Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

Vegita · 2010-10-18 11:53:14

First of all, the best thing at Archlinux (the main reason I'm using it) is the fact, that it follows completely versions recommended by developers, even if it's a snapshot version like at mplayer or at cinelerra-cv

But there are some programs, that should follow the same policy: Windows Live messenger (MSN) clients: Microsoft always changes something on the MSN protocoll, and made all the alternative clients suck, but the develpoers of the alternative clients doesn't release immediatelly a new bugfix version, but they fix the bug immediatelly in the git/svn snapshots. aMSN developers didn't even released new versions for a long time, and their last release is dated at March 2010, but they upgrade everything in snapshots. KMess had 2.0 working perfectly about one year ago, and now it's 2.0.4, and 3 of the 4 updates was just because MSN protocoll changes, kmess is now crashing even for me, and they only fixed it in the stable-git repo according to this topic: http://kmess.org/board/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4685 , but 2.0.5 relese is more far away, until then, we can't login to our WLM account with KMess.

Earlier I heard a protocoll change, which involved KMess, aMSN and emesene users too, aMSN and KMess developers first surely only fixed it in their svn/git repos, I don't know what's the case with emesene.

So my suggestion is: change community/kmess-2.0.4 to community/kmess-git20101017 and same with aMSN and maybe with emesene

Last edited by Vegita (2010-10-18 11:54:53)

Allan · 2010-10-18 12:04:03

If things do not work, file a bug.

capoeira · 2010-10-18 22:56:11

since yesterday I have strange behavier in AMSN:
every login a window pops up saying I have 2 offline-messages, but when I confirm that I want to read them they don't pop up
Has that something to do with this? Should i instal AMS-git from AUR?

capoeira · 2010-10-19 15:25:11

i'm using mercury 2RC now, it lets you choose the protocol before login

ngoonee · 2010-10-19 22:49:35

Why not just use pidgin? I've never had problems for longer than 2 days with a MSN server-side update, and there's 2 different plugins to use for MSN (msn-pecan is AUR though).

Vegita · 2010-10-24 10:20:10

Solution: git/svn snapshots in extra/community of all msn-only clients (amsn and kmess fixed it the other day, but no new non-snapshot release).

I know aur, but kmess is not a thing I want to install from aur, and it would be better for all MSN users

Allan · 2010-10-24 10:22:02

No... solution is to file bug reports when things break...

ngoonee · 2010-10-25 02:29:16

Just file a bug-report asking upstream to re-release. If their stable release doesn't work at all, they're doing something wrong.

Vegita · 2010-10-25 07:23:09

yes it doesn't so I'm filing

edit: I sit okay? https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/21462

Last edited by Vegita (2010-10-25 07:32:48)

Awebb · 2010-10-25 07:43:48

I think they tried to tell you to file a bug upstream. It's an upstream bug, not an arch bug. You cannot ask our beloved maintainers to monitor every single package for whether the git/svn version should be preferred over the stable version. You might only ask for MSN clients, but others might feel the same way about their favorite packages.

What's the matter with AUR? Slow CPU and long compile times?

Vegita · 2010-10-25 08:07:49

actually I'm asking only for community/kmess 2.0.4 -> community/kmess git, as I can see, that there's a fix (maybe patch) for amsn as it was a new packeűage a week ago, anyway it's not the snapshot.

But in kmess there is kmess-stable-git and kmess-unstable-git, so it's the same game as mplayer now, only the snapshot is usable, the release is not, and when I last used aMSN it was the same way, but it seems patchable now or I don't know

And my problem with aur:
[root@myhost ~]# yaourt -Ss kmess
community/kmess 2.0.4-1 [installed]
KMess is a MSN Messenger client for Linux.
aur/kmess-git 20100622-1 (7)
A full-featured MSN Client for KDE - GIT development version
aur/kmess-stable-git 20100903-1 (14)
A full-featured MSN Client for KDE - GIT stable branch version
aur/kmesstestserver-git 20100530-1 (0)
A tool to debug the MSN protocol – by emulating a full WLM-compatible server.

I would need at least a 20101017 of the stable-git version, and this unsupported thing can happen anywhen, it has a better place in community, as somone uses archlinux and doesn't even know what git is (it's not me, but some of my friends has kmess stopped working too, and has no idea)

Last edited by Vegita (2010-10-25 08:11:47)

kazuo · 2010-10-25 08:34:03

Vegita wrote:

actually I'm asking only for community/kmess 2.0.4 -> community/kmess git, as I can see, that there's a fix (maybe patch) for amsn as it was a new packeűage a week ago, anyway it's not the snapshot.
aur/kmess-stable-git 20100903-1 (14)
A full-featured MSN Client for KDE - GIT stable branch version
I would need at least a 20101017 of the stable-git version, and this unsupported thing can happen anywhen, it has a better place in community, as somone uses archlinux and doesn't even know what git is (it's not me, but some of my friends has kmess stopped working too, and has no idea)

In Arch the main rule is to follow the upstream development (choices, models), you compare kmess to mplayer but they really use different dev models. Mplayer never release, the releases 1.0rcN are only created to annoy some packagers of distros that wait a release number. The last release 1.0rc3 are created from code of one year ago.

Kmess don't do this, they have tagged releases. What Allan is asking is to you fill a bug report upstream so they release a new version, or change the whole development model for a more agility one.

Arch have a small number of devs, they can't track the stability/usefulness of the git/svn version so they can attest if is better to use the tagged releases or snapshot of all the programs in the repo. This is a task of upstream.

In the case of mplayer, the devs only recommend that you use a current svn snapshot, can you point for a similar declaration from Kmess developers?

And about aur I dont get what you mean, if you need something greater than 20101017 than compile it at a time greater than 20101017 (like today =]), the git's PKGBUILD take snapshots at time you build it.

I know that all this can not be much convenient for you, but think about the work needed to track the development of the hundreds of programs we have in the repos. The git can be stable now, but its is stable tomorrow? How much time between upgrades? The devs will gonna need to test it every day to see if the msn network is broken. This is not a work for the Arch devs but for Kmess devs.

Vegita · 2010-10-25 09:09:49

I know what you are talking about, but in case of kmess there is a stable-git and an unstable-git repository, so it shouldn't be a problem, if it stops working after a snapshot upgrade.

Anyway it must be default to kmess developers, to release 2.0.5 as soon as possible, I don't know why is this happening, and you are right, it's their fault, as they fixed it the other day, but only for the git repositories.

And anyway I wasn't demanding anything of Archlinux maintainers, I was just trying to help packages stay working in Archlinux repositories, which worked weeks ago too, I know that the developers don't have the time to test if the svn or the latest stable release is working better, I don't even expect, that was why I recommended to package instead the git-stable by default (to make it work for everyone), as it seems a much more working version for most of the time

capoeira · 2010-10-25 11:17:12

kazuo wrote:

(like today =])

eheheheheheh

Vegita · 2010-10-26 10:47:37

finally, kmess 2.0.5 released, so it's not a porblem from now, somone has even flagged it as ood here

Arch Linux

#1 2010-10-18 11:53:14

Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#2 2010-10-18 12:04:03

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#3 2010-10-18 22:56:11

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#4 2010-10-19 15:25:11

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#5 2010-10-19 22:49:35

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#6 2010-10-24 10:20:10

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#7 2010-10-24 10:22:02

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#8 2010-10-25 02:29:16

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#9 2010-10-25 07:23:09

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#10 2010-10-25 07:43:48

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#11 2010-10-25 08:07:49

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#12 2010-10-25 08:34:03

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#13 2010-10-25 09:09:49

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#14 2010-10-25 11:17:12

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

#15 2010-10-26 10:47:37

Re: Suggestion: git/svn snapshots in stable of Win Live Messenger clients

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