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#276 2022-02-25 17:36:26

hoschi
Member
From: Ulm (Germany)
Registered: 2008-11-03
Posts: 441

Re: The IWD thread

Is it okay to use this thread?

According to IWD the wpa_supplicant daemon shouldn't run in parallel, which makes sense. So I've turned it off but it is still running:

● wpa_supplicant.service - WPA supplicant
     Loaded: loaded (/usr/lib/systemd/system/wpa_supplicant.service; disabled; vendor preset: disabled)
     Active: active (running) since Fri 2022-02-25 08:40:19 CET; 9h ago
   Main PID: 918 (wpa_supplicant)
      Tasks: 1 (limit: 18220)
     Memory: 3.3M
        CPU: 138ms
     CGroup: /system.slice/wpa_supplicant.service
             └─918 /usr/bin/wpa_supplicant -u

Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi systemd[1]: Starting WPA supplicant...
Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi systemd[1]: Started WPA supplicant.
Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi wpa_supplicant[918]: Successfully initialized wpa_supplicant

The parent has PID 1, it is Systemd. And Systemd seem to launch it because:

Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi systemd[1]: Started WPA supplicant.
Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi audit[1]: SERVICE_START pid=1 uid=0 auid=4294967295 ses=4294967295 msg='unit=wpa_supplicant comm="systemd" exe="/usr/lib/systemd/systemd" hostname=? addr=? terminal=? res=success'
Feb 25 08:40:19 hoschi wpa_supplicant[918]: Successfully initialized wpa_supplicant

IWD still works with exception of some weird reconnetions. But I think the authors of IWD are serious about not running wpa_supplicant in parallel. According to some findings on the web and here it is Geoclue causing the DBus-Activation. Am I right that the correct solution is neither `masking` wpa_supplicant nor using the special networkmanager-iwd from AUR. But requesting Geoclue to stop that and just activing NetworkManager or whatever?

I'm surprised that our Wiki doesn't mention this issue.
Thank you


// edit
I've created an upstream issue.

Last edited by hoschi (2022-02-25 18:04:25)

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#277 2022-03-01 11:54:25

glitsj16
Member
Registered: 2015-04-26
Posts: 108

Re: The IWD thread

hoschi wrote:

Am I right that the correct solution is neither `masking` wpa_supplicant nor using the special networkmanager-iwd from AUR. But requesting Geoclue to stop that and just activing NetworkManager or whatever?

I've been using IWD with NetworkManager for quite a while and uninstalled wpa_supplicant. That completely avoids ever running wpa_supplicant in parallel with IWD. Due to iwd being an optdepends of networkmanager this all works out very well. In such a setup there's no need for masking or anything else. Have you considered removing wpa_supplicant yet?

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#278 2022-05-01 22:23:42

Cvlc
Member
Registered: 2020-03-26
Posts: 182

Re: The IWD thread

Hi

I've been using IWD with NetworkManager for quite a while and uninstalled wpa_supplicant

How did you manage that ?

$ pacman -Qi iwd && sudo pacman -Rsn wpa_supplicant 

Name            : iwd
Version         : 1.27-1
Description     : Internet Wireless Daemon
Architecture    : x86_64
URL             : https://git.kernel.org/cgit/network/wireless/iwd.git/
Licenses        : LGPL
Groups          : None
Provides        : None
Depends On      : glibc  readline  libreadline.so=8-64  ell
Optional Deps   : None
Required By     : None
Optional For    : networkmanager
Conflicts With  : None
Replaces        : None
Installed Size  : 1918.02 KiB
Packager        : Andreas Radke <andyrtr@archlinux.org>
Build Date      : Thu Apr 21 20:47:13 2022
Install Date    : Sat Apr 23 18:01:09 2022
Install Reason  : Explicitly installed
Install Script  : Yes
Validated By    : Signature

checking dependencies...
error: failed to prepare transaction (could not satisfy dependencies)
:: removing wpa_supplicant breaks dependency 'wpa_supplicant' required by networkmanager

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#279 2022-05-01 23:07:17

glitsj16
Member
Registered: 2015-04-26
Posts: 108

Re: The IWD thread

Cvlc wrote:

How did you manage that ?

When using iwd as the Wi-Fi backend for NM and only needing wpa_supplicant for calculation of the PreSharedKey one can safely use wpa-psk from the AUR as a wpa_supplicant drop-in. Download its snapshot, add

provides=('wpa_supplicant')
conflicts=('wpa_supplicant')

to the PKGBUILD and build/install via regular makepkg routine. After doing so you can uninstall wpa_supplicant.

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#280 2022-05-02 00:32:46

Trilby
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Registered: 2011-11-29
Posts: 26,865
Website

Re: The IWD thread

Except that package does not provide wpa_supplicant.  You could acheive the same by just forcing pacman to break dependencies (e.g., w/ -d flag(s)), and this would not require using a "package" for something that is essentially a single line of python code.


"UNIX is simple and coherent..." - Dennis Ritchie, "GNU's Not UNIX" -  Richard Stallman

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#281 2022-05-04 11:30:39

Cvlc
Member
Registered: 2020-03-26
Posts: 182

Re: The IWD thread

Thanks. Will the dependency on wpa_supplicant eventually be dropped to avoid such hacks ?

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#282 2022-05-17 14:00:12

olly
Member
From: South West England
Registered: 2017-08-22
Posts: 38

Re: The IWD thread

Hi,
I'm having a problem with iwd and wonder if anyone has had similar.

If a stored profile has its AutoConnect value set to 'true', then iwd will try to connect it if it detects the SSID is broadcast. However, if the connection fails, iwd will repeatedly try to connect and fail over and over again, which ends up blocking the whole network system. Everything else in iwd fails.

Last edited by olly (2022-05-17 18:04:39)


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#283 2022-05-21 10:23:04

hoschi
Member
From: Ulm (Germany)
Registered: 2008-11-03
Posts: 441

Re: The IWD thread

Thanks for your responses.

Cvlc wrote:

Thanks. Will the dependency on wpa_supplicant eventually be dropped to avoid such hacks ?

Same question from me. Simpler to use correctly? Possibly making both iwd and wpa_supplicant optdepends?

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#284 2022-05-21 10:59:03

bjo
Member
Registered: 2011-09-10
Posts: 74

Re: The IWD thread

Please take a look at the discusssion here: https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/5972

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#285 2022-06-07 08:24:20

mystiquewolf
Member
Registered: 2021-10-25
Posts: 16

Re: The IWD thread

hoschi wrote:

Thanks for your responses.

Cvlc wrote:

Thanks. Will the dependency on wpa_supplicant eventually be dropped to avoid such hacks ?

Same question from me. Simpler to use correctly? Possibly making both iwd and wpa_supplicant optdepends?

Why don’t make both wpa_supplicant and iwd to provide the same thing, for example wireless-daemon, and networkmanager requiring that wireless-daemon?

Last edited by mystiquewolf (2022-06-07 08:25:29)


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#286 2022-06-07 12:12:59

Trilby
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Registered: 2011-11-29
Posts: 26,865
Website

Re: The IWD thread

They don't provide the same thing, unless that same thing is arbitrary-requirement-of-networkmanager.  wpa_supplicant never should have been a hard dependency for networkmanager.  NM can be used with no wireless at all - if someone has no wireless interfaces on their system but still wants to use NM, why should they install either wpa_supplicant or iwd?

NM depends on wpa_supplicant because of an arbitrary preference of either a NM dev or of the arch packager.


"UNIX is simple and coherent..." - Dennis Ritchie, "GNU's Not UNIX" -  Richard Stallman

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#287 2022-06-13 06:01:39

Mr Green
Forum Fellow
From: U.K.
Registered: 2003-12-21
Posts: 5,859

Re: The IWD thread

Have started using iwd on my laptop and found it very easy to use (following wiki guide). From time to time I do plug in a wired connection to boost download speeds. I know that when running NetworkManager you have to disable things like dhcp as it handles this itself.

My thinking is to remove NetworkManager and applet and use iwd for wireless connections, but need a simple way to handle wired ones. Tempted to try the udev rule that comes with arch media or is there a better way to check connection type?


Mr Green

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#288 2022-06-13 14:49:01

Moo-Crumpus
Member
From: Hessen / Germany
Registered: 2003-12-01
Posts: 1,477

Re: The IWD thread

depending on your environment. I only use systemd for wired network. systemd-networkd, systemd-resolved, iwd work pretty well together. You may even bond wired and wireless, if you want to.


Frumpus addict
[mu'.krum.pus], [frum.pus]

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#289 2022-06-15 07:34:25

Mr Green
Forum Fellow
From: U.K.
Registered: 2003-12-21
Posts: 5,859

Re: The IWD thread

I have used systemd-resolved as part of iwd configuration, was simply concerned about clash of services as mentioned on wiki page.

Thank you for your help ;-)


Mr Green

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#290 2022-06-16 20:19:37

jprestwo
Member
Registered: 2022-01-06
Posts: 17

Re: The IWD thread

Trilby wrote:

They don't provide the same thing, unless that same thing is arbitrary-requirement-of-networkmanager.  wpa_supplicant never should have been a hard dependency for networkmanager.  NM can be used with no wireless at all - if someone has no wireless interfaces on their system but still wants to use NM, why should they install either wpa_supplicant or iwd?

NM depends on wpa_supplicant because of an arbitrary preference of either a NM dev or of the arch packager.

Actually AFAIK the only reason its a dependency is because of wired authentication. And wpa_supplicant is the only game in town, except IWD's own Ethernet Authentication Daemon (EAD) which isn't quite read for prime time yet in terms of NM support.

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#291 2022-06-16 20:43:03

Trilby
Inspector Parrot
Registered: 2011-11-29
Posts: 26,865
Website

Re: The IWD thread

jprestwo wrote:

Actually AFAIK the only reason its a dependency is because of wired authentication.

Fair point.  But not all NM users would require wired authentication - that's a pretty rare use case, and exactly the type of thing optional dependencies are for.


"UNIX is simple and coherent..." - Dennis Ritchie, "GNU's Not UNIX" -  Richard Stallman

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#292 2022-06-21 15:39:03

jprestwo
Member
Registered: 2022-01-06
Posts: 17

Re: The IWD thread

Trilby wrote:
jprestwo wrote:

Actually AFAIK the only reason its a dependency is because of wired authentication.

Fair point.  But not all NM users would require wired authentication - that's a pretty rare use case, and exactly the type of thing optional dependencies are for.

Oh you're preaching to the choir here. I agree, its a rare use case and really should be opt-in. Especially since it requires users to manually configure their credentials anyways.

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