[SOLVED] Considering Arch Linux

Gregory_M · 2024-12-01 00:34:06

Hi, I'm not new to Linux, but am considering Arch.

(Disambiguation: Here, I'm using DM to refer to Display Manager and
WM to refer to Window Manager / Compositor [e.g. OpenBox, labwc, sway])

Here are some of the things that I am seeking:

systemd-boot
Clean and configurable e.g. DMs, WMs, themes, lightweight desktop
Understandable (at a basic level) boot process from boot to DM/WM
Ability to install latest versions of clang, gcc, rust etc.
Up-to-date and available documentation (or links to it)
WiFi support a plus
Simple package management (does Arch use package repositories?)
Not strictly tied to or dependent upon a particular heavyweight shell, e.g. "bash"
A community that agrees with much of this list

Regarding #3: What starts what? E.g. what starts the DM?, ...what starts X or the Wayland Compositor?
Can we have a menu to use OpenBox (X11) one session then use sway (or labwc) Wayland for another
session? The ability to control and understand these processes is helpful. I say basic level, because I
don't need in depth information about each part of the boot, I simply like to know how the various
pieces are connected. E.g. What starts up the Display Manager, etc.?

Regarding #4: For example, if the system uses a particular version of gcc, I would like to be able to install
a newer version of gcc. But installation alongside the system default is fine, not seeking to update the
system version if the system requires a specific version. Perhaps Arch has a better approach to this, such
that this concern (#4) is N/A.

Regarding #5: The documentation for my current distribution on the distribution's website is incomplete and out-of-date.
I'm technical but I prefer not to spend time scrounging around for basic information. Even links to information is fine.

Regarding #6: I downloaded and installed custom driver for LinkSys (6300 V1, not V2).
Performed routine system update, and WiFi stopped working.
I expect to be able to get it working again but I prefer not to spend time chasing side issues like this.

Regarding #8: Not critical, but I use zsh for interactive shell, and I think that a lightweight system shell
(e.g. non-interactive, boot process, etc.) is good.

I produce a web server software product, so an environment for the development tools is key.

Excited to have found Arch because it may be the right distribution for me.
Thanks Kindly!

Last edited by Gregory_M (Today 09:57:11)

Allan · 2024-12-01 01:16:23

All are possible if not the default.

dakota · 2024-12-01 01:53:44

Welcome,

Gregory_M wrote:

3. Understandable (at a basic level) boot process from boot to DM/WM

Arch Boot Process

Answers for all your questions are available in the Wiki, but individual pages can contain hundreds of links. If you are hitting something totally new, it can takes days to read through all the material. That's both good and bad, obviously.

Cheers,

Last edited by dakota (2024-12-01 01:55:41)

Gregory_M · 2024-12-01 02:02:54

Thanks! The key is up-to-date and available.

I like customizability/understandability to save time and focus on my work and not my distribution. At the same time though, I don't like bloated desktop environments that pamper but also hide everything, so I use OpenBox and also am interested in labwc and sway. Are those popular here?

ewaller · 2024-12-01 02:24:07

Gregory_M wrote:

Thanks! The key is up-to-date and available.
I like customizability/understandability to save time and focus on my work and not my distribution. At the same time though, I don't like bloated desktop environments that pamper but also hide everything, so I use OpenBox and also am interested in labwc and sway. Are those popular here?

First, congratulations on getting a response from Allan on with your first post; that is an honor.

The only other Distro with more flexibility than Arch is Gentoo. Neither are for those who are unwilling to study and learn, I think you will do just fine.

Gregory_M · 2024-12-01 02:55:13

Perfect.

...congratulations on getting a response from Allan...

Yes, I observed that. I was still absorbing a few additional details information before answering.
I recently migrated from Windows, and when looking into mingw for clang and gcc, I was informed to use pacman (Msys2), so it's even used outside of Arch which speaks for pacman.

Last edited by Gregory_M (Today 06:30:12)

Gregory_M · 2024-12-01 02:57:19

Thank you kindly @Allan, @ewaller, and @dakota! I plan to install Arch.

Gregory_M · Yesterday 09:04:11

I have installed Arch. One note, the efi entry pointed to by loader.conf needed to use UUID not PARTUUID for the "root=..." kernel param. The sample entry file shows PARTUUID. The boot process failed with "...New_Root... can't find ..." until I changed to use the UUID. (For PARTUUID, I was using the partition UUID so it wasn't a matter of mismatch with ID value vs ID type. Rather the kernel may use the UUID arg by design. This may be for logical reasons because the kernel may not be interested in the partition because it simply wants to mount the file system and the partition is side information.)

I'm grateful for such a well documented system. I learned so much about the boot process during my new installation! BIOS (UEFI) loads systemd (bootloader) which loads the kernel and passes any args in loader entry file to kernel. Purposely noting this for reference for myself and any others who go through "boot camp". Pun not intended but I see it's humorous so that's fine.

In my OP I referred to seeking to know what starts what and now I can see that your process provides that kind of information very well!

Next, can anyone recommend a lightweight window manager (preferably Wayland)?

Excited to be working with my Arch system! Thanks again!!

Last edited by Gregory_M (Yesterday 22:15:21)

jl2 · Yesterday 10:32:08

Next, can anyone recommend a lightweight window manager (preferably Wayland)?

If you want tiling I recommend sway (or hyprland for animations), otherwise wayfire (has some nice animations, pretty sure you can disable them). see https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Wayland#Compositors for a list.

How many tries did you need to install? I forgot the bootloader on my first attempt

edit: And see the hyprland wiki and the sway wiki for some nice software list like bars, notification daemons, wallpaper daemons etc.

Last edited by jl2 (Yesterday 10:36:51)

Gregory_M · Yesterday 20:45:40

jl2 wrote:

If you want tiling I recommend sway....

Thank you, I've also learned of labwc (Wayland OpenBox replacement).

Do you like tiling WM? I don't mind less use of mouse but I haven't tried tiling yet.

jl2 wrote:

How many tries did you need to install?

Many reboots and double checks. At one point, I realized that I hadn't done the arch-chroot step, must have missed it in the 3am fog. It was one of those situations where I was excited and passing out at the same time.

I also used /efi instead of /boot and it was fine. I don't even know why the filesystem mount point matters much because I think the UEFI BIOS finds the EFI partition and the bootloader runs in the context of that partition. The /boot vs /efi directory only comes into play later after the kernel starts, I imagine.

By the way, the efi partition has initramfs... and vmlinuz.... images. Is the vmlinuz... file the actual Linux kernel? (The BOOTX64.EFI file is the bootloader, I think).

Last edited by Gregory_M (Yesterday 22:58:19)

jl2 · Today 07:12:35

Do you like tiling WM? I don't mind less use of mouse but I haven't tried tiling yet.

I prefer it, if you don't mind scarcely seeing the wallpaper, having all the windows visible at once and the extensive use of workspaces is quite nice. I still quite often use the mouse, so ...

I also used /efi instead of /boot and it was fine. I don't even know why the filesystem mount point matters much because I think the UEFI BIOS finds the EFI partition and the bootloader runs in the context of that partition. The /boot vs /efi directory only comes into play later after the kernel starts, I imagine.

It doesn't really matter, you can put it anywhere you want. Arch linux just puts the kernel stuff in /boot, this one has to exist. it doesn't matter if the ESP is there or somewhere else, I personally prefer it in /boot/efi to keep the files out of the ESP because it's not the biggest.

By the way, the efi partition has initramfs... and vmlinuz.... images. Is the vmlinuz... file the actual Linux kernel? (The BOOTX64.EFI file is the bootloader, I think).

The vmlinuz image is the kernel, but the initramfs is what UEFI/BIOS starts. ESP/EFI/BOOT/BOOTX64.EFI is the fallback bootloader, this one is used if there is no valid UEFI variable that defines it somewhere else. There should be a file called ESP/EFI/[grub/systemd/whateverbootloader]/somefile.efi that will be the actual bootloader. You can read the UEFI variables with efibootmgr, it should point to there.

Gregory_M · Today 09:11:13

OK. Thanks kindly!

I'm seeing that sway must be in another non-default section of pacman but I do see other window managers. Interesting when I was searching for groups, some weren't found but then I noticed that 'Sgg' pulled groups down, then the searches for particular groups that weren't found, worked. I.e. 'gg' appears to be the way to fetch all groups and is needed before group search.

Last edited by Gregory_M (Today 09:29:09)

jl2 · Today 09:24:02

no?

groups are multiple packages that can be downloaded by only downloading the group's name.
however, you're searching for local/already installed groups, try pacman -Sgg instead.
For searching packages in the repos use pacman -Ss search_words.

you may be interested in the pacman's wiki page and the AURs page.

Last edited by jl2 (Today 09:27:08)

Gregory_M · Today 09:30:36

Yes, meant Sgg, sorry.

I see sway now

pacman -Ss sway

Last edited by Gregory_M (Today 09:45:35)

V1del · Today 09:45:51

How are you "not seeing it", which command exactly? What do you get from

pacman -Si sway

?

Also generally speaking omnibus threads are discouraged, if you're now past the consideration, consider marking as [SOLVED] by editing the title in your first post and creating new topics for new problems as they arise.

Gregory_M · Today 09:55:23

Hi, thank you, yes I had already updated my post.

Last edited by Gregory_M (Today 09:58:04)

Gregory_M · Today 10:03:56

PS, I did realize that we were covering different topics and I was about to wind this down. I thought that you might not mind a few "fresh install, next steps" questions from a very first time user. But again, I understood that even that is only logical to a point and I realized that we had reached that point.

jl2 · Today 10:18:54

no, we can keep it here. After all the title isn't that far off for advice.

BTW I expect you already saw this, but anyway https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Genera … mendations

Arch Linux

#1 2024-12-01 00:34:06

[SOLVED] Considering Arch Linux

#2 2024-12-01 01:16:23

Re: [SOLVED] Considering Arch Linux

#3 2024-12-01 01:53:44

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