[SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

TooOldForDeInterwebz · 2025-08-14 17:29:21

I was looking at what some distros do with arch to see what they add that makes them 'special'.

One of the things, google bbr, yielded the thoughts "why is this allowed to exist?" and "that's why it's not an official product".

What brought me there was fairness. However the first mention was from 2018, and the last one a paper from 2024 suggesting something that could be tried to make bbr fair.

The impression I have is that it's not talked about much and if it wasn't for the sources, I'd have thought it's something from a tinfoil hat post.

Would everyone enabling this on their desktops not wreak havoc on the internet? Or has the code actually been adapted to tackle the problem.

I had to look up both bbr and Cubic and don't know enough to look at what's on github to answer the question myself.

Last edited by TooOldForDeInterwebz (2025-08-15 14:07:40)

seth · 2025-08-14 19:26:20

For context, the OP is talking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TCP_conge … ol#TCP_BBR which is entirely not archlinux specific and idk what the question is here either.

TooOldForDeInterwebz · 2025-08-14 20:34:45

On the arch wiki I could only find info on enabling it.

If it does behave as described, from my experience with the wiki so far, I'd have expected a hint like there is for the fact that it's not an official google product.

I should go elsewhere with the topic as it generic Linux networking.

seth · 2025-08-14 20:43:13

https:/deepl.com/ ?
I don't even know what you're asking/trying to achieve.
You can enable BBR (on every linux), https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Sysctl#Enable_BBR

You mean the wiki should address the objections about the method?
It links the wikipedia article that addresses this...

TooOldForDeInterwebz · 2025-08-14 21:40:38

seth wrote:

https:/deepl.com/ ?

haha. Good one.

I found all other sources to be inconclusive as to the current state.

As mentioned in my previous comment, I agree that this is not the correct place.

sudo mv $post ~/viewforum/48

TooOldForDeInterwebz · 2025-08-15 13:22:10

I have a new syntax converter:

Dear seth, please move this post to a more appropriate section of the forum.

After further reading I think this topic warrants more attention than it is given. In summary BBRv3 has not made things better:

Promises and Potential of BBRv3(summary) (Full paper here)

Kindly accept my apologies in advance for the extra moderation work.

Whoracle · 2025-08-15 13:30:27

Can you, in as simple as possible, term state what exactly you are after?

Are you looking for general discussion about BRR?
Do you have a specific technical issue with it?

What's your goal here?

seth · 2025-08-15 13:45:29

If you want this to be moved to TGN you'd report the thread, but I don't think the chosen board is inappropriate and unless it's even clear what you're trying to achieve here I will not just report your thread.

· If you think the wiki should™ not reference/explain BBR or should stress more that it's not uncontended, you'd have to open a discussion on that wiki page.
· If you see BBR supported to be completely disabled in the arch kernels, you'd have to file a bug, https://archlinux.org/packages/core/x86_64/linux/ but I don't think that's gonna happen.
· If you think linux should™ not support BBR at all you'd have to submit a patch to lkml.
· If you think google should™ not be using BBR by default on its services, you'll have to take that to google.
· If you want to discuss the moral and ethical aspects of BBR you'd likely best talk to some philosopher (and indeed maybe on TGN ) - but if more advanced routers and bridges detect a segment to be a constant source of trouble, they'll typically (hopefully) just quota them.
If it would be that easy to collapse the internet, there would be no internet.

TooOldForDeInterwebz · 2025-08-15 14:06:43

TooOldForDeInterwebz wrote:

... What brought me there was fairness. ...

seth wrote:

... If you want to discuss the moral and ethical aspects of BBR...

Internet won't collapse. People need to decide for themselves what tools they use to make their own lives better.

Arch Linux

#1 2025-08-14 17:29:21

[SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#2 2025-08-14 19:26:20

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#3 2025-08-14 20:34:45

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#4 2025-08-14 20:43:13

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#5 2025-08-14 21:40:38

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#6 2025-08-15 13:22:10

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#7 2025-08-15 13:30:27

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#8 2025-08-15 13:45:29

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

#9 2025-08-15 14:06:43

Re: [SOLVED] google bbr - fairness

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