h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

ShionjiYuuko · 2011-09-19 14:23:14

The digital video community is moving towards this new technology. Windows users (with CCCP and ffdshow) already have h264 10-bit support since a while ago. Official mplayer2 source and binary already supported this (except for the flawed libass which crashes the application). x264 implementation is a bit flawed but there are patches out there to fix the issues. FFmpeg already supported 10-bit decoding since April this year. This profile is especially good for encoding bitrate-intensive Blu-ray videos.

My question is why the official x264, ffmpeg and mplayer2 from Arch repo haven't had the support? Is there any issue that holds back the package developer team?

For a temporary fix, I've made some PKGBUILDs.
mplayer2 from official source with libass-0.9.13
x264 10-bit
At least, if there's no plan to include the support, maybe someone here would help me tidying up those PKGBUILD scripts.

As for x264, maybe we need to build separate binaries/packages for each bit-depth.

PS: we can use XBMC for 10-bit support, but it is not as user-friendly as mplayer2.

Grinch · 2011-09-20 00:04:17

I just tried a 10bit encode in mplayer (that is, not mplayer2 which I haven't got installed) and it played fine, VLC did not (just showed green) which I found weird, don't both of them rely on the same x264? (although VLC uses ffmpeg, ffmpeg in turn uses the x264 package, right?)

Gusar · 2011-09-20 00:23:03

x264 is an encoder-only, it has nothing to do with playback. To play these videos, ffmpeg must be new enough. Could be VLC is using the system ffmpeg, while mplayer uses it's internal one which is newer than the system one. Or something like that.

Grinch · 2011-09-20 00:39:10

Ah yes, silly of me!

skottish · 2011-09-20 01:17:27

There are things to take into consideration. For instance, VDPAU is not compatible with these streams, so if one depends on hardware decoding for high bitrate videos, this may become an issue.

ShionjiYuuko · 2011-09-20 04:09:08

oh, now mplayer can play 10-bit. how about ordered chapter/linked(?) mkv files? if it can play them then maybe it's time to switch back to mplayer (this is what made me switch to mplayer2 at first)

found a thread in CCCP forum about comparison between 10-bit and ordinary 8-bit (there are links to screenshots). an astounding example is 1080p rip of a 12-episode Blu-Ray series encoded in 10-bit takes roughly half the size of the same rip encoded in 8-bit

for hardware encoding, I don't see any problem there. no hardware support (yet) for 10-bit, but it doesn't mean that the users of those hardware can't play videos at all (maybe they must change the driver/vo options for 10-bit videos), it's just they won't get hardware acceleration.

Last edited by ShionjiYuuko (2011-09-20 04:09:30)

Gusar · 2011-09-20 09:26:55

ShionjiYuuko wrote:

oh, now mplayer can play 10-bit. how about ordered chapter/linked(?) mkv files? if it can play them then maybe it's time to switch back to mplayer (this is what made me switch to mplayer2 at first)

As far as I know, no ordered chapter support in mplayer yet. But mplayer2 can play 10bit videos, so you can just stick with that.

ShionjiYuuko wrote:

it's just they won't get hardware acceleration.

Which kinda defeats the purpose of having a hardware decoder. What about the people who have a HTPC with a cheap and crappy (but low power and quiet) CPU paired with a cheap and crappy (but passively cooled and good enough for VDPAU) Nvidia card? They can't make use of the benefits of 10bit, as the CPU may not be powerful enough and the graphic card only decodes 8bit videos.

ShionjiYuuko · 2011-09-20 11:03:31

Gusar wrote:

ShionjiYuuko wrote:
oh, now mplayer can play 10-bit. how about ordered chapter/linked(?) mkv files? if it can play them then maybe it's time to switch back to mplayer (this is what made me switch to mplayer2 at first)
As far as I know, no ordered chapter support in mplayer yet. But mplayer2 can play 10bit videos, so you can just stick with that.
.....

yes the official mplayer2 can play it but the last time I updated my mplayer2 from repo (2.0-13) it can't, or am I missing something?

I'd be really happy if we have 10-bit x264 with some custom patches since the official release is not perfect yet, but I guess that violates our vanilla package priciple

==edit==

geez, just because the repo lags a little I made rants as if linux had no future

Last edited by ShionjiYuuko (2011-09-20 11:05:50)

Grinch · 2011-09-20 15:14:26

Well, 10bit will obviously be supported in future hardware aswell (equal or better quality at lower bitrates makes that a sure thing), but obviously my Tvix won't play it as of now. Still I'm sure the vast majority out there are watching stuff through their desktops/laptops and as such 10bit encodes will likely catch on very quickly.

Hmm... I wonder if Handbrake supports 10bit in their current nightlies...

R00KIE · 2011-09-20 22:48:41

Current hardware might not support 10bit playback acceleration even with updated drivers, so I wouldn't hold my breath counting on that. Future hardware yes but it will probably take some time until cheap and passively cooled cards come to the market, and there may be a few catches with 10bit support in the first implementations.

masteryod · 2011-09-21 00:01:16

interesting stuff, I did quick playback test on this sample:
http://www.mediafire.com/?w429656vqm89ez7 (crazy japanese power rangers - consider yourself warned)

vlc 1.1.11-4 and dragon player: no video, green screen, sound ok
xbmc 10.1-8: playable but colors are broken
umplayer 0.97-1/mplayer 34007-1: all ok

so (software) playback shouldn't be an issue in the near future, apps and libs just need to catch up

[update] fresh compilation of vlc-git (aur) also doesn't work

* test was made on Arch as guest on virtualbox

Last edited by masteryod (2011-09-21 00:26:07)

skottish · 2011-09-22 04:00:39

ShionjiYuuko wrote:

I'd be really happy if we have 10-bit x264 with some custom patches since the official release is not perfect yet, but I guess that violates our vanilla package priciple

I'm using a 10 bit enabled x264 build. It breaks hardware decoding, which has become the industry stardand for low-powered, affordable devices. The workstation that I'm writing this on has a hex-core, 3.4Ghz proessor, with 8GB of RAM. VDPAU on high-bitrate Blu-Ray quality videos yields less than 1% processor power with efficient energy usage. Mplayer2 pulls at least one full processor (core) at the 3.4Ghz level worth of energy. My laptop couldn't handle this video.

ShionjiYuuko,

No offense intended towards you, but 10-bit Anime isn't worth pushing away almost all common users on *any* OS. Arch has provided years and years of tools to help you make it yours.

Last edited by skottish (2011-09-22 04:01:11)

ShionjiYuuko · 2011-09-23 12:21:24

skottish wrote:

ShionjiYuuko wrote:
I'd be really happy if we have 10-bit x264 with some custom patches since the official release is not perfect yet, but I guess that violates our vanilla package priciple
I'm using a 10 bit enabled x264 build. It breaks hardware decoding, which has become the industry stardand for low-powered, affordable devices. The workstation that I'm writing this on has a hex-core, 3.4Ghz proessor, with 8GB of RAM. VDPAU on high-bitrate Blu-Ray quality videos yields less than 1% processor power with efficient energy usage. Mplayer2 pulls at least one full processor (core) at the 3.4Ghz level worth of energy. My laptop couldn't handle this video.
ShionjiYuuko,
No offense intended towards you, but 10-bit Anime isn't worth pushing away almost all common users on *any* OS. Arch has provided years and years of tools to help you make it yours.

well yes maybe since it still has many flaws (incorrect color result, for example) and inflexibility a 10-bit version of x264 couldn't yet make its way to the repository, and for this one we should turn our attention directly to its developers, but how about mplayer2? why did repo team leave it outdated? as far as I know adding 10-bit decoding capability won't break the hardware decoding for normal 8-bit videos

sorry for asking too much

skottish · 2011-09-24 01:27:05

mplayer2 works great for me on 10bit videos, but I'm also running a 3.4Ghz hex-core processor with 8GB of RAM. But as a comparison on Blu-Ray quality 8bit movies, with VDPAU my system barely uses 3% of one core. mplayer2 will use approximately the equivalent of one core spread out over all six.

Last edited by skottish (2011-09-24 01:27:37)

ShionjiYuuko · 2011-09-24 02:13:13

skottish wrote:

mplayer2 works great for me on 10bit videos, but I'm also running a 3.4Ghz hex-core processor with 8GB of RAM. But as a comparison on Blu-Ray quality 8bit movies, with VDPAU my system barely uses 3% of one core. mplayer2 will use approximately the equivalent of one core spread out over all six.

you didn't notice any incorrect color output or occasional strange (usually darker) color blobs?

hmm... I wonder what encoder they use... I never get a correct result with x264, not even once

Arch Linux

#1 2011-09-19 14:23:14

h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#2 2011-09-20 00:04:17

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#3 2011-09-20 00:23:03

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#4 2011-09-20 00:39:10

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#5 2011-09-20 01:17:27

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#6 2011-09-20 04:09:08

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#7 2011-09-20 09:26:55

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#8 2011-09-20 11:03:31

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#9 2011-09-20 15:14:26

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#10 2011-09-20 22:48:41

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#11 2011-09-21 00:01:16

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#12 2011-09-22 04:00:39

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#13 2011-09-23 12:21:24

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#14 2011-09-24 01:27:05

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

#15 2011-09-24 02:13:13

Re: h264 10-bit Playback/Encoding Suppport with mplayer2 and x264

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