can be cleaned fairly easily, obviously the wiki gets to be a bigger pita though when they mess it up.  Perhaps making registration for the wiki available only for forum members that have at least 50 posts and 30 days of membership(or meet some other criteria). Manually authorizing users for the wiki might be prudent, as cleaning up might be more painful. Personally having new members messing with the wiki has caused problems in the past, and delaying new peoples right to modify the wiki might not be a bad thing, as it takes time to learn Arch and it's philosophy.

Ease for members = More Spammers
Hard for members = Less Spammers

I opted for Hard for members/Less Spammers.... as I was simply tired of dealing with them.  That and it sort of defeated my "family friendly" atmosphere if there were pron links randomly posting all over the forum.... wink    That and most members hated the spam/spammers as much as I did and were supportive of the efforts to end it.
Anyway, just another thing you might look into, thought it might be of help.

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#41 2010-09-19 08:26:14

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

If I disable register.php nobody will be able to register; so I don't see the point. Its also not about bots here but humans (they might use some special tools though).

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#42 2010-09-19 14:48:59

flamelab
Member
From: Athens, Hellas (Greece)
Registered: 2007-12-26
Posts: 2,160

Re: Fighting spammers

Hmm, maybe a question of a Linux terminal output ? He (the spammer) should have a linux system to use. The question would be a copy/paste thing for a linux user, nothing more.

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#43 2010-09-19 14:52:35

karol
Archivist
Registered: 2009-05-06
Posts: 25,423

Re: Fighting spammers

flamelab wrote:

Hmm, maybe a question of a Linux terminal output ? He (the spammer) should have a linux system to use. The question would be a copy/paste thing for a linux user, nothing more.

Imagine your enemy is as smart as you are. How would you stop yourself from spamming a forum / wiki?

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#44 2010-09-19 14:56:50

flamelab
Member
From: Athens, Hellas (Greece)
Registered: 2007-12-26
Posts: 2,160

Re: Fighting spammers

karol wrote:
flamelab wrote:

Hmm, maybe a question of a Linux terminal output ? He (the spammer) should have a linux system to use. The question would be a copy/paste thing for a linux user, nothing more.

Imagine your enemy is as smart as you are. How would you stop yourself from spamming a forum / wiki?

I would make him be bored or almost incapable of doing it. Bored: too many questions. Incapable: I don't think that many spammers have... linux systems. A bash output (for example "what's the output of "echo bla bla bla" would eliminate a lot of them.

Last edited by flamelab (2010-09-19 14:57:15)

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#45 2010-09-19 15:11:05

schen
Member
Registered: 2009-06-06
Posts: 468

Re: Fighting spammers

The windows cmd has echo too, you know. And with Mac OS X, they already have bash, because it's UNIX based. Something that an arch linux user would know... like tacos!

Back on topic, I think any linux user who wants to use arch should be able to tell a simple shell script, like telling the time or something.

Last edited by schen (2010-09-19 15:12:42)

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#46 2010-09-19 15:11:38

flamelab
Member
From: Athens, Hellas (Greece)
Registered: 2007-12-26
Posts: 2,160

Re: Fighting spammers

I don't only mean echo, that was an example.

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#47 2010-09-19 15:13:11

schen
Member
Registered: 2009-06-06
Posts: 468

Re: Fighting spammers

flamelab wrote:

I don't only mean echo, that was an example.

Oh, then that's a good idea.

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#48 2010-09-19 16:06:56

Pierre
Developer
From: Bonn
Registered: 2004-07-05
Posts: 1,950
Website

Re: Fighting spammers

@flamelab: Guess what I implemented this morning. ;-)

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#49 2010-09-19 16:20:20

anonymous_user
Member
Registered: 2009-08-28
Posts: 3,058

Re: Fighting spammers

Very nice! cool

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#50 2010-09-19 16:22:48

flamelab
Member
From: Athens, Hellas (Greece)
Registered: 2007-12-26
Posts: 2,160

Re: Fighting spammers

Pierre wrote:

@flamelab: Guess what I implemented this morning. ;-)

Nice !! big_smile

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