Norwegian Keymapping for console

Lastebil · 2009-12-23 03:22:29

Tonight on irc, ilovebrownies had a question about his/her Norwegian keymap - it wasn't working in the console. I knew this could be a headache because I've dealt with it - I'm in Finland* but I've also dealt with UK keyboards, French keyboards, German keymaps...

Unfortunately we just could NOT get the Norwegian keymap to work. Until, of course, 3 seconds after he/she logged off, whereupon, BOOM, it started working for me.

So I'm going to write up a guide - eventually - as a form of "here's the why and how so you can choose the way to make it work your way." Suggestions as to where and 'other places of help' are welcome in that regard.

But as I've tried to write this 4 times already and just get far too longwinded, and it's getting very late, I will write that up later and for now, leave the immediate answer -

the "no" keymap doesn't put the ø on the key next to the p. The other keymap DOES. However, I had to load the Swedish/Finnish latin6 keymap before it. I'm not sure why, and I'll look into why tommorrow. Alternately, the Danish keymaps worked nicely with the alt-gr key.

(Mind you, ilovebrownies did not want to use the alt-gr key, but he/she wasn't OPPOSED to it, just it wasn't their first choice.)

Mr.Elendig · 2009-12-23 12:47:35

Both loadkeys no and loadkeys no-latin1 works for me(tm).

And ø is suposed to be right of l, not p

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2009-12-23 12:47:51)

Lastebil · 2009-12-23 14:46:11

Loadkeys (and use from rc.conf) no definately was broken, and is, on both of our systems. I am determining why.

ludovico · 2009-12-23 15:22:09

Just use "loadkeys no-latin1"

JohannesSM64 · 2009-12-23 18:12:33

Yes, "loadkeys no" is broken. No bug filed yet?
I know no-latin1 works, but it's confusing, and I can't see anyone wanting the broken one.

Last edited by JohannesSM64 (2009-12-23 18:16:32)

Mr.Elendig · 2009-12-23 18:30:11

One thing: if the system is out of date, loadkeys no might grab the dvorak/no layout.

JohannesSM64 · 2009-12-24 04:20:54

On 2009.08 ISO, loadkeys no grabs a layout that seems to be no-ish, but lacks æøå

idjut · 2010-09-20 19:57:53

There's still no fix for loadkeys? I can't seem to get it to work. You are just supposed to type "loadkeys no" but it doesn't seem to change with no, dk nor sv.

karol · 2010-09-20 20:10:05

There's no and no-latin1, dk and dk-latin1 and sv-latin1.
On my system the maps are in /usr/share/kbd/keymaps/i386/qwerty - try using the full path with loadkeys.

Lastebil · 2010-09-20 20:18:16

The issue isn't that the file isn't found, it's that the file doesn't actually _work._ i.e. important characters are missing.

Such as ø.

I haven't yet found exactly what steps need to be taken to actually get it to work - I have, randomly, but following a reboot the steps taken don't actually produce the ø character.

Also, the original situation involved "not using the compose / alt-gr key."

Mr.Elendig · 2010-09-20 21:27:57

Lastebil wrote:

The issue isn't that the file isn't found, it's that the file doesn't actually _work._ i.e. important characters are missing.
Such as ø.
I haven't yet found exactly what steps need to be taken to actually get it to work - I have, randomly, but following a reboot the steps taken don't actually produce the ø character.
Also, the original situation involved "not using the compose / alt-gr key."

worksforme(tm)

loadkeys no-latin1 to change to it on the fly, and 'KEYMAP="no-latin1"' in rc.conf to make it stick.

Check the font and locale setting if it doesn't work.

Lastebil · 2010-09-20 21:50:08

what about loadkeys no?

As mentioned by several folks in this thread, it's the no keymap that (apparently) has issues, which is different from the no-latin1 keymap. I don't think anyone has had an issue with the latin1 keymap, other than "not liking it." (To be honest, I don't know what the difference _is_ and that is probably the main issue - myself and others don't really understand what the difference is supposed to be. On top of that, "not liking no-latin1" is causing folks to _assume_ they'll like "no" and since it doesn't seem to do anything (i.e. it appears to be a "us" keymap, or "the kernel keymap" or similar) folks feel it's "broken." i.e. "Missing characters."

If the .no (NOT no-latin1) keymap is a duplicate, should it be removed? Or is it in some way actually filling a need, but it's confusing for the lot of us who have tried to use it? (I'd figure the latter. We just need to know what the heck it's doing.

(I also don't know where the Norwegian/Danish keys are supposed to be, I have .se/.fi keycaps, and use the us-international-deadkeys map myself, so I really shouldn't be testing this. My eee pc has bizzarre keycaps of no/dk/se/fi, which in many cases all but cover the keycap, but having shown this to some .no typists they have suggested that those keycaps are "not even close to correct." But I did open the thread... and I think the initial issue is still "open.")

For some reason I only got notifications on replies today. Probably due to the recent upgrade of the forum software. Thus the recent flurry of activity...

karol · 2010-09-20 21:54:43

Lastebil wrote:

For some reason I only got notifications on replies today. Probably due to the recent upgrade of the forum software. Thus the recent flurry of activity...

The posts have been posted today, after months of inactivity in this thread. There's no forum malfunction: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php … 04#p829004
Mr.Elendig just wrote that 'loadkeys no-latin1' still works for him, so there are really no new solutions here.

Last edited by karol (2010-09-20 21:55:51)

Mr.Elendig · 2010-09-20 22:53:32

In the good old days there was only one norwegian keymap. It was named qwerty/no-latin1.
Then someone found that too hard to type or something, so they created the qwert/no keymap.
After a while, someone came up with the great idea to have a norwegian dvorak keymap, so they made dvorak/no
That lead to some fun things when people tried "loadkeys no", since because d comes before q in the alphabet, the dvorak one was chosen. For some unknown reason this led to much whining, so someone decided to do some patching to "fix" that.

Anyway, I just tested the qwert/no keymap, and it's more or less broken. There are several issues with it, so my 35€ advice is to use no-latin1 and live happily ever after.

The other solution would be to fix the no one, and submit a patch upstream.

Edit: I havn't dug around in the code for the keymaps, but it might be that the no one tries to be more accurate. The no-latin1 "cheats" a bit with a coupe of keys. See /usr/share/kbd/keymaps/i386/qwerty/no-latin1.doc for details.

Last edited by Mr.Elendig (2010-09-20 22:57:50)

Lastebil · 2010-09-21 06:12:33

Mr.Elendig - thanks. This makes a LOT more sense - dvorak, and heck, colemak would throw someone for a complete loop. Plus it helps understand why we might have the issue to begin with.

JohannesSM64 wrote:

Yes, "loadkeys no" is broken. No bug filed yet?
I know no-latin1 works, but it's confusing, and I can't see anyone wanting the broken one.

The above seems to be missed by some folks (:

I'll take a look at the .no keymap and the no-latin1 keymap files after my current work project, which unfortunately has me swamped until ... November or so.

Meanwhile, if anyone else wants to work on it, feel free.

Arch Linux

#1 2009-12-23 03:22:29

Norwegian Keymapping for console

#2 2009-12-23 12:47:35

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#3 2009-12-23 14:46:11

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#4 2009-12-23 15:22:09

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#5 2009-12-23 18:12:33

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#6 2009-12-23 18:30:11

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#7 2009-12-24 04:20:54

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#8 2010-09-20 19:57:53

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#9 2010-09-20 20:10:05

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#10 2010-09-20 20:18:16

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#11 2010-09-20 21:27:57

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#12 2010-09-20 21:50:08

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#13 2010-09-20 21:54:43

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#14 2010-09-20 22:53:32

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

#15 2010-09-21 06:12:33

Re: Norwegian Keymapping for console

Board footer