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#1 2005-10-18 19:09:05

henrysmith
Member
From: United Kingdom
Registered: 2005-09-01
Posts: 17

Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

Basic information for first time viewers: in arch, my touchpad has a strange synaptics-related issue where depending on when and if I plug in a usb mouse during boot, I get no touchpad (with no touchpad if I don't plug in the usb mouse). The 2nd to last post is a rather long log of some stuff I tried, and lots of incoherent speculation, though it may be of use to anyone wanting to track hardware compatibility or something
The issue was solved by an upgrade to 0.7.1. More details in last post

I have a load of information (at least it's a lot to me), so hopefully I won't be wasting too much of your time on this. I've tried a lot of stuff to get my laptop's touchpad to work under Arch, and though it works under certain circumstances, it's not 100%.
If the USB mouse is plugged in from boot, the touchpad works fine, even pre-xorg.conf after the installation.
Otherwise, no chance. Modprobing the modules that are different when the usb mouse is plugged in doesn't help.
Installing the synaptics drivers with pacman and following the instructions about xorg.conf prevents the x server from loading. I've tried lots of little tweaks to work around this but nothing helps.
The laptop is a Fujitsu Siemens Amilo Pro V7010 (by the way - not recommended as a linux user purchase: ATI mobility card). I've been trying to run Arch on it for almost 6 months, and this has been the main sticking point (this and wireless support)

These files are lsmod, lspci, and lspci -v, done first without the usb mouse from power on, and second with it:
[I took these files down, so I've deleted the broken links]

thanks in advance

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#2 2005-10-18 19:38:41

rayjgu3
Member
From: Chicago IL usa
Registered: 2004-07-04
Posts: 692

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

1st thing im gonna ask is have you tried other distros with success?
how about a live distro try archie currently http://archie.sys-techs.com/
this one is beta so you  could try damn small linux for a quick download(only 50mb)

in your /etc/X11/xorg .conf is your core pointer /dev/psaux ? did you run xorgconfig?
did you run hwd -s & hwd -e & then to see output of how to setup "arch way" hwd -h?
the last one is real informative but you have to run previous commands to get "how to"

as for wireless do you have pcmcia-cs ?  you may need ndiswrapper but from what ive seen
theres some problems with the current kernel26, i dont know i have cisco card which
requires pcmcia-cs then modprobe pcmcia yenta-socket airo airo-cs it worked fantastic till last big upgrade now after boot up i have to unplug replug card the run ifconfig -a  , dhcpcd wifi0
it wont work with eth1 like it used to there probably is a work around for mine just havent found it yet , havent looked real hard either

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#3 2005-10-18 19:46:15

henrysmith
Member
From: United Kingdom
Registered: 2005-09-01
Posts: 17

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

good question. I really should have included that info in my first post. Yeah, the touchpad works fine in every other distro I've ever run, except for live cds (almost none of them autodetect it). slackware, for example, seems to run it quite well using its ps2 driver (at least that's what xorg.conf says in slackware).
I'd never heard of this hwd thing before today. I had to install it first, but since I'm in arch now using only the usb mouse, it only seems to have detected that:
PS/2+USB Mouse xtype: IMPS2 module: usbhid device: /dev/input/mice
I will try with the touchpad initialised just now (this means a reboot)...
EDIT:
same output with touchpad working (impressive program in general, but to give consistent results is very good)
on removing the usb mouse, it says
generic ps/2 wheel mouse xtype: PS2 device: /dev/psaux

yeah, psaux was the corepointer

list of distros I can remember off the top of my head that it has worked out of the box with: slackware 10, 10.2 & 10.2, suse 9.3, mandriva LE 2005, Fedora core 3 and 4. It's not the strangest thing not to work straight off: slackware 10.0 wins that one by not setting up my network card module automatically (easily fixed though).

EDIT:
my current xorg.conf, since that is probably quite useful information, is basically ps/2 protocol with /dev/psaux
i have tried it on the various /dev/input/mice /dev/input/mouse0 type stuff but to no avail

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#4 2005-10-18 21:13:40

sh__
Member
Registered: 2005-07-19
Posts: 271

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

Do you have separate entries in xorg.conf for the touchpad and the mouse? I mean like

Section "ServerLayout"
        Identifier     "Xorg Configured"
        Screen 0 "Screen0" 0 0
        InputDevice    "Touchpad" "CorePointer"
        InputDevice    "UsbMouse" "SendCoreEvents"
        InputDevice    "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
        Identifier  "Touchpad"
        Driver      "mouse"
        Option      "Protocol" "auto"
        Option      "Device" "/dev/psaux"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
        Identifier "UsbMouse"
        Driver "mouse"
        Option "Protocol" "IMPS/2"
        Option "Device" "/dev/input/mice"
        Option "ZAxisMapping" "4 5"
EndSection

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#5 2005-10-18 21:15:33

phrakture
Arch Overlord
From: behind you
Registered: 2003-10-29
Posts: 7,879
Website

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

are you using the synaptics driver?  I'd try that if you're not - according to google, your touchpad is synaptics

pacman -S synaptics will spit out all the info you need.

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#6 2005-10-18 21:40:50

rayjgu3
Member
From: Chicago IL usa
Registered: 2004-07-04
Posts: 692

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

i have synaptics mouse also with nothing extra done to have touchpad work
ie: no synaptics installed
back in 0.6(wombat) i didnt have touch click on pad  but now i do
i forget when it started working

dell inspiron 5150
info from dmesg

Synaptics Touchpad, model: 1, fw: 5.9, id: 0x254ab1, caps: 0x804713/0x0
input: SynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPad on isa0060/serio1
ts: Compaq touchscreen protocol output

have tried diffrent kernels
i almost always go with kernel26-scsi

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#7 2005-10-18 21:45:11

henrysmith
Member
From: United Kingdom
Registered: 2005-09-01
Posts: 17

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

If you're just seeing this in 2006, skip this post, which I used to keep track of attempts for quite a while. The next one down is the one you care about.
No, I don't have seperate entries. Thing is, I don't want an entry for the USB mouse. I want to throw the damn thing away and use my touchpad smile. However, since it's a part of this mess now, I may as well try out your suggestion. It does sound promising.

Yeah, I've tried using the synaptics driver. One time I fixed X to get it to load even with synaptics loading as per pacman -S synaptics, but it didn't make my touchpad  work. I am pretty sure that the solution to all this is something to do with me fixing it to run as the synaptics driver. The reason I decided to try the forums though was that I've seen the touchpad work fine without synaptics (I'm using it now - xorg.conf is set to psaux and ps2)., and I was hoping there would be a more simple solution.

It seems that this isn't the case though. That's all the tech support I'll leech off you anyway (I really hate using forums like this). I've ascertained that I basically need to continue doing what I've been doing - tweaking away at the synaptics config

EDIT: thanks for the kernel suggestion. I'll try that too. (except that thanks to my terrible student halls connection (I show up as no-dns-yet in logs ffs), I can't even begin to download it tonight)

EDIT: Having seperate entries didn't fix it. Neither did the kernel. I've spent a good few hours playing with synaptics. Following the instructions to the letter breaks the x server (at startx i mean). Enough changes, e.g. taking out all the little options, reverts back to as if it wasn't even using synaptics. Given the strange dependency on what was plugged in at boot, I'm fairly convinced that it has something to do with hotplug.

**EDIT**
I have done a lot more digging:
things like
cat /dev/psaux
and all the other input devs only ever respond to the usb mouse. this is a problem that goes way deeper than the x server. gpm can't load the touchpad at all either.

[deleted lots of detective work narrowing issue to kernel/driver problem as opposed to hotplug. obvious really]

[deleted edit promising to try again at 0.7.1]

USB mouse during bootup
more detective work. if the usb mouse is plugged in until the end of the kernel messages and removed before the userspace boot process begins (udev), the touchpad works in x using imps2 as its driver, at /dev/input/mice. on the other hand, if I insert the usb mouse at that exact same interval, it having been unplugged while the kernel loads, no touchpad in x. I'm going to try a custom kernel.

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#8 2006-01-08 19:03:13

henrysmith
Member
From: United Kingdom
Registered: 2005-09-01
Posts: 17

Re: Touchpad - odd scenario [solved by noodle]

Upgrading to 0.7.1 more or less fixed this touchpad issue. I haven't configured it yet, so cursor movement is 100% relative to movement on the touchpad, instead of being clever and speed-dependant. I'll play around with xorg.conf some more and maybe make one last edit to this post if it works.

For the record, I have been paying attention like a good boy, checking out topics like this one as they come up:
http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?t=16278

hwd -xa

hwd put serial mouse, ps2 mouse, and usb mouse in my xorg.conf, so I can offer no conclusive "This is the right one for me" type phrase. Again, in what I vow will be my last edit to this topic, I may include further information on this if I fix it.

I hope I'm not annoying any forum nazis by bumping this by the way. I have no knowledge of forum etiquette and I'm just assuming that this is what you do if your problem gets fixed.

final edit:
pfft. xorg.conf doesn't seem to have any effect whatsoever.
let's forget about that for a moment though - after a year of on/off trying in slackware, arch has somehow given me direct rendering out of the box. i'm getting glxgears at 880 fps, which for this machine is a damn lot. huzzah!

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