Restriction while using the Search form

ss2 · 2010-09-19 16:59:31

Hi there,

there is something I would like to point out when searching the forums:

Info
At least 30 seconds have to pass between searches. Please wait a while and try searching again.

This happens when searching immediately rather than waiting for 30 seconds.

Right, this is a restriction telling me, that I've got to wait another 30 seconds before I can do another search. Personally, this actually happens quite often that I stumble in to this time penalty. Especially when I'm looking for information which sometimes results into zero results.

That is quite annoying. I accept this restriction for non registered users of this forum, but is this necessary to have this for members?

This was once pointed out in this thread about the introduction of the new version.

Would an admin like to change this? Any objections?

I guess that this site doesn't have such a high output on search queries as well. ;-)

Simon

karol · 2010-09-19 17:05:18

Use google:

[karol@black ~]$ type bbs
bbs is a function
bbs () 
{ 
    ${BROWSER} "http://www.google.pl/search?q=site%3Abbs.archlinux.org $*"
}

ewaller · 2010-09-19 17:05:43

I have to agree. Maybe a compromise in which 0 result searches are not subject to the time out.

Whenever I encounter this, I usually switch over to Google and include site:archlinux.org in my search terms.

jt512 · 2010-09-19 20:45:37

This "feature" is indeed annoying.

karol · 2010-09-19 21:11:32

jt512 wrote:

This "feature" is indeed annoying.

I haven't been active on many forums, so my knowledge is limited, but it looks like it's a standard "antiflood" feature. I've just got bitten by it on another forum and the timeout is set to 120 seconds.

ss2 · 2010-09-19 21:41:32

Thanks for the recommendations to use Google. But why when the site offers its own to use? And anyway, this all goes over https, so I see especially here no reason to out-source the search engine.

karol wrote:

jt512 wrote:
This "feature" is indeed annoying.
I haven't been active on many forums, so my knowledge is limited, but it looks like it's a standard "antiflood" feature. I've just got bitten by it on another forum and the timeout is set to 120 seconds.

I doubt it that this forum suffers from an enormous number of search queries. Arch hasn't got such a large community, luckily. :-)

Anyway, this "feature" was never there until the last big update of this forum. And there doesn't seem to be a reason to have it too.

codycarey · 2010-09-19 21:47:57

ss2 wrote:

Thanks for the recommendations to use Google. But why when the site offers its own to use? And anyway, this all goes over https, so I see especially here no reason to out-source the search engine.

https://www.google.com

ss2 wrote:

Anyway, this "feature" was never there until the last big update of this forum. And there doesn't seem to be a reason to have it too.

I imagine it's one of Pierre's methods of fending off spam.

Inxsible · 2010-09-19 22:02:16

The said feature was there even in the old 1.2 version. I think it is needed to prevent spurious searches which keep banging the arch servers.

And in all honesty, google is probably a better bet to give you what you need. Sometimes I can't even find my own posts even after entering the correct key words. Use google's "site: " feature and you will probably get better results. They are after all a search engine.

karol · 2010-09-19 22:09:02

Inxsible wrote:

The said feature was there even in the old 1.2 version. I think it is needed to prevent spurious searches which keep banging the arch servers.
And in all honesty, google is probably a better bet to give you what you need. Sometimes I can't even find my own posts even after entering the correct key words. Use google's "site: " feature and you will probably get better results. They are after all a search engine.

And I think forum search lacks the advanced features like those in the flyspray bugtracker or in Google e.g. show only the hits from the last week.
IIRC, if there are to many hits, the forum search will return 0 while Google will show you "About 130,000 results (0.20 seconds)".

ss2 · 2010-09-19 22:37:25

Inxsible wrote:

The said feature was there even in the old 1.2 version. I think it is needed to prevent spurious searches which keep banging the arch servers.

Oh well, that explains the need then. I actually didn't even notice this in 1.2..

Inxsible wrote:

And in all honesty, google is probably a better bet to give you what you need. Sometimes I can't even find my own posts even after entering the correct key words. Use google's "site: " feature and you will probably get better results. They are after all a search engine.

True, I've noticed sometimes how difficult it can be to look for what I need. But generally I noticed, that most of the times I search this forum for bugs in programs I use and have problems with. Therefore I usually don't need the old posts (in most cases).
Will give it a try with Google though.

cb474 · 2010-09-20 07:41:28

Inxsible wrote:

The said feature was there even in the old 1.2 version. I think it is needed to prevent spurious searches which keep banging the arch servers.

Do the Arch servers really get overloaded this way? I use much more heavily trafficked forums that do not force registered users into time delays on repeated searches. Maybe I'm wrong about the load on the Arch servers, but the 30 second delay just seems like overkill for registered users.

Last edited by cb474 (2010-09-20 07:41:55)

karol · 2010-09-20 11:12:28

Total number of registered users: 36,259

I'm sure if everyone starts searching it *can* generate quite a load.

Pierre · 2010-09-20 11:20:39

The fluxbb search is quite inefficient. It could probably used to dos the server with just a few users.

cb474 · 2010-09-20 19:04:04

karol wrote:

Total number of registered users: 36,259
I'm sure if everyone starts searching it *can* generate quite a load.

Pierre wrote:

The fluxbb search is quite inefficient. It could probably used to dos the server with just a few users.

It seems like people are just speculating here.

And for me what you speculate is contradicted by my actual experience, which is that much more heavily trafficked forums do not impose a thirty second wait period on registered users. Others above in this thread have observed the same thing. So, without actual information as opposed to pure speculation, I'm still very skeptical that the wait period is necessary.

Pierre · 2010-09-20 19:08:16

While the 30s delay might be a little too high I am not speculating. I know very well what I am talking about.

Inxsible · 2010-09-20 19:08:46

This is not going anywhere.

Pierre has stated the reasons. and things are not likely to change anytime soon.

cb474, you are welcome to provide patches and or updates to the FluxBB code. Once FluxBB accepts those changes, we here at Arch will too. Arch devs are not interested in adding functionalities to FluxBB since it becomes a hassle during upgrades.

toofishes · 2010-09-20 19:10:48

cb474 wrote:

karol wrote:
Total number of registered users: 36,259
I'm sure if everyone starts searching it *can* generate quite a load.
Pierre wrote:
The fluxbb search is quite inefficient. It could probably used to dos the server with just a few users.
It seems like people are just speculating here.
And for me what you speculate is contradicted by my actual experience, which is that much more heavily trafficked forums do not impose a thirty second wait period on registered users. Others above in this thread have observed the same thing. So, without actual information as opposed to pure speculation, I'm still very skeptical that the wait period is necessary.

Considering Pierre is the maintainer, he is probably not speculating. And as you are a user on more heavily trafficked forums, I'm sure you know their server configuration like the back of your hand.

We have one server running about 6 web applications, so we have no desire to improve searching on the forums at the expense of the rest of these apps, especially when Google/Bing/Yahoo will all serve your purpose just fine.

Arch Linux

#1 2010-09-19 16:59:31

Restriction while using the Search form

#2 2010-09-19 17:05:18

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#3 2010-09-19 17:05:43

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#4 2010-09-19 20:45:37

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#5 2010-09-19 21:11:32

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#6 2010-09-19 21:41:32

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#7 2010-09-19 21:47:57

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#8 2010-09-19 22:02:16

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#9 2010-09-19 22:09:02

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#10 2010-09-19 22:37:25

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#11 2010-09-20 07:41:28

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#12 2010-09-20 11:12:28

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#13 2010-09-20 11:20:39

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#14 2010-09-20 19:04:04

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#15 2010-09-20 19:08:16

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#16 2010-09-20 19:08:46

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

#17 2010-09-20 19:10:48

Re: Restriction while using the Search form

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