KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

nils · 2011-01-28 15:46:22

Hey,
yesterday I updated my KDE Environment to 4.6.0. It is a disaster here! Crashes, frozen applications, slow reacting, unused new settings, blinking srceen, some apps don't start at all (kbluetooth, kde-gtk), I cannot imagine what the KDE devs thought when they released it as stable!? With KDE 4.5.0 I had no of these problems, it was quite stable!
Because this seems to be really unusual for me, is it that unstable on your machines, too? Btw I removed hal and phonon-xine, and installed phonon-vlc and pulseaudio. Could the problem be something else in the system?

Regards,
Nils

Last edited by nils (2011-01-28 15:53:32)

Inxsible · 2011-01-28 15:53:12

have you done all that is asked in this

http://www.archlinux.org/news/kde-sc-46-to-extra/

SS4 · 2011-01-28 15:55:11

Nope, stable ever since Kwin was patched in beta 2 to reduce memory use.

I'm not sure why your settings don't work although I do use the gstreamer backend (for clementine) and without hal.

You can always try moving your .kde4 to force generate a new one

nils · 2011-01-28 16:44:36

I already tried to get it work well by removing the .kde4 and the directorys given in the link from Inxsible. Doesn't improve anything … In the linked article it's also recommended trying a new user account, I'll try that next. If it doesn't help, I'll downgrade to 4.5.5. BTW: After some time the 3D effects are going to be disabled by kwin because of too less resources (?), then, without the special effects, kde works much better.

xephinx · 2011-01-28 16:44:41

nils wrote:

I cannot imagine what the KDE devs thought when they released it as stable!?

Stop flaming...
I updated it yesterday and everything works fine!

Did you removed hal in your rc.conf and replaced it with dbus?
Also did you do this:

Archlinux-news wrote:

In case of any error, try using a new user account or (re)moving KDE's configuration which can be found at ~/.kde4 /tmp/kde- /var/tmp/kdecache-. Akonadi saves its data at ~/.config/akonadi and ~/.local/share/akonadi.

nils · 2011-01-28 17:11:18

Yes, of course I removed hal in my rc.conf and dbus is running. I also tried using a new user account and removing the kde configuration and akonadi files as posted above.

KDE works till I'm activating 3D effects (switching windows and cube), then it is reacting horribly slow and sometimes freezing, though my hardware is fast enough and it worked quite well in 4.5.x.

kbluetooth and kde-gtk still arent't working at all.

Thanks,
Nils

Last edited by nils (2011-01-28 17:12:00)

jlacroix · 2011-01-29 00:48:27

I have been having bad experience with KDE 4.6 as well, but not quite as bad as what the OP has said. I just removed hal from my rc.conf, and I did not put dbus in the rc.conf, should I have?

My problem is intermittent lockups where my system stops responding for about 5 seconds and then is fine. I don't know if it is the same issue, didn't want to start a new topic.

ANOKNUSA · 2011-01-29 01:22:29

jlacroix wrote:

I have been having bad experience with KDE 4.6 as well, but not quite as bad as what the OP has said. I just removed hal from my rc.conf, and I did not put dbus in the rc.conf, should I have?.

I'm starting to wonder if anyone's been following the KDE development track around here. Yes, you should have.

As for the op's questions: if you made other major changes to your system at the same time as upgrading to 4.6, they may have had some unforeseen effect. Try eliminating them as the culprit. You might also go to System Settings->Workspace Appearance->Desktop Effects->Advanced and see if fiddling with those settings improves things at all.

mianka · 2011-01-29 01:26:59

Updated 2 machines (64-bit) and do not have the slightest problem until now.

Demon · 2011-01-29 01:57:32

I have some of these problems, too. This is my "list":
1. Screen flickers randomly (whether effects are on or off)
2. plasma desktop hangs for about 15 seconds on start (I can't figure the cause of this)
3. kmix uses 15 MiB of memory and it works only if I clear all of its config files before start
4. kded4 process hangs (although rarely) and locks CPU at 100%
5. there are severeal kded4 processes started as root
6. language kcmshell4 module crashes

Overall, the speed is good, but it seems to me new KDE uses a bit more memory than its predecessor.

Last edited by Demon (2011-01-29 01:58:09)

jlacroix · 2011-01-29 02:09:57

ANOKNUSA wrote:

jlacroix wrote:
I have been having bad experience with KDE 4.6 as well, but not quite as bad as what the OP has said. I just removed hal from my rc.conf, and I did not put dbus in the rc.conf, should I have?.
I'm starting to wonder if anyone's been following the KDE development track around here. Yes, you should have.

Thanks. I just checked my rc.conf and dbus was already there, so I guess I did add it but forgot.

ssri · 2011-01-29 02:29:25

I've used .xinitrc to start my kde session since 4.3.x and almost everything worked fine; I had to edit kwinrc to get effects to work in 4.5.0. However, I have problems simply logging out of KDE 4.6.0 where it simply hangs (necessitating ctrl-alt-bksp) or crashes X (can't access to any virtual terminals->REISUB). All this after following the recommendations on the front page: removing akonadi files, kdecache, ~/.kde4/share/config and hal and leaving dbus behind.

Last edited by ssri (2011-01-29 02:30:18)

atordo · 2011-01-29 03:37:04

Inxsible wrote:

have you done all that is asked in this
http://www.archlinux.org/news/kde-sc-46-to-extra/

Wich in a nutshell is:

In case of any error, try using a new user account or (re)moving KDE's configuration

WTF? If I wanted to periodically wipe my desktop, I'd use MS Windows. But I guess that like Windows users we got to lazy to look for better alternatives, so we just got what we deserve for sticking with KDE.

jlacroix · 2011-01-29 04:11:59

WTF? If I wanted to periodically wipe my desktop, I'd use MS Windows. But I guess that like Windows users we got to lazy to look for better alternatives, so we just got what we deserve for sticking with KDE.

You're comparing Windows (an operating system) to KDE (a desktop environment). The unfortunate truth is that with EVERY major KDE release, you MUST remove your .kde4 folder to reset your configuration. Of course, there are some who have been lucky and haven't had to do that. But the general rule is, you MUST delete your configuration or something won't work. This is a KDE problem, not Linux. If that bothers you, use GNOME.

Hopefully the KDE developers fix this problem soon, but not for a few more releases from now at least. The entire KDE4 series has never played well with having a previous configuration.

Last edited by jlacroix (2011-01-29 04:12:54)

tavianator · 2011-01-29 04:15:41

jlacroix wrote:

But the general rule is, you MUST delete your configuration or something won't work. This is a KDE problem, not Linux. If that bothers you, use GNOME.

I'd guess that most users don't need to delete their .kde4 folder when they upgrade. Hell, I grabbed KDE 4.6 before the strigi update got pushed and it migrated all my configs in a half-broken state, and it still worked fine (after I upgraded strigi). That doesn't mean that backing up your .kde4 isn't a good idea though. I keep mine managed with git.

EDIT: I didn't realise how off-topic this was when I posted it. To the OP: it's likely that KDE is now just exposing bugs in your 3D driver that it wasn't before. A lot of KWin's effects code was changed for this release. What graphics driver are you using?

Last edited by tavianator (2011-01-29 04:19:59)

MadTux · 2011-01-29 07:08:57

My upgrade to KDE 4.6 went very smoothly, couldn't be happier. Many thanks to the developers, they did an incredible job. I didn't remove my configuration folder. I am also using desktop effects with the proprietary nVidia drivers (GeForce 8400 GS).

agapito · 2011-01-29 07:16:08

If you don't want delete .kde4 on every major release go to install debian squeeze and you have a stable kde 4.4 for 3 years. I always spend 30 minutes on reconfiguring all my apps with a new major release.

Kde 4.6 is stable for me, my only issue is every time i reboot, plasma crashes and i have to close the error window to reboot my comp.

I would put 4.6 final on kde-unstable for 2 or 3 days before release to extra repo.

panosk · 2011-01-29 09:18:14

atordo wrote:

Inxsible wrote:
have you done all that is asked in this
http://www.archlinux.org/news/kde-sc-46-to-extra/
Wich in a nutshell is:
In case of any error, try using a new user account or (re)moving KDE's configuration
WTF? If I wanted to periodically wipe my desktop, I'd use MS Windows. But I guess that like Windows users we got to lazy to look for better alternatives, so we just got what we deserve for sticking with KDE.

1) Nobody forces you to update immediately after a major update comes out
2) No pain no gain. You can't have the latest and greatest without getting your hands dirty sometimes. If you don't want that, I am wondering why you use Arch anyways. Use Debian and you'll be fine.
3) Windows doesn't update its DE from the ground up every six months, but rather every six years. And the funny thing is that the new version is always beta quality with problems and conflicts that go away after the first service pack which comes after a year or so.

So, please, stop trolling.

atordo · 2011-01-29 10:21:56

jlacroix wrote:

This is a KDE problem, not Linux.

I know. Linux in text mode is rock solid. KDE (since version 4) is unreliable under every OS.

If that bothers you, use GNOME.

I tried and didn't like it very much. Might try another options, though. Anyway for me is not about the desktop but the apps. Already replaced kmail with good'ol mutt, but there's yet a bunch of apps I must find a replacement for.

panosk wrote:

1) Nobody forces you to update immediately after a major update comes out

I held KDE 3.5 in IgnorePkg as long as I could, but finally some dependencies (a math library, IIRC) prevented me from updating the rest of the system.

Use Debian and you'll be fine.

Second suggestion in the same thread. May be I have to consider it, because, you know, for some people their computer is a tool to manage their work and personal stuff, not a display to show the latest kwel fad.

My /home has files which predate KDE itself, and has survived the pass of computers, distros and even centuries. I don't plan to throw it away every time some brilliant mind vomits a new desktop paradigm.

So, please, stop trolling.

Never!

clearwater67 · 2011-01-29 11:01:53

panosk wrote:

1) Nobody forces you to update immediately after a major update comes out

I think that we have "testing" repository right for this case. Placing 4.6 to the "extra" repository was a mistake.

2) No pain no gain. You can't have the latest and greatest without getting your hands dirty sometimes. If you don't want that, I am wondering why you use Arch anyways. Use Debian and you'll be fine.

Rolling-release model doesn't mean placing buggy apps to common use.

3) Windows doesn't update its DE from the ground up every six months, but rather every six years. And the funny thing is that the new version is always beta quality with problems and conflicts that go away after the first service pack which comes after a year or so.
So, please, stop trolling.

I have experienced a lot of problems with 4.6 and have to downgrade to 4.5.5. I'll wait until 4.6.1 or even 4.6.2.

Eagleheart · 2011-01-29 11:03:38

xephinx wrote:

nils wrote:
I cannot imagine what the KDE devs thought when they released it as stable!?
Stop flaming...
I updated it yesterday and everything works fine!
Did you removed hal in your rc.conf and replaced it with dbus?
Also did you do this:
Archlinux-news wrote:
In case of any error, try using a new user account or (re)moving KDE's configuration which can be found at ~/.kde4 /tmp/kde- /var/tmp/kdecache-. Akonadi saves its data at ~/.config/akonadi and ~/.local/share/akonadi.

Well, my case is similar:

1 - After I logged in my session, the screen turned black. I can use KRunner.
2 - Then I erased all indicate KDE stuff, removed HAL and put DBus right con rc.conf.

After that, KDE starts normally, but when I want to change a widget's configuration, it turns black again (KRunner stills works). So, if I don't touch that, KDE still stays around.

Now, changing default windows manager from KWin to Compiz just takes me back to 1 (it dies when I run any application). So, I wonder if ther would be something else to try.

I'm not complaining hard, and I'll wait for next update or keep searching (or reinstall everything).

Thanks. (:

nils · 2011-01-29 11:08:18

Hello again,
now the current situation ist like that:
- I replaced kbluetooth (which isn't in official arch repo any more?) with bluedevil. I used kbluetooth all the time with kde 4.5.5 and it worked well. Maybe it would help to make a note in the archwiki kde page to replace it with bluedevil.
- kde-gtk/gtk-oxygen doesn't work, gtk applications don't appear in oxygen style as it was before in 4.5.x
- all in all kde works stable, BUT only without big graphic effects. the cube works quite well but switching windows (alt+tab) with 3D effects is horrible and always freezing the desktop for a while. after some minutes kwin disables the 3D effects because of "few resources" and everything works fine again.
- I'm using the propritary nvidia driver(nVIDIA Quadro NVS 3100M, 256MB graphics memory)
- I removed .kde4 and akonadi files
- mouse pointer design sometimes doesn't work at login, then the primitive X mouse theme appears all the time and I can't really change it (maybe a real bug?)
- creating a new user and working with it doesn't matter (I would have wondered if it did)
- system takes about 450MB ram in kde session with chromium open (this is not much more than in previous versions iirc)
- I removed all of the plasmoids, which I installed of AUR before (read this in another thread here)
- Here my daemons array of /etc/rc.conf:
DAEMONS=(@syslog-ng dbus @alsa !netfs !network networkmanager @bluetooth @cpufreq @ntpd @samba !boinc @crond kdm)

I hope this could help to solve the issue.

Regards, Nils

Last edited by nils (2011-01-29 11:10:44)

ngoonee · 2011-01-29 11:09:34

clearwater67 wrote:

panosk wrote:
1) Nobody forces you to update immediately after a major update comes out
I think that we have "testing" repository right for this case. Placing 4.6 to the "extra" repository was a mistake.
2) No pain no gain. You can't have the latest and greatest without getting your hands dirty sometimes. If you don't want that, I am wondering why you use Arch anyways. Use Debian and you'll be fine.
Rolling-release model doesn't mean placing buggy apps to common use.
3) Windows doesn't update its DE from the ground up every six months, but rather every six years. And the funny thing is that the new version is always beta quality with problems and conflicts that go away after the first service pack which comes after a year or so.
So, please, stop trolling.
I have experienced a lot of problems with 4.6 and have to downgrade to 4.5.5. I'll wait until 4.6.1 or even 4.6.2.

You misunderstand the purpose of [testing]. It is not a place where bugs are ironed out so that 'normal' users never see them. It is a place to test for obvious packaging/dependency problems (the kernel is an exception to this rule, because a non-working kernel can mean some people wouldn't be able to boot). I can't even remember the last time any packages from [extra] were placed there.

If you use Arch, you implicitly accept the assumption that you are able and willing to deal with your system on a low level. If KDE upstream is buggy (up to a limit) this will not hold back the release of KDE packages in Arch, because users are expected to at least know how to ignore updates and/or find workarounds/fixes, to the extent of submitting patches upstream.

Bring your complaints and issues to the KDE folk. I've actually not seen that many KDE complaints around here recently (compared to when 4.0 was initially released), which suggests the issues aren't as wide-ranging as you may feel. Contrast this to the current issues with xfce.

And finally, if you're unwilling to remove .kde because 'you shouldn't have to', then I'd suggest moving away from KDE. Gnome may be an option, or the Trinity packages which someone is currently working on.

Eagleheart · 2011-01-29 11:28:04

nils wrote:

- I removed all of the plasmoids, which I installed of AUR before (read this in another thread here)

This solved my problem! Thanks a lot. (:

Patience is a virtue.

nils · 2011-01-29 11:39:23

I made a screenshot here on my webspace: http://bastel-freak.de/bilder/kwin1.png
As you can see:
→ kde works fine as usual
→ then I'm using Alt+Tab to switch between windows with 3D effects enabled
→ cpu usage increases increadibly
→ kwin is freezing some seconds
→ every following action, pressing buttons, closing windows and so on needs full cpu usage and is horribly slow
→ after half a minute kwin disables 3D effects itself because of few resources and slow reactions
→ everything works fine again

Is there any log file I could check or something else to see where the problems comes from?

Arch Linux

#1 2011-01-28 15:46:22

KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#2 2011-01-28 15:53:12

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#3 2011-01-28 15:55:11

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#4 2011-01-28 16:44:36

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#5 2011-01-28 16:44:41

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#6 2011-01-28 17:11:18

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#7 2011-01-29 00:48:27

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#8 2011-01-29 01:22:29

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#9 2011-01-29 01:26:59

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#10 2011-01-29 01:57:32

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#11 2011-01-29 02:09:57

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#12 2011-01-29 02:29:25

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#13 2011-01-29 03:37:04

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#14 2011-01-29 04:11:59

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#15 2011-01-29 04:15:41

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#16 2011-01-29 07:08:57

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#17 2011-01-29 07:16:08

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#18 2011-01-29 09:18:14

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#19 2011-01-29 10:21:56

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#20 2011-01-29 11:01:53

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#21 2011-01-29 11:03:38

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#22 2011-01-29 11:08:18

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#23 2011-01-29 11:09:34

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#24 2011-01-29 11:28:04

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

#25 2011-01-29 11:39:23

Re: KDE 4.6 increadibly unstable

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