Arch ranking system to promote growth of the community...

trusktr · 2010-10-16 00:15:09

I was just thinking that'd it'd be neat, and a good way to encourage developments and advancements by the community, to have some type of a ranking system where users would gain points over time for things like answering questions in the forums or posting items in the wiki.

I found this MedaiWiki extension that adds user profiles and ranking: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension … ank_system
It seems like it has too much for Arch needs, but i'm sure it can be scaled down to encompass only the desired features needed, and encourage the community to help make the wiki a better resource and to make Arch even better itself.

Furthermore, it wouldn't be too hard to write a script that looks at a user's profile on the wiki and shows the rank under their forum avatar (and/or badges too) in a manner similar to StackOverflow.

What are your thoughts on this?

hume's doona · 2010-10-16 00:18:00

I'm not a fan of ranking systems, In my experience it tends towards a popularity contest. But we do have a mature community here and it *may* work out

frabjous · 2010-10-16 00:38:09

I like having a normal forum like this, but I don't think it would be harmful to have an additional specifically Q&A site which worked like that. (Ubuntu has both its forums and askUbuntu, for example.) You could just go to Area 51 at stackexchange and create one -- though I'm not sure it's necessary since they already have a "Linux and Unix" one where you could ask Arch questions.

Last edited by frabjous (2010-10-16 00:39:05)

Awebb · 2010-10-16 00:44:03

I also dislike those ranking systems in bbs. It makes sense on fun boards where people hang around for showing off and caring about the size of their virtual boards. I'm allready too manipulated by postcounts when it comes to wether trusting or ignoring somebodies hints. I'm fully satisfied with a "thanks man, it works!" for sharing information.

I also don't think people will start using Arch, because the board has +rep to be earned. I like the board the way it is. We should find our fun inside the posts we write, analog to finding pleasure in solving problems in a terminal window.

cesura · 2010-10-16 00:53:59

Meh, doesn't matter either way to me. The Gentoo forums have something like that.

EDIT: Of course, it would be smarter to take it up with the FluxBB guys.

Last edited by cesura (2010-10-16 01:03:51)

stqn · 2010-10-16 01:50:28

I don't think it's useful or needed.

frabjous · 2010-10-16 02:29:28

Actually, I just looked and there is already a StackExchange proposal devoted to Arch sitting in Area 51 just waiting for enough people to support it to move on to the next stage. So if you really want to see this, go on and vote for it.

.:B:. · 2010-10-16 14:45:18

And looking at that site, a lot of those questions are typical beginner questions... If you want to know what client handles WPA better, that only means you don't know *every* Linux network application ends up relying on wpa_supplicant somehow. And if I see someone who would want to vote down guesses, well, if we started doing that here, the forum would be empty, and people would just be running around bumping their head against the wall. It's not because you don't 'know' that guessing can't be helpful; to the contrary, it can point in the direction of the solution.

As for the value of certain posts, we have moderators to determine whether posts are unwanted or not. Imagine we have a voting system - how would you, exactly like in the real world, ensure that those who vote on a post actually know what they are talking about, just like when you vote in a real-world election? That's plain impossible.

toad · 2010-10-16 15:04:35

Awebb wrote:

I'm allready too manipulated by postcounts when it comes to wether trusting or ignoring somebodies hints.

Yes, I'd actually vote for getting rid of post counts!

ozar · 2010-10-16 15:44:05

toad wrote:

Yes, I'd actually vote for getting rid of post counts!

Yep, I'm not impressed by user rankings, post count, or even date of registration for that matter, so they could all be left off the posts in the forums in my opinion. The less useless clutter, the better.

Stebalien · 2010-10-16 15:54:37

Post counts are useful when determining how specific one needs to be when giving an answer (do you need to write a tutorial or just give a simple answer).

Edit:
For me, post counts are only useful in ranges:
0-20 - be very explicit.
20-500 - more general answer but don't expect them to patch their kernel.
500-1000 - Couple of word answer should suffice (point them in the right direction).
1000+ - don't bother; if they can't fix it, I can't.

Last edited by Stebalien (2010-10-16 15:59:12)

toad · 2010-10-16 16:02:23

Stebalien wrote:

Post counts are useful when determining how specific one needs to be when giving an answer (do you need to write a tutorial or just give a simple answer).
Edit:
For me, post counts are only useful in ranges:
0-20 - be very explicit.
20-500 - more general answer but don't expect them to patch their kernel.
500-1000 - Couple of word answer should suffice (point them in the right direction).
1000+ - don't bother; if they can't fix it, I can't.

Good example of how post counts can be misleading. I may fall into the last category, should be in the second, though

cesura · 2010-10-16 17:56:14

I don't see a reason to git rid of *post counts*. It's exactly what it implies...a post count.
Totally different than an "Arch N00b" to "1337 Arch Hax0r"-type system that is being proposed.

If you're foolish enough to trust someone because of their post count, then I guess you deserve what's coming to you.

Last edited by cesura (2010-10-16 17:57:27)

kmason · 2010-10-16 18:31:12

Perhaps we get rid of registration dates and postcounts, and add an "Expertise Level" field, like what the comments area of Newegg has, that either the user sets and/or is a level that a certain group/the mods incrementally increase/decrease from a default level? I know it sort of sounds like a step backwards when going against a ranking system, but its a lot better way of gauging how useful someones help/advice is.

cesura · 2010-10-16 18:59:50

kmason wrote:

Perhaps we get rid of registration dates and postcounts, and add an "Expertise Level" field, like what the comments area of Newegg has, that either the user sets and/or is a level that a certain group/the mods incrementally increase/decrease from a default level? I know it sort of sounds like a step backwards when going against a ranking system, but its a lot better way of gauging how useful someones help/advice is.

I don't think a ranking system is a good idea in forums such as this.

For example, someone could have been using Linux for 10 years and be labeled as a beginner on the Arch forums, which is most likely not the case.

Plus, that's a lot of extra work for the mods.

EDIT: Besides, why crush Allan's dream of passing phrakture in post count?

Last edited by cesura (2010-10-16 19:00:58)

.:B:. · 2010-10-16 19:18:31

I for one am not gonna rate 1000+ users. Nor is any other mod, I'm afraid. I have better things to do with my time. As said above, there is one positive thing about registration date and post count: they're numbers, how you interpret them is up to you. Labels, titles, ratings, ... They all go way past that. And yes, maybe Ubuntu can implement such a thing, or other forums, but a lot of common sense, a sharp eye, a curious and critical mind, all those things combined can compensate this 'lack' of indicators about someone's trustworthiness (or the reliability of his knowledge) very well. Don't know what a command does, and don't trust it? Read the man page. Don't think the suggestion you got makes sense? Ask for a second opinion. That's how it works. People who think the internet is a big bad place should stay away form it altogether .

And yes, let's not shatter Allan's dreams, shall we .

Allan · 2010-10-18 09:38:22

My dreams are still alive!

Rankings only encourage useless posting. And despite what my post count is, I think the vast majority of us should post less. There is a lot of crap that should not be on the forums.

And anyway, we have rankings: Dev > TU > Members

toad · 2010-10-18 09:54:24

I'm interested in the concept of rankings or levels of expertise but haven't come across any forum which uses it. Does anybody know of any or don't they exist?

ozar · 2010-10-18 14:36:16

I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a way of ranking individual posts (not threads) that are considered very helpful, but I don't think the users themselves should be ranked by other members, or the forum staff. Otherwise, I'm fine with things the way they are.

anonymous_user · 2010-10-18 16:26:52

ozar wrote:

I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a way of ranking individual posts (not threads) that are considered very helpful

Maybe something like the "Thanks" feature on some forums?

Also having a "Thanks" feature might reduce the number of times a thread is bumped just because a user wanted to thank the OP or say that the workaround/solution worked.

Awebb · 2010-10-18 18:11:23

How about people stick around for a while and learn who might provide reliable information and who doesn't? It's a community, this is why we communicate. Reputation shouldn't be a number below a picture, it should be in the minds of people.

ViruSzZ · 2010-10-18 19:41:07

F*cK Rankings .... I`m new to the community and I have to say that it is keep`n the things real. With all my respect, the Arch Community ROCKS this way and there is no need for any rankings. I`m down with Allan, there are rankings 'Dev > TU > Members' and they worth much more than numbers or $. Just like Awebb said: 'Reputation shouldn't be a number below a picture, it should be in the minds of people.'

Sorry, for my English I'm from Macedonia...

Respect

Allan · 2010-10-18 20:15:16

ViruSzZ wrote:

I`m down with Allan, there are rankings 'Dev > TU > Members' and they worth much more than numbers or $.

I will just make clear that I was seriously joking there. There are many people on this board more knowledgeable about many Linux/computer rated things that I am.

The key point is that I do not post replies to topics on which I have to guess at the answer (unless it is one of those topics where educated guesses are needed...). There is too much crap posts on the forums already and any ranking that relies on post count is just going to increase that. The number of new users that go through off-topic and reply to every thread just to get 10 or so posts straight away is surprisingly high anyway...

Adding a "thanks" or "up and down rating" button(s) would require us altering the forum software. That will not happen unless there is a good plugin to do so already available. We do not have time to waste on such trivial things...

And remember: Allan > all

skottish · 2010-10-19 02:03:46

I have well over six thousand posts and have never said anything useful in the forums. This idea will expose the fraud that I am and could hurt my self esteem (if I had some that is).

trusktr · 2010-10-25 02:57:32

See, if there was a ranking system, i would have gained massive points for starting such an active discussion.

Perhaps a "helpful" button next to posts would be neat? And users could have levels of "helpfulness" to encourage helpful activity and badges at certain levels of helpfulness? That might be interesting. People would be more encouraged to post helpful things than to post just for posting. I could go post 7,400 posts right now if i wanted to, but that wouldn't earn me one single point of helpfulness.

Also, what about the Wiki? There already is a plugin to recognize users' contributions in the Wiki. If moderators don't remove your contributions (because they are legit) then they can be counted towards your contributions. After contributing so much to the Wiki, users can have a badge to post on their sites or blogs to show off how much they've "helped" and contributed to the community.

But yeah, after reading the whole discussion, i've been persuaded that "rank" would not be necessary. But how do you like the idea of "helpfulness"? It would not be unnecessarily competitive and it would encourage actual "helpful" posting.

Last edited by trusktr (2010-10-25 05:29:04)

Arch Linux

#1 2010-10-16 00:15:09

Arch ranking system to promote growth of the community...

#2 2010-10-16 00:18:00

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#3 2010-10-16 00:38:09

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