The Official Unofficial 'Arch is Best' Thread

ewaller · 2013-03-18 22:26:35

Skyxer wrote:

I'm currently studying Computer Engineering, .... I'm also pretty scared of the new no installer arch version (last time I installed arch it had the GUI).

All we can say is try it. Or not. It seems odd, however, that a Computer Engineering student should be scared of a reasonably main stream distribution.

If you remain timid:
Try it in a VM.
Install it on the same machine alongside other OS's.

s1ln7m4s7r · 2013-03-18 22:28:25

This might sound a dumb question, but I have to ask it.

There are no dumb questions, just unknown answers. If you have a doubt nothing better than to ask for help.

I'm currently studying Computer Engineering, and for the past month, I've left all that is related to gaming and did a full migration to Linux.
Yes I do like to thinker with my computer, and modify everything until its exactly the way I want it, but maybe I'm doing it all wrong!

Then you are in the right place.

I've been using Ubuntu (Which was the first distro I've ever used) full time for the past month and it now feels that I've completely overcome the need to use Windows OS(finally!), I've tweaked it to my liking and stripped down any additional stuff that I would not or might not need that came bundled with the default Ubuntu install, and unity just felt right for the time being, but, as you all know, even though I have 8GB of ram on both my desktop and laptop computer, Ubuntu is quite memory hungry, and I actually prefer minimalist over pretty (I use Vim as my default code editor, or sublime depending on what I'm doing).

Yep, seems tike a future archer! :-)

I understand that Arch is bleeding edge, but, do I by using it am taking the risk of sitting in class one day and Arch stops me from using Eclipse, or even Java itself that would be some kind of setback? I'm also pretty scared of the new no installer arch version (last time I installed arch it had the GUI).

About updating, if you follow these topics https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=57205 you won't have a problem with it. And about the installation and setup, just read the wiki and it will all be ok!

Please help a Arch newbie find its way before even starting out, because I'm sure if I manage to get it running on my laptop again (I already tried Arch once and successfully installed GNOME 3 so I could test all my hardware).

If you search the wiki before doing something, you will probably find the answers, and there are always many users ready to help you. Just ask and you shall be answered!

Last edited by s1ln7m4s7r (2013-03-18 22:29:43)

Ashren · 2013-03-18 22:29:37

Since you are studying you will have plenty of time to break your installation and fix it again and you will get deeper into Linux along the way. I'd say go for it.

Do it because it is harder than Ubuntu. Doing hard stuff tends to keep the brain sharp.
Do it because you want control and freedom.

Remember to backup.
Read the front page news.
Read pacman output.
Don't do major upgrades before a class, except if it is a boring class.

Use LVM.

Last edited by Ashren (2013-03-18 22:30:08)

WonderWoofy · 2013-03-18 22:43:39

Just FYI, LVM has been kinda wonky for me lately. It was rock solid for a long time, but every now and again, the initramfs lvm2 hook fails to find my root partition. Of course this can be solved for the time being by simply doing vgscan and vgchange -ay, but I am just putting this here for full disclosure.

Arch Linux is a great distribution and has a seemingly knowledgeable and vast community. Being bleeding edge, things occasionally break, but for the most part (and most people) it is a solid stable distribution.

Oh and the thought of going back to a non-rolling release makes me cringe.

Xyne · 2013-03-18 22:58:29

Skyxer wrote:

I understand that Arch is bleeding edge, but, do I by using it am taking the risk of sitting in class one day and Arch stops me from using Eclipse, or even Java itself that would be some kind of setback? I'm also pretty scared of the new no installer arch version (last time I installed arch it had the GUI).

Arch doesn't automatically upgrade the system for you, so it won't just break out of nowhere. If you absolutely depend on the system, only upgrade when you have some time to sit down and deal with eventual issues. Breakage is very, very rare in my experience and a solution or at least a temporary workaround tends to show up quickly on the forum.

Always read the front page news before upgrading, and always read the Pacman output while upgrading. They will tell you when manual intervention is required or when something might break. For critical packages you can always wait a few days to see if any issues are reported on the bug tracker or forum. Some bugs are specific to combinations of hardware and/or software configuration so they don't show up in testing (Arch has testing repos for critical packages and big changes).

As for the installer, if you are afraid of that then Arch might not be right for you. You could always try it out in a virtual machine for a couple of week to get a feel for it before committing a partition to it.

WonderWoofy wrote:

Just FYI, LVM has been kinda wonky for me lately. It was rock solid for a long time, but every now and again, the initramfs lvm2 hook fails to find my root partition. Of course this can be solved for the time being by simply doing vgscan and vgchange -ay, but I am just putting this here for full disclosure.

LVM isn't wonky. The kernel and/or udev are/is wonky. No?

Last edited by Xyne (2013-03-18 23:01:16)

xacobe97 · 2013-03-18 23:23:02

Skyxer wrote:

(I use Vim as my default code editor,

10 points for you man
If you care about Java, Eclipse and that, you can tell Archlinux to not upgrade that packages, but upgrade the others

Skyxer wrote:

I'm also pretty scared of the new no installer arch version (last time I installed arch it had the GUI).

It's easy if you follow the steps.

Go on dude, you will enjoy this distro.

Skyxer · 2013-03-18 23:41:24

I would like to thank everyone for taking the time to answer and clarify the questions I've wrote, you guys even answered some questions that I didn't even ask, you truly helped me out so very much.

ewaller wrote:

Skyxer wrote:
I'm currently studying Computer Engineering, .... I'm also pretty scared of the new no installer arch version (last time I installed arch it had the GUI).
All we can say is try it. Or not. It seems odd, however, that a Computer Engineering student should be scared of a reasonably main stream distribution.
If you remain timid:
Try it in a VM.
Install it on the same machine alongside other OS's.

Well, it is still my first year (2nd semester) and by no means is Linux being thought or are we being informed in how it could be implemented in our current classes, but, I do it as a hobbie and I think it was a misexpression from my behalf, i'm not scared of it in any way (besides not having enough spare time for the install these couple of next two days), I'm just hesitant of being overwhelmed by all the new changes since my first time with arch (Including the implemention of systmed, i think thats the replacement of the previous rc file?). No timidness remaining, I shall go full-man-mode and go for a physical install or arch .

I will try arch in a VM first, just to see how smooth it goes. Then I'll delete all the data on my current linux partitions and I'll install on the existing file system (Which was previously formatted by me, not automatic in any way, so it will fit arch perfectly).

And, I might try LVM (Newb-alert: But i'll have learn what it is first).

Thank you again for all the replies, you really helped me make up my mind.

Last edited by Skyxer (2013-03-18 23:42:41)

jasonwryan · 2013-03-18 23:46:57

xacobe97 wrote:

If you care about Java, Eclipse and that, you can tell Archlinux to not upgrade that packages, but upgrade the others.

Please don't recommend that newcomers adopt bad habits. Partial upgrades are unsupported.

ngoonee · 2013-03-18 23:50:23

jasonwryan wrote:

xacobe97 wrote:
If you care about Java, Eclipse and that, you can tell Archlinux to not upgrade that packages, but upgrade the others.

Please don't recommend that newcomers adopt bad habits. Partial upgrades are unsupported.

Yes, the right way to handle that is to have separate installs of Eclipse (I did that throughout my PhD) and the rest. Eclipse is particularly easy to maintain outside your normal package management system.

Xyne · 2013-03-18 23:59:18

ngoonee wrote:

Yes, the right way to handle that is to have separate installs of Eclipse (I did that throughout my PhD) and the rest. Eclipse is particularly easy to maintain outside your normal package management system.

Yeah, just install it in a VM...

ANOKNUSA · 2013-03-19 03:13:35

s1ln7m4s7r wrote:

If you have a doubt nothing better than to ask for help.

This is dangerous (or at least ambiguous) advice. Mine has always been: If you have to ask the community if Arch is right for you, it probably isn't. Read the wiki, try it out, and see what you think. For what it's worth, I've been using Arch for a couple years, while going to school for both a bachelor's in history and web design/development certification; it's done me just fine so far.

andmars · 2013-03-19 08:19:12

hi, I too went to Ubuntu linux in 2008 and haven't felt the need for a Windows OS ever since. For me Arch feels very stable and I don't have to tinker with my system much. Every now and then you get a .pacnew file you have to look into but that doesn't happen very often. And if there are some major changes you always get the news on the front page of archlinux.org that tells you exactly what to do. These things won't break your system. The only one who can break your system really is you when you try to do stupid things with it :-)

Jason has written some nice posts about "bleeding edge" and "breakage" that I can't add much to it.

http://jasonwryan.com/blog/2012/07/19/breakage/

http://jasonwryan.com/blog/2012/06/16/misunderstanding/

as for the no-gui installer: I like it a lot better because you fully understand the install process after doing it this way. And there are good video tutorials on youtube you might want to watch first to get a feeling of what you have to do;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NQ12QJTqEY

or if you like a video from soviet-russia ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFvJ09LWwZA

Last edited by andmars (2013-03-19 08:26:51)

lord_rafa · 2013-03-19 10:43:21

In my opinion, even if you are a computer engineer student, Arch is not a good distribution for start in Linux. There a lot of concepts about Linux that you need to know and a lot of stuff that can fail (and a lot of solutions in the forum/wiki). I'm computer engineer and I have used Linux for a really long time but I still with doubts in Arch. In my opinion Ubuntu is the best for new users getting experience. Anyway if you want you can use VirtualBox to test Arch without format your computer and test by your self how much hard arch can be.

thesystematic · 2013-03-19 11:52:16

I'm pretty new to this forum, and I'm already seeing at least one post like this a week - read them if you're interested, but nothing is going to give you the same experience as trying it yourself. As mentioned above, dual boot or try in a VM first to get a taste and over time you'll use it more and you can make it your main distro.

If you want to learn about Linux, use Arch. Read the Arch Way, that will give you an idea of what it's all about. As for beginners trying Ubuntu - I agree and disagree. I think Ubuntu is different enough now that it is almost not 'Linux' enough to really give you a taste of the differences.

Just my two cents

satanselbow · 2013-03-19 13:02:06

andmars wrote:

as for the no-gui installer: I like it a lot better because you fully understand the install process after doing it this way. And there are good video tutorials on youtube you might want to watch first to get a feeling of what you have to do;

Youtube Arch install videos really aren't (generally) the best place to start... frequently out of date (there is a new ISO monthly with Arch) and omitting some pretty important initial configuration steps

Follow the Beginner's Guide and you'll be fine - it's what it is there for

Skyxer · 2013-03-19 13:03:51

Just to get things straight, I've never once said that I was a complete and utter newbie on the Linux scene.
I'm currently using Ubuntu due to the fact that it was a hassle-free setup for school usage purposes, I did not have time for anything else at the moment. Also, I prefer Debian over Ubuntu, and I feel that running Ubuntu at the moment is quite an overkill, besides being a hassle-free setup it come with to many stuff I just don't use.

I want a distro that is lightweight (A hobbie, I like tweaking linux and fixing it in my spare time), and something that overall can offer me stability when i need it.
Keep in mind that I've already installed arch before on my school laptop (It was very fun, and very rewarding) with GNOME3, but this time I'm going for something even more lightweight, like AwesomeWM for example.

Thank you for reading, and for all the great replies.

IsSuE · 2013-03-19 14:30:03

I don't get why everyone talks like Arch breaks on a daily basis. I have been running Arch for around six years now and never encountered a problem that was not fixed by reading the frontpage/wiki/forum.

Awebb · 2013-03-19 15:01:50

You should not use Arch, unless you can sense the Deep Resonance, even if not connected to the Matrix. Arch hosts are known to attract free or even wild sprites, which can be an issue for normal hackers (or even deckers!).

Inxsible · 2013-03-19 18:56:23

IsSuE wrote:

I don't get why everyone talks like Arch breaks on a daily basis. I have been running Arch for around six years now and never encountered a problem that was not fixed by reading the frontpage/wiki/forum.

**emphasis mine

exactly. problems do occur. breakages do occur, but the users need to have the wherewithal to deal with them.

MagicSkyFairy · 2013-03-19 19:53:33

The thing about linux is that most of the time it's you that broke it! Arch is pretty stable. Things will break sometimes during upgrades and whatnot, but usually you can either read the news page, find/ask a similar question on the forums, or read the wiki and you will usually find a solution. Any linux distro will have problems. Even with ubuntu, you might have to change a bunch of configurations just to get a program working. Sometimes you won't have any clues on why it's not working. These things are not specific to Arch.

What I do is to keep a small windows partition for school/windows only apps. You could also just keep an arch vm as a practice run.

So, if you want, download arch. It's not as difficult or unstable as many people might say.

triton60 · 2013-03-19 20:30:44

Over about 6 months I tried Fedora, SuSE, and finally Ubuntu. I wanted a rolling release and ended up using Arch (for nearly a year now I think ).

I have never had a breakage in Arch, as people have mentioned read the front page for news items and if you are worried an update might break your install wait a few hours to see if other people on the forum are having issues. I used to have an Arch VM I would update before I updated my main installation but I don't bother doing that any more.

Honestly, I had breakages on the other distros I tried and couldn't fix them easily for the simple fact they hide so much stuff from the user; it makes it hard to fix breakages, you learn so much while installing Arch you can fix it yourself if it were to break.

Andrew.

madr · 2013-04-26 13:34:42

It's the simplicity that captured my eye in the first place. And the fact that you're to some extent "forced" to use the terminal commands. You don't find that motivation in pure GUI distros, with pure GUI installs.

scjet · 2013-04-28 14:20:08

Although UbuntuStudio has fulfilled many of my multimedia needs in the past, and it's still good,
I've been slowly using Arch, more and more, for ALL of my multimedia purposes, video-editing, ..., again.

I even blew away my newer Windows 8 PC's, and installed Arch instead.
(Actually, because of Win8 I will NEVER use an Microsoft OS/Product again !)

Needless to say, I haven't been wrong in my choice of "Arch is Best"

http://www.linux.com/news/software/appl … ns-for-you

Last edited by scjet (2013-04-28 14:29:09)

caligula · 2013-05-01 08:36:11

Arch is Best!

It's been a month now since my arch installation.
I have used bunch of distros in the last 8 years, but somehow always came back to the *ubuntus.

All the recent shite with canonical has finally pushed me over the edge, and after searching the realms for a new home - I arrived at arch, and fell in love. It's exactly what I've always been looking for: simple. (Really) encouraging choice. Great documentation. Up-to-date. Rolling release.

So, Hi.

Daerun · 2013-05-10 13:59:52

Got my new PC three days ago: i7, Nvidia GTX660, etc... Installed Arch two days ago. Playing Portal on Steam right now. Yes, Arch is the best!

Arch Linux

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